The Game Future NRL Stadiums part II

[Perth Red]

Don’t reckon there was any more than for any other SOO.

The atmosphere for SOO is better at Marvel, but the AFL own it now and if the Vic Govt is going to pay millions to have the GF here, they would want to maximise interstate travellers therefore it has to be at the G. Would be more popular than SOO I reckon. Most people here don’t have access to go to an AFL GF so reckon if they had the usual Sydney prices, it would sell out 100k.

The jump in Tv audiences in afl cities when Origin is played there would suggest there is a lot more attention generated.

 

[Jamberoo]

Just copy what the Americans do, they have this process down to a fine art.

Super Bowl tickets, for example, are tightly controlled with the vast majority being keep for the teams to distribute (something like 70-80% split between them), with the rest only being available to very, very, high end corporate partners of the NFL it's self and friends and family of people involved in the NFL, and of all those tickets only a tiny minority will hit the open market (maybe 5-10% if you're lucky).
In other words the way the NFL and others do it isn't realistic in the Australian context (we're just too small, but if you make the event big enough it could work in the future), but the way the WWE does it, mixed in with some of the other elements from the others, would be a great way to go about it.

Bidding for Superbowls happens years in advance, 5 or so give or take, at which point the league and the local government have 5 or so years to market the shit out of it. WrestleMania's bidding process is just as long, however they only announce the winning bid on WrestleMania night a year beforehand. This is where we steal from the NFL, as having five years to market and sell all the tickets would be better for us than one year, however everything else we nick from the WWE.

They treat WrestleMania as a massive event and consistently promote it, slowly building to a crescendo the closer it gets to the event. There almost isn't a WWE broadcast that doesn't mention WrestleMania.

They create custom branding for each WrestleMania that is reflective of the host city, and used it to make each one feel unique, i.e. a once in a lifetime event that will not be repeated, you can go to a WrestleMania again, but you can never go to this WrestleMania again.
They then take that custom branding and fold it into a giant marketing campaign, with lots of cross promotion, to make sure that everybody knows that WrestleMania is coming to town because people can't go down the street or turn on their TV/computer without being bombarded with it.

Once it gets closer to the actual event they make all their wrestlers available to any and all major media outlets to promote it (local, national, and even international on occasion), and invest in, and host, events in the lead up to WrestleMania night that they use both to make an extra buck and to promote WrestleMania.

I could go on, but I'm sure you get the point.

As long as NRL are willing to invest the resources and put in the effort they'll be rewarded.



Just like the Super Bowl, or WrestleMania, as time goes by, and competition for hosting rights get more heated the minimum standards have got higher and higher.

So you might start out with ovals being able to host the GF, but that wouldn't last long as long the GF's are successful events. Pretty soon you'd see a requirement for a rectangular stadium with x-amount of seats, among other requirements that people probably wouldn't even think of, like x-amount of hotels within x-amount of distance, x-amount of car parking within walking distance, etc, etc.

Are you suggesting that Perth, Adelaide and Melbourne will build 60k rectangular stadiums just to big for one RL game every five years? Not going to happen.
Perth has the ability to put 5k seats inside the fence, and Adelaide Oval is narrow so not too bad for RL. MCG is almost round so not ideal, but 100k makes it worth it.

 

[Perth Red]

Are you suggesting that Perth, Adelaide and Melbourne will build 60k rectangular stadiums just to big for one RL game every five years? Not going to happen.
Perth has the ability to put 5k seats inside the fence, and Adelaide Oval is narrow so not too bad for RL. MCG is almost round so not ideal, but 100k makes it worth it.

TBh the experience really isnt that much worse than a lot of the seating at ANZ. What you lose in distance from the action you make up for in amenities at new stadiums like Optus and the atmosphere at a full MCG.

 

[azza29]

TBh the experience really isnt that much worse than a lot of the seating at ANZ.

I’ve watched Origin from the MCG top deck and a grand final from ANZ’s top deck and in both stadiums you are indeed miles from the action.

 

[The Great Dane]

Are you suggesting that Perth, Adelaide and Melbourne will build 60k rectangular stadiums just to big for one RL game every five years? Not going to happen.
Perth has the ability to put 5k seats inside the fence, and Adelaide Oval is narrow so not too bad for RL. MCG is almost round so not ideal, but 100k makes it worth it.

Nope, but will they build 60k rectangular stadiums to be eligible to host the NRL grand final and SOO, meet FIFA’s standards for larger events, potentially Olymics in some cases, have a venue that can house larger concerts, festivals, and other larger sporting events, could be the home ground of tenets in the rectangular sports, etc; absolutely if they think the tourism money is there.

And if there were a couple large local events that they could regularly win hosting rights for that required a large rectangular stadium to host, like say SOO and the NRL GF, that tourism money would be there.

 

[Jamberoo]

Nope, but will they build 60k rectangular stadiums to be eligible to host the NRL grand final and SOO, meet FIFA’s standards for larger events, potentially Olymics in some cases, have a venue that can house larger concerts, festivals, and other larger sporting events, could be the home ground of tenets in the rectangular sports, etc; absolutely if they think the tourism money is there.

And if there were a couple large local events that they could regularly win hosting rights for that required a large rectangular stadium to host, like say SOO and the NRL GF, that tourism money would be there.

No chance at all of any of those cities ever building a rectangular stadium big enough to host a GF or SOO. They already have almost new stadiums for all other major events. Optus cost $1.6 billion. They won’t be building another any time soon.

 

[The Great Dane]

No chance at all of any of those cities ever building a rectangular stadium big enough to host a GF or SOO. They already have almost new stadiums for all other major events. Optus cost $1.6 billion. They won’t be building another any time soon.

I never suggested it would all happen overnight... I mean stop being a pedant FFS.

Attitudes like this are why the AFL and cricket have all the stadiums they need, in all sizes they need, in the major states, but the rectangular sports don’t.
The AFL and cricket play politics and give the states reasons to build them the stadia they need, while we (rectangular sports) don’t and then bitch and moan that we don’t get the same outcomes.

If you don’t give the non-heartland states bloody good reasons to invest in rectangular stadiums, then the next time they are looking into investing into stadiums they’ll just invest all their money into ovals again, and we’ll still be right where we are.

 

[baselinepanther]

I never suggested it would all happen overnight... I mean stop being a pedant FFS.

Attitudes like this are why the AFL and cricket have all the stadiums they need, in all sizes they need, in the major states, but the rectangular sports don’t.
The AFL and cricket play politics and give the states reasons to build them the stadia they need, while we (rectangular sports) don’t and then bitch and moan that we don’t get the same outcomes.

If you don’t give the non-heartland states bloody good reasons to invest in rectangular stadiums, then the next time they are looking into investing into stadiums they’ll just invest all their money into ovals again, and we’ll still be right where we are.

hes not being a pedant , hes being realistic , unlike you.

if our GF is played in non heartland states it will be played at existing stadia
optus , adelaide oval & the MCG
viewing experience will not be a consideration & there will be no grand rectangle stadium projects because they aren't warranted.

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

TBh the experience really isnt that much worse than a lot of the seating at ANZ. What you lose in distance from the action you make up for in amenities at new stadiums like Optus and the atmosphere at a full MCG.

I knew plenty of folk who went to the Perth Origin match at Optus and said it was awesome. But they also say that stadium is off the charts. So that no doubt makes for the experience as you say,

 

[The Great Dane]

hes not being a pedant , hes being realistic , unlike you.

All he (and you) have said is it won’t work because he said so. Well I’m sorry but that isn’t an argument.

if our GF is played in non heartland states it will be played at existing stadia
optus , adelaide oval & the MCG
viewing experience will not be a consideration & there will be no grand rectangle stadium projects because they aren't warranted.

If that is the case the NRL are f**king idiots whom should be replaced!

Holding minimum standards for stadiums is standard practice in basically all other sports, it does incentivise governments to invest in stadiums that meet those standards (as has been shown time and time again in other sports), and there’s no reason why one of the standards to host large NRL matches couldn’t be that you need a rectangular stadium with x amount of seats.

Sure that might initially rule out WA, SA, and VIC, but if the GF and SOO continue to be the success they have been then that would change pretty quickly as they look to get in on the tourism dollars and prestige.

 

[baselinepanther]

All he (and you) have said is it won’t work because he said so. Well I’m sorry but that isn’t an argument.

If that is the case the NRL are f**king idiots whom should be replaced!

Holding minimum standards for stadiums is standard practice in basically all other sports, it does incentivise governments to invest in stadiums that meet those standards (as has been shown time and time again in other sports), and there’s no reason why one of the standards to host large NRL matches couldn’t be that you need a rectangular stadium with x amount of seats.

Sure that might initially rule out WA, SA, and VIC, but if the GF and SOO continue to be the success they have been then that would change pretty quickly as they look to get in on the tourism dollars and prestige.

but... it won't rule them out , all of those venues have already hosted origins in their present configuration & if they host GF's in the future , they'll be the venues offered .. & accepted , The only way the NRL would be idiots would be refusing to play our GF at these venues because the experience isn't quite as good as in a purpose built rectangle venue ( and lets face it , we don't even do that with ANZ ) and so waiting for one to be built which will be ..... never !!

 

[baselinepanther]

if we can't even .. incentivise .. the NSW govt , how in gods name are we going to do that to the governments of the non heartland states

 

[T-Boon]

if we can't even .. incentivise .. the NSW govt , how in gods name are we going to do that to the governments of the non heartland states

We can incentivise NSW by taking aware what it is taking for granted.
At the same time, we need to use the GF to grow the game in expansion areas. AFL does not need to do that because they are prepared to pump money into those areas instead and are already doing pretty good in most of the cities.

 

[greenBV4]

Some if my thoughts on all the above

Atmosphere and amenities makes up for the view distance, there is no experience better than a full MCG

So you wouldn't rule out ovals *at the start*, 20-30 years time of successfully GFs on the road and the NRL can start insisting on rectangular venue upgrades - or hardball it with set criteria

As far as eligible cities, if the NRL can sell the GF rights for more than they would make on ticket sales now - then they don't even really need to worry about the capacity as they have already made their money, this opens up the possibility for smaller venues, AS LONG as there is adequate amenities and corporate boxes

Sydney
Brisbane
Melbourne
Perth
Adelaide
Auckland
These are the likely venues^

Townsville
Gold Coast
Newcastle (corporate upgrades)
Canberra if they get a new stadium
Wellington
Christchurch (New)
Dunedin?
These would be venues that COULD if the bid price was high enough the negate ticket sales loss

 

[The Great Dane]

but... it won't rule them out , all of those venues have already hosted origins in their present configuration & if they host GF's in the future , they'll be the venues offered .. & accepted , The only way the NRL would be idiots would be refusing to play our GF at these venues because the experience isn't quite as good as in a purpose built rectangle venue ( and lets face it , we don't even do that with ANZ ) and so waiting for one to be built which will be ..... never !!

Again you haven’t actually made an argument against my point, you’ve just said it won’t work because you said so...

if we can't even .. incentivise .. the NSW govt , how in gods name are we going to do that to the governments of the non heartland states

We can’t incentivise the NSW gov because the NRL doesn’t enforce repercussions for not meeting their standards.

Under the threat of losing the GF the NSW gov has backflipped on the NRL in these stadium discussions two or three times now, and it’s still being held in Sydney.
So why would the NSW gov listen to the NRL when they can get everything their way and there are no negative consequences?

If the NRL started following through on their threats it’d force the NSW gov to play ball.

 

[The Great Dane]

Some if my thoughts on all the above

Atmosphere and amenities makes up for the view distance, there is no experience better than a full MCG

So you wouldn't rule out ovals *at the start*, 20-30 years time of successfully GFs on the road and the NRL can start insisting on rectangular venue upgrades - or hardball it with set criteria

If you set the precedent of allowing oval venues you’ll just make it harder to justify not playing GFs at ovals in the future.

You’d basically be giving your opponents free rein to paint you as the bad guy whom is arbitrarily taking something away, and unfortunately in our society at the moment public perception is everything.

 

[Quicksilver]

Sydney are having trouble justifying the investment in a big rectangular stadium.

Don’t see how the maths could work better in a city that doesn’t give a f**k about rectangular field sports.

 

[Captain Apollo]

The Roosters sent out an e-mail over the weekend about the re-development of the SFS. They have an article about it on their website - https://www.roosters.com.au/news/2020/12/06/sydney-football-stadium-update/

Key points from the above article -

• 42,500 seats closer to the action than before;
  
• Roofline that will cover 100% of seating.

 

[Perth Red]

Sydney are having trouble justifying the investment in a big rectangular stadium.

Don’t see how the maths could work better in a city that doesn’t give a f**k about rectangular field sports.

It doesn't. Sadly NRL clubs cant get enough fans to games for anywhere to be spending $800mill plus on rectangular stadiums. No State govt in its right mind is going to spend that sort of money for a stadium that is only needed once or twice a year. at best. All the other stuff like concerts etc work perfectly fine at the expensive oval stadiums they have already built.

GF venues should have a min 50k capacity, oval or rectangular is a mute point. It limits where might bid but if you go smaller you are starting to look like a minority sport and will lock out so many fans that it isnt worth the State govt bidding big for it as there wont be enough sports tourists coming.

 

[baselinepanther]

Again you haven’t actually made an argument against my point, you’ve just said it won’t work because you said so...

.

haha
you're an idiot ... you said they'd be ruled out because they don't have massive purpose built rectangle venues to hold our GF , my point & argument was they won't because they have already ALL held show piece events for our code , so why on earth would they be ruled out.
I'd say thats an argument against your ridiculous assertion LOL