Holden Cup Solution

Discussion in 'National Under 20s Competition' started by BuderusIsaBeast, Mar 19, 2016.

  1. BuderusIsaBeast

    BuderusIsaBeast Juniors

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    I have come up with what I believe to be a solution to the Holden Cup swell as the State Leagues and junior pathways. I apologies for length and please share your thoughts on some of the ideas.

    NRL squad has 25 players whilst also having an Under 20’s squad of 20 players

    Under 20’s can be in NRL squads such as Sione Mata’utia or Jackson Hastings etc

    Top 17 play NRL while the remaining 8 from NRL squad play Holden Cup with the best Under 20’s in the Holden Cup

    This will ensure the best young talent in the game are testing themselves against grown men and first grade caliber players

    Ensures that players in the NRL squad not playing first grade are still playing on the main ground on game day in front of a crowd in comparison to a 100 people at a suburban venue away from the spotlight.

    Ensures young talent are playing a prestigious well supported competition that play before the main game and wear the same jersey. This will continue to encourage young talent in the battle against other codes.

    Ensures young players learn and test themselves against first grade calibre players every week, overall improving themselves as individuals and players

    Ensures the clubs top 25 and best under 20’s all play under the one roof, meaning clubs have full control over who plays where and the coaching staff

    Makes for an easy transition to first grade as players in both squads will train and play together
    If clubs are struggling to fund the cashed up NRL will help out

    Fans will be able to come to the game and watch the juniors come up and watch those on the verge of first grade play before the main game. Keeps 2 games on game day as apposed to only an NRL fixture

    A Transfer Window will be in effect at the end of every season which will allow the clubs to sign and trade talent to there NRL squad whilst also bringing through the next wave of juniors to there Under 20’s squad

    Under 16’s, 18’s and 21’s will all be under NSW and QLD state league teams (including teams from Perth, Melbourne, New Zealand, Fiji and PNG) state league teams may have teams in all 4 grades or just the 3 junior divisions or just NSW/QLD Cup level (PNG an Fiji) These teams will not be attached to NRL clubs and will be separate sides

    Under 16’s and 18’s will work like SG Ball, HM, CC and Mal Meninga Cup. The Under 21’s are there for young talent who don't make NRL under 20 squads and for 21 year old talent that are to old for the Holden Cup but not quite ready for the NSW or QLD Cup. Under 21’s also gives the NRL under 20’s who aren't picked for Holden Cup a place to play

    If you are over 20 and don't have a NRL Top 25 contract you play NSW or QLD Cup
    However the rule is that if an NRL Top 25 player is injured or suspended for a duration of 5 weeks or more the NRL Club can sign a player from a either State Cup to replace him until he is healthy again and the player drops back to there State Cup team

    An independent doctor rules on how long the player is expected to mis when injured to avoid controversy. A player can only be called up by on NRL team per season however can be called up multiple times by the one club per season

    This present an opportunity for a State league player to learn and improve in an NRL system playing Holden Cup or if they play well enough potentially first grade.

    This keeps players who have missed out on securing a top 25 contract hungry and motivated as they are only an injury away from promoted. This will keep young talent playing Rugby League as a few good performances in State League could see them with an opportunity.

    Whilst at an NRL Club a state league player has the opportunity to impress a NRL club to wither give him a top 25 contract next season or keep him in mind for a state league call up

    Helps Under 20’s players who haven't been offered a Top 25 contract that they can go down to state league play well and be awarded with an opportunity

    Does not substantially weaken state leagues as there will only be 8 over 20’s in the Holden Cup per team and the pathways through the State League will keep it strong as will the lure of a potential NRL opportunity

    System is relatively easy for fans to follow as they have there top 25 and best under 20’s with a few State League players coming into the fold if injury strikes

    Also brings in the potential for a Challenge Cup type tournament as State Cup teams are separate clubs not attached to NRL teams. This again gives State League players an opportunity to impress not only NRL clubs put teams overseas aswell
     
  2. TheFrog

    TheFrog Coach

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    I think your idea will drive a lot of players away from the sport if they cannot make the top 25 by the time they are no longer eligible for Under 20's. It will also make the gap between first grade and the next level down, even steeper than it already is.
     
  3. typicalfan

    typicalfan Coach

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    One of the main problems with the Holden Cup is that it is considered by some as more prestigious than reserve grade a la NSW or QLD cup. To me that is around the wrong way.
     
  4. siv

    siv Bench

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    You will find this is already happening when they dont make Top 30 squads
     
  5. siv

    siv Bench

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    I like the idea of a level between U20s and RG(NSW Cup/QLD Cup)

    Maybe U22s sticking to a 2 year QLD post SL war U16 U18 U20 structure

    RL at a grass roots levels has never been the same

    In prior years we had RG U23s in senior structure and U21s U19s U17s U15s used to be a 9 round juniors comp

    RL was at its best at developing players during this period

    One issue in moving back to a state based u20s is that most NSW Cup teams dont have a lower grade or junior structure

    So your back to NRL clubs

    Mounties Wenty Hills St Marys Windsor Cabramatta are just better district A Grade clubs and a Sydney Shield addresses that requirement

    Even Newtown dont have jumior teams any more

    In the CC we have Wyong or CC Centurians juniors or even Easts juniors

    Its a mess

    Everyone wants one simple solution

    But the reality it needs multiple
    - 1 - NRL national reserve / u20s or U22s structure
    - 2 - State Cup with regional divisions
    - 3 - State based 9 round juniors U20s / U18 / u16s juniors

    Then Sydney can have its Sydney A plus grade district comp
     
  6. BuderusIsaBeast

    BuderusIsaBeast Juniors

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    I agree with Siv that this is whats happening atm. Im hoping by spending year or two training an playing with experienced first grade caliber players will help them in this aspect as they will be able to mentor the young players. Having a connection with an NRL team will give them more of a chance of getting a call up from State Cup which will hopefully help them stick around.
     
  7. BuderusIsaBeast

    BuderusIsaBeast Juniors

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    Under my solution the Holden Cup would be more prestigious as u would have the rest of the NRL top 25 playing in that comp with the best of the under 20's. The fact that they are playing for an NRL club should in my opinion make it more prestigious than the state cup
     
  8. CC_Roosters

    CC_Roosters First Grade

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    I like your idea and have been thinking along similar lines for a while now. The only problem is in the short term it reduces the standard of the state cups. To limit the impact i would have it as an reserve/u23 competition with as you said the best young players contracted to the club playing alongside the fringe veterans from the NRL. But with restrictions on the numbers of overage players who can play week to week. I guess the way it would then work is each club has a number of other senior and youth players dual registered with state cup sides but whom would primarily play in those competitions unless called up to the NRL or U23.

    With the nrl clubs having inhouse reserves the state cups can be more independant, in NSW incorporate the major regional cities alongside some city based sides like wenty, norths, newtown and whoever the warriors nominate for that level.

    All up i would have
    NRL
    NRL u23 reserves
    state cup
    State u20 long season (NYC)
    State u18 short season
    State u16 short season

    IMO it gives two pathways for players, elite players will likely move straight into NRL u23 squads from juniors were they can develop alongside seasoned players while those who take more time to mature would advance through the state cup. Increased funding of the second tier from the central pot should result in increased professionalism and therefore players staying in the game longer.
     
  9. half_back

    half_back Juniors

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    The main issue with this is the reason they are abolishing the NYC to begin with, that is the cost of the exercise. By adding an extra tier or 2 if you have an additional under 22/23's. The cost of jetting them around, player salaries, coaching staff etc make it an unreasonable expense.

    Another issue I see is that there would hopefully be relative parity in round one, although given clubs use up to 33 players when team A has zero injuries and fields their 8 top 25 players with 9 NYC players against team B who have an injury crisis and players 18-25 are up in first grade they field 17 NYC players the lopsided score lines we currently see in some NYC fixtures could turn into absolute cricket scores. I suggest under such a model you would potentially have to match the number of overage players for consistency although this then posees questions on where they would play.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2016
  10. Chicken_Hunter

    Chicken_Hunter Coach

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    The best way was how it used to be.

    NRL
    Reserve Grade
    Flegg
     
  11. siv

    siv Bench

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    With a comp that spreads across international boundries in all grades FG RG and u20s you cant avoid transport costs

    Look at Melbourne this year - they are flying players to Noosa to play their home u20s mayches ???? Just like their U18 and U16s teams fly all over Qld as well
     
  12. johnny plath

    johnny plath Juniors

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    Their under 20s are based on sunshine coast permanently now. The under 16s and 18s are victorian rl not storm although I'm sure storm probably puts something into them as well. At the moment they only have fixtures against brisbane based teams so not quite flying all over queensland.
     

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