Dennis Pagan to get iced?

[CyberKev]

On last nights episode of 'On the Couch' speculation was rife about Dennis Pagan getting the chop at Carlton in favour of Barry Mitchell.

This speculation has gathered significant momentum in this morning's press, with papers' suggesting that Pagan's future will be decided at a meeting this evening.

Here's hoping, for Carlton's sake, that if they make this switch, the outcome is a lot more favourable than the first time they ran hard at the ball with Mitchell.

Younger types among us will not have heard of Mitchell and will not know that he was once a very good player in the eighties with Sydney. On the strength of this, he was poached by Carlton and scarcely fired a shot at Princes Park, his career imploding in a relatively short amount of time.

He will, apparently, come at half the price of Pagan, who will no doubt be expecting him to provide twice the output.

Frankly, if Pagan is struggling with the Blues I suspect pretty much everyone will struggle with them at the moment.

 

[Red Bear]

Why blame the coach with such an average and young team. Results dont come straight away but putting in place the players is essential

 

[Twizzle]

typical

a team comes last so they sack the coach

 

[CyberKev]

Hmmm. So the Carlton power brokers meet long into the night and still can't make a decision on Pagan!

For mine, they're out of their trees if they don't let him see out his contract.

Given their financial constraints, I can't see how they can justify paying Pagan a million bucks for nicks, just for the privilege of giving untried rookie coach, Barry Mitchell a bite of the apple at a further half million??!!

Carlton are in such a state that they are a big show for a third consecutive wooden spoon next season. I can't recall the last time that happened, but suffice to say it hasn't happened in my lifetime.

Of course, you can still be improving as a squad, even if this improvement isn't immediately evident on the ladder. They've got a lot of gaps in a lot of areas, but sensible drafting over the next couple of years can plug those holes.

In the meantime, their membership is quite solid for a side struggling so badly and Meltiger has already pointed out how impressive their crowd figures have been in a wooden spoon year.

They can't really do anything other than head down, bum up and plug away.

I tend to agree with Tony Shaw that they may well benefit from a more diversified support coaching staff, but dumping Pagan for Mitchell is not the answer at this point in time.

 

[meltiger]

Carlton are in such a state that they are a big show for a third consecutive wooden spoon next season. I can't recall the last time that happened, but suffice to say it hasn't happened in my lifetime.

They do say poor souls lose their memory in old age

I was relatively certain Sydney or Fitzroy had achieved the feat...

1992 LadderTeamPWDLGF-BFForGA-BAAgn%Pts

1. Geelong221606453-3393057303-2812099145.664
2. Footscray221606350-2842384258-2881836129.864
3. Collingwood221606313-3172195271-2851911114.964
4. West Coast221516315-3162206254-2281752125.962
5. Hawthorn221408373-3412579308-2502098122.956
6. St Kilda221408347-3332415289-2752009120.256
7. Carlton221408344-2982362302-2912103112.356
8. Essendon2212010324-2972241347-332241492.848
9. Adelaide2211011336-3012317337-2642286101.444
10. Fitzroy229013312-2942166344-334239890.336
11. Melbourne227114306-2472083348-298238687.330
12. Nth Melbourne227015330-2892269369-321253589.528
13. Richmond225017313-2822160430-358293873.520
14. Brisbane Bears224117258-2221770403-324274264.618
15. Sydney223118283-2991997394-330269474.114

1993 LadderTeamPWDLGF-BFForGA-BAAgn%Pts

1. Essendon201316344-2692333282-2671959119.154
2. Carlton201316336-2992315284-2641968117.654
3. Nth Melbourne201307387-2752597315-2602150120.852
4. Hawthorn201307316-2702166267-2561858116.652
5. Adelaide201208314-2842168265-2501840117.848
6. West Coast201208274-2681912240-2111651115.848
7. Geelong201208345-2842354305-2792109111.648
8. Collingwood201109302-2742086298-2722060101.344
9. Footscray201109287-2561978289-263199799.044
10. Melbourne2010010305-2712101269-2591873112.240
11. Fitzroy2010010294-2372001291-265201199.540
12. St Kilda2010010296-2642040314-282216694.240
13. Brisbane Bears204016273-2481886365-314250475.316
14. Richmond204016245-2831753368-272248070.716
15. Sydney201019266-2411837432-309290163.34

1994 LadderTeamPWDLGF-BFForGA-BAAgn%Pts

1. West Coast221606296-3022078223-2341572132.264
2. Carlton221507344-2872351250-2741774132.560
3. Nth Melbourne221309347-3012383262-2761848129.052
4. Geelong221309351-2972403301-2982104114.252
5. Footscray221309300-3062106279-2311905110.652
6. Hawthorn221309319-2742188290-2652005109.152
7. Melbourne2212010323-2522190271-2531879116.648
8. Collingwood2212010288-2892017290-279201999.948
9. Richmond2212010289-2992033318-259216793.848
10. Essendon2211011305-2452075308-271211997.944
11. Adelaide229112267-2741876318-251215986.938
12. Brisbane Bears229013281-2541940316-299219588.436
13. St Kilda227114266-2131809352-303241574.930
14. Fitzroy225017247-2441726359-302245670.320
15. Sydney224018288-2591987374-301254578.116

;-)

 

[meltiger]

On Pagan ... What has he actually achieved other than winning premierships with a list built by Greg Miller?


Carlton's list is better than the way it is performing.


I'd sack him.

 

[CyberKev]

On Pagan ... What has he actually achieved other than winning premierships with a list built by Greg Miller?

Miller has dined out on snaring Carey & Longmire from Sydney for much of his career.

Sydney were a soft target (re trades) for a long while before that and it should also be noted that Carey was far from a sure thing as a 17 year old.

The majority of the Kangaroos side that was so successful under Pagan had been nurtured by Pagan in the U-19s and if anyone could take responsibility for piecing the list together it would be Ron Joseph.

As for the current Carlton side.

I'd still argue that there isn't any solid sign that Barry Mitchell will improve things significantly to justify the massive payout to Pagan.

 

[CyberKev]

Hmmm.

It seems that commonsense has prevailed and Dennis will now see out his contract.

Bad news, however, for Barry Mitchell who will almost certainly be axed after throwing his support behind the push to axe Pagan.