Flaw With New Finals System

[Jason Maher]

If the 26 round comp is irrelevant, why play it? Have a 16 team knockout and be done with it. The real crime is having 50% of the teams in the finals. Should be a top 6 at most. Don't reward mediocrity by allowing teams who can only manage to win half their games to play finals football.

 

[BunniesMan]

It may or maybe harder in the 2nd week. In both systems they'll most likely play a team in 3rd or 4th. If they're both NSW teams then there is no home ground advantage (Keep in mind it's likely that Souths, Canterbury, Manly, Cronulla and Wests or Newcastle will be in the 8) so how exactly is it more difficult unless they happen to draw one of the 3 non-NSW sides?

By increasing the odds of winning in week 1, it makes it easier to progress, therefore it is absolutely rewarding teams 7 and 8 with the new system.

You're right that it awards 7th and 8th in the short term. But in the first week it also rewards 3rd through to 6th as well. 5th and 6th have it easier to get through to week 2 than before. 3rd and 4th now have the right to play for a week off rather than waiting on other results.

And 1st and 2nd have it easier in the event that they lose week 1.

The system aint perfect but it's an improvement on what we had.

And on top of everything, the cherry on top that this format has over the previous, 1v 4, 2v 3 are automatic blockbusters. Far more exciting to watch the 4 best teams play each other rather than 1st v 8th, 2nd v 7th etc.

 

[firechild]

Sure there is, as we saw last year, manly fans don't travel so if they have to play any away game in Sydney they are at a disadvantage

I think you'll find a very different situation when they aren't guaranteed of being there next week. Most people can't afford to buy tickets to 3 finals matches in a month so sensibly Manly fans saved their money for the big games. Probably the same reason Melbourne only got 900 more people. Do you remember seeing the crowd at the 2008 GF? Almost all Manly fans. 32,000 people at ANZ for the prelim in 2011.

 

[woodyk2]

Biggest flaw is teams that dont have Homebush as a home ground dont get a ''home'' semi.Out of town teams do.

 

[Dragon]

The best way through the finals is to not lose.

Despite my team not being there i think this will be an awesome finals series

 

[age.s]

Bottom line is that both systems had flaws, this one rewards top four sides better.

This has been discussed at length. McIntyre didn't punish top 4 sides. It was much better for 1/2, a mixed bag leaning towards the positive for 3/4, a mixed bag leaning towards the negative for 5/6 and unquestionably worse for 7/8.

That regularly parroted line just shows how little people understood McIntyre. I think that's the one and only reason it was overturned.

 

[Band On The Run]

Anyone who thinks that a system where 3rd wins two finals, loses one and misses out on the Grand Final while the 6th placed team wins two finals and loses one MAKES the Grand Final is a good system is an idiot.

There was virtually no difference between 3rd and 6th under the old system assuming 1st and 2nd win (which they normally do).

Also under the new system 1 and 2 are guaranteed TWO home finals, 1-4 get a double chance, 5-8 face elimination and 7 and 8 cannot host a final. Much fairer system.

 

[age.s]

And 1st and 2nd have it easier in the event that they lose week 1.

Why should a finals system be skewed towards a team losing in the first week?

1/2 losing in week one is punished more severely in McIntyre because they should not be losing to teams 7/8. If they lose to the worst teams in the competition they're punished by losing home ground advantage. The tradeoff is that they usually get a free pass into week 3 and now they'll have to play a top 4 team to get to the same place.

 

[age.s]

Anyone who thinks that a system where 3rd wins two finals, loses one and misses out on the Grand Final while the 6th placed team wins two finals and loses one MAKES the Grand Final is a good system is an idiot.

There was virtually no difference between 3rd and 6th under the old system assuming 1st and 2nd win (which they normally do).

Also under the new system 1 and 2 are guaranteed TWO home finals, 1-4 get a double chance, 5-8 face elimination and 7 and 8 cannot host a final. Much fairer system.

The entire concept of a finals system enshrines the fact that a team winning at the right time is weighted more heavily than a team winning at the wrong time (the rest of the season). The Warriors won the important game, beating the minor premiers I might add. The Broncos couldn't do that so they didn't deserve to go through, just like the Dragons didn't in 09 when they lost to team 8 and team 6 despite winning the most games over the year.

There was an element of chance with McIntyre which was another real problem (unlike all the imagined ones). The fact is the Broncos could have gone through to week 3 by beating team 6 in McIntyre. That's an advantage to 3 (and 4) that won't exist in the new system.

 

[Jason Maher]

I'm amused at the level of butthurt displayed by McIntyre lovers.

 

[typicalfan]

The entire concept of a finals system enshrines the fact that a team winning at the right time is weighted more heavily than a team winning at the wrong time (the rest of the season). The Warriors won the important game, beating the minor premiers I might add. The Broncos couldn't do that so they didn't deserve to go through, just like the Dragons didn't in 09 when they lost to team 8 and team 6 despite winning the most games over the year.

There was an element of chance with McIntyre which was another real problem (unlike all the imagined ones). The fact is the Broncos could have gone through to week 3 by beating team 6 in McIntyre. That's an advantage to 3 (and 4) that won't exist in the new system.

But in the McIntyre system 3rd and 4th could be eliminated first week.

In this system in Week 1 each team has an advantage over the team below it and know 100% of whether they are in or out or get a week off.

McIntyre system was horrible.

 

[byrne_rovelli_fan82]

Could it be that you only articulated this 'flaw' to suit you? No system is ever going to perfect, there's always going to be some loop hole it in somewhere which will probably get exploited at some point. Just be happy they are trying something new!

 

[beave]

Exactly.

Look at the dragons in 09. Bundled out in straight sets by 8th then 6th. Does anyone honestly think they deserved another shot at the premiership that year because they had to play 1 game away? They were the minor premiers, and if they believed themselves to be the premiers then they should have been able handle the broncos in brisbane, let along parramatta at Kogarah.

Similarly, look at Parramatta that same year. They went through 1st, 2nd and 3rd to get the the grand final, only to be defeated by 4th. Similar story with us in 2010 going through 2nd, 3rd and 4th in our run as well. If either side had taken out the title they'd have been worthy premiers.

Really the only times I'd say the old system was a bit iffy was the warriors in 2011 and the cowboys in 2005. Both were thumped in week one after finishing in the bottom of the 8, but were still given a 2nd chance and then went on a dream run to the GF (the cowboys were even allowed to move their semi to brisbane for some unknown reason that year). And really with the new system we are just as likely to see similarly "unfair" results from time to time as well.

Wtf???? 2004 we got to play Brisbane in Tvl because suncorp was booked out for the QRL GF so the game was moved (they lost week 1 at home and we beat the doggies in sydney so i guess it was a reward of sorts)

05 we played the tigers and got rolled in sydney, then beat melbourne in sydney and parra in sydney. You got your years and scenarios all mixed up mate.

 

[unforgiven]

The new system is the best system we can have without extending the finals to 5 weeks. There are are much better options if we have a 5 week final system and we can get to a similar system to the old top 5.

 

[nyx]

The preliminary finals then would be:
Bulldogs (1) vs Storm (2)
Rabbitohs (3) vs Cowboys (4)

So in actual fact the Rabbitohs would arguably have the easiest preliminary final game whilst the minor premiers reward for winning would be to host the 2nd placed team.

That's not quite correct.

It's
1 vs 4
2 vs 3


I much prefer this system.

 

[Jono1987]

I favour the change to our old top eight system mainly because it was beyond astonishing to see a team finish in the bottom half of the top eight, lose it's first finals match and not be eliminated. Only the top four teams should be given a reprieve to award consistency during the season.

 

[Flapper]

Why should a finals system be skewed towards a team losing in the first week?

Precisely. Everyones pathetic bitch about the McIntyre system involved 1 and 2 losing games they should've won (hence why theyre 1 and 2) and being punished for not being consistent.

Basically this lessens the punishment. Which isnt what its about. Unless we're coaching under f**king 5's.

 

[Didgi]

The best way through the finals is to not lose.

Despite my team not being there i think this will be an awesome finals series

Because of

 

[unforgiven]

Precisely. Everyones pathetic bitch about the McIntyre system involved 1 and 2 losing games they should've won (hence why theyre 1 and 2) and being punished for not being consistent.

Basically this lessens the punishment. Which isnt what its about. Unless we're coaching under f**king 5's.

It's not about being punished for inconsistency. We need to reward the teams that show consistency over the entire competition, not just the couple of weeks leading upto and during the finals. Sides that finish in the top 4 have earnt that 2nd chance by being the best performing sides thoughout the 26 rounds.

The reason I love the old top 5 format is that the top 2 sides keep their 2nd chance all the way to the major semi final. Its also the reason I'd like to see us move to a top eight system based on the old top 5/ top 4 systems.

 

[Dragon]

Because of

Oi! Ill be jumping on the cowboys bandwagon sir so be nice