Buettner vs. Fulton

[Gus22]

I'm amazed Sheens opted to go with a hack like Buettner rather than giving Fulton - a kid loaded with potential, a go against the Dragons last week. I'm not suggesting having Fulton in rather than Buettner would have changed last weeks result.

Nothing personal against Buettner but I hope we've seen the last of him in the top grade. I give him credit for persisting & enduring a long rehabilitation to come back. He also gets credit for the development work he does for the club & in the community, but lets be realistic about his playing abilities.

The days are long gone when Buettner warranted selection in any first grade team. At the moment a bench spot in PL is where he should be. Wests Tigers will struggle to win any game in which Buettner is considered one of our best 17.

Time to give the next generation more game time.

 

[Tigerpete]

I personally think Buettner at least deserves a chance to prove himself again. Last season he was one of the bigger fishies in our team, now he's surrounded by a lot more talent and its common knowledge that a player can look a lot better when he's got better players around him.

Maybe he has had it? but please, i think he deserves a couple of games before we bag him off into the scrap heap.

 

[Gus22]

Maybe he has had it? but please, i think he deserves a couple of games before we s**g him off into the scrap heap.

Not at the expense of a young up & comer like Fulton. Let him set the world on fire in PL & then consider him for first grade. I doubt that will happen however.

 

[innsaneink]

I personally think Buettner at least deserves a chance to prove himself again. Last season he was one of the bigger fishies in our team, now he's surrounded by a lot more talent and its common knowledge that a player can look a lot better when he's got better players around him.

Maybe he has had it? but please, i think he deserves a couple of games before we s**g him off into the scrap heap.

Yeah bloody hell....the guys worked hard for over a year rehabbing from an experimental knee op....and hes had so far what ?? One, two PL games and half a 1sts game....give him a chance first.

 

[Tigerpete]

Yeah, im of the opinion that sheens is reluctant to start the likes of Harrison and Fulton for now. Its certainly the safer option, being able to put them in the game when sheens likes, and not risk putting them in the deep end and possibly shattering their confidence. That said though, Harrison and Fulton are certainly knocking on the doors of the starting 13 and it wont be long before they get an opportunity.

There's also the "horses for courses" routine, i don know if Liam could've sustained the onslaught of the dragons for an entire game, considering lock is one position you try get an 80min player in. Regardless of how the game went on sunday, it was alway s going to be extremely physical up front and perhaps that may be the biggest reason to why graham was chosen , after all he has been there and done this many times before, although on sunday you wouldn't guess he had.

 

[Gus22]

I personally think Buettner at least deserves a chance to prove himself again. Last season he was one of the bigger fishies in our team, now he's surrounded by a lot more talent and its common knowledge that a player can look a lot better when he's got better players around him.

Maybe he has had it? but please, i think he deserves a couple of games before we s**g him off into the scrap heap.

Yeah bloody hell....the guys worked hard for over a year rehabbing from an experimental knee op....and hes had so far what ?? One, two PL games and half a 1sts game....give him a chance first.

That's the point. He's had two (by all accounts) ordinary PL games in 12 months. The previous year he showed very little, albiet in a struggling first grade team, & then he replaces Fulton on the bench. Fulton has shown great promise on the handful of occasions he's tasted first grade & has been a standout in PL for some time. Sorry but no way Buettner should be there in front of Fulton.

 

[Tigerpete]

horses for courses maybe.

 

[brook]

Yeah, im of the opinion that sheens is reluctant to start the likes of Harrison and Fulton for now. Its certainly the safer option, being able to put them in the game when sheens likes, and not risk putting them in the deep end and possibly shattering their confidence. That said though, Harrison and Fulton are certainly knocking on the doors of the starting 13 and it wont be long before they get an opportunity.

I've got to say I'm happy with the way Sheens has introduced Bronson

He's been slowly getting more game time as his confidence has risen and his game is improving along with it - his last two games have easily been his best in first grade.

I'd like to see him get a full game at some point reasonably soon - just to see how he handles it because he's now at the point where I think he'd manage ok.

 

[Tigerpete]

no disrespect to the opposition but i can see Bronson or Liam for that matter getting a start against the lower sides such as Manly, Souths and the Cowboys. Obviously the intensity and pressure levels in these games wont even compare to the barrage we were under on the weekend. We were down what by 40 odd and Bronson was having a real go out there, it was good to see he hadnt dropped his head.

 

[Gus22]

horses for courses maybe.

In 2004, Fulton vs Buettner = Phar Lap vs Radish

 

[Tigerpete]

lol, yeah see your point, im just thinking Sheens may well've thought he should've got more value in 80 mins by playing Graham of Buettner over Fulton, as it turns out in Graham's case , that was sadly wrong, in Buettner's case, im thinking it was more a sign that Mick will be used in a more important role as the season goes on so he thought it better to play him for sunday anyways.

Buettner and Wilson seemed to rotate between centre and 5/8, so obviously sheens has plans that involve buettner at 5/8. Still Fulton is a taltented player who will continue to play top grade this season i think we just need to let this one slip, forget completely about the weekend .

 

[Tigerpete]

horses for courses maybe.

In 2004, Fulton vs Buettner = Phar Lap vs Radish

I just want you to remember this too..........

Fulton 2004: full pre season, regular football
Buettner 2004: No pre season , no football

Mick's a better player than what he showed and while Fulton is the younge up and comer, like Farah , he may just have to bide time every now and then.

 

[Alan Shore]

Michael Buettner is a good player, he deserves a chance and he will reward Sheens for giving him the chance. I assume he'd play centre? Or 5/8th?

 

[Tigerpete]

at the moment 5/8, options are sparse there at the moment so , that'll be where.

 

[Gus22]

horses for courses maybe.

In 2004, Fulton vs Buettner = Phar Lap vs Radish

I just want you to remember this too..........

Fulton 2004: full pre season, regular football
Buettner 2004: No pre season , no football

Mick's a better player than what he showed and while Fulton is the younge up and comer, like Farah , he may just have to bide time every now and then.

Pete,

My point is that given his limited preparation (not to mention his form) how do you justify Buettners selection over a fit & in-form Fulton? Experience? There was enough out there in Hodgeson, Moodie, Graham, Senter, Skandalis, Mears, Prince. Not exactly a team stacked with rookies.

 

[Tigerpete]

Ok, this is my theory, i may be horribly wrong, thats not the point though. When Sattler was ruled out 2 hours before kick off, obviously Fulton had already played, still i think sheens obviously knew there would be major doubt as to weather or not sattler would've played. Therefore he pulled Buettner and Graham out of PL to act as cover, Graham to cover for Sattler as the starting lock, in my opinion because he was entitled to think that he would and should've got more value out of playing Nick Graham at lock for 80 mins.

Now as for Buettner over Fulton, i think this came down to possibly two reasons, firstly, in future weeks Buettner will be playing 5/8. So he thought it would be good for Buettner to get a run off the bench. secondly, perhaps with the size and pace of the opponents he thought he had to choose between Harrison and Fulton for that last spot on the bench. Perhaps having them both there was a risk he wasnt willing to take.

Still, i think if that had been wests playing saints on sunday and not balmain, it may well've gone the other way. I think the decision all came back to Sattler's omission from the side.

As to weather Buettner's inclusion was justifyable, well, on the day it may seem no, but if he is going to play 5/8 from here on in then i can justify it, if he doesnt which we should find out later today, then no, it wasnt justified.

 

[Gus22]

I think your reasoning is flawed in that you rate Buettner as a first grade 5/8 option. I strongly disagree. In my opinion I'd have any of the following as preferred option; Kerr, Prince, Fitzhenry, Halatau, Galea, Sattler, Farah, Wilson.

Tim Sheens may well see it as you do & pick Buettner at 5/8 this week. If that happens time will only tell if this was wise.

As I said I cant see us winning too many games with him in the starting lineup - especially at 5/8. Given the log jam of teams breathing down our necks for our spot in the eight, now is not the time to experiment with players of questionable fitness & form.

 

[Tigerpete]

I wouldnt normally rate Buettner as an option, if i had a list it would be:

1.Marshall (injured)
2.Prince (Sheens wants him at half though)
3.Fitzhenry (tried)
4.Kerr (untried at 5/8, unsure why)
5.Reynolds( injured)
6.Buettner
7.Wilson (tried)

Now for a couple of reasons, we're down to number 7, like Wilson, Fitzhenry and co, Buettner at least deserves a go there as does Kerr, maybe sheens will be forecd to go with Kerr, my gut tells me it will Buettner or Fitzhenry if back fit.

I also agree its not the right time to try something but its been forced upon us with the loss of Marshall and Reynolds.

 

[innsaneink]

I personally think Buettner at least deserves a chance to prove himself again. Last season he was one of the bigger fishies in our team, now he's surrounded by a lot more talent and its common knowledge that a player can look a lot better when he's got better players around him.

Maybe he has had it? but please, i think he deserves a couple of games before we s**g him off into the scrap heap.

Yeah bloody hell....the guys worked hard for over a year rehabbing from an experimental knee op....and hes had so far what ?? One, two PL games and half a 1sts game....give him a chance first.

That's the point. He's had two (by all accounts) ordinary PL games in 12 months. The previous year he showed very little, albiet in a struggling first grade team, & then he replaces Fulton on the bench. Fulton has shown great promise on the handful of occasions he's tasted first grade & has been a standout in PL for some time. Sorry but no way Buettner should be there in front of Fulton.

I just wanna clear something up....Im not of the opinion that Beuttner should be in first grade just yet....I'm of the opinion that after a years hard work rehabbing, with two games in reggies he aint gunna be showing us his best....if he does at all.
He's a good player at his best, has worked hard to come back and to be inrtroduced to the scrap heap just now as some people seem to to be suggesting is the way to go....well, it aint the way to go.
Give him 3, 4, 5 more games in reggies......you never know, he may come back better than ever.

 

[bonstonker]

i think sheens knew we were gone by the end of last week and was clutching at straws to come up with an answer.
i would say training was pretty bad last week,losing our backrow of buckets,galea and satts along with a shitload of first grade experience forced his hand in turning to graham and micky b.

the good thing is that last week is over and this week is a whole new ball game.
both graham and micky b are back where they belong and hopefully bronson,liam and bryce can show everyone including themselves and the coach that they are genuine first graders right now.
and if they do,they have to turn around next week and produce again,and again and again and again.

this is their chance to keep these players out for good,hopefully they make the most of it.