Import figures

[East Coast Tiger]

I think 2 quota players would get to the point where it would lower the quality of the league.3 is a good number IMO.

I don't think 50 between 9 clubs is too bad,and considering Wakefield will probably be down next year and Cas will have no need for the 'SL survival Aussies' anymore,there is no need to change the rule IMO.

Yeah you wouldn't want to reduce the number os Aussies by one per club, there'd be hardly any left:? . I don't think it woul be bad to see just one quota player per club. That would mean he would be a marquee player. It would spread the talent out a bit too. For instance Wigan couldn't sign Barrett and Kimmorley so one might ened up at Salford or Huddersfield. If SL are worried about the standard of their competition they should be encouraging the clubs to ditch the 30-something retirees from the NRL and promote the English lads. There are so many good English players that have got a breif start in the big time this year that should/would be there fulltime if there weren't so many old has-beens in front of them.

As for the comparison with the NRL. There are three imports in the NRL this year - Morley, Carney and Edmonson. Kiwis and Pacific players are hardly imports. It might be an Australian competition but with the Warriors involved it's a Pacific comp really, just like France has made SL into more of a European comp. If Kiwis are included as imports in the NRL the French would have to be included as imports in the SL, bringing the number of imports in SL to about 120 this year.

 

[Evil Homer]

Yeah you wouldn't want to reduce the number os Aussies by one per club, there'd be hardly any left:? . I don't think it woul be bad to see just one quota player per club. That would mean he would be a marquee player. It would spread the talent out a bit too. For instance Wigan couldn't sign Barrett and Kimmorley so one might ened up at Salford or Huddersfield. If SL are worried about the standard of their competition they should be encouraging the clubs to ditch the 30-something retirees from the NRL and promote the English lads. There are so many good English players that have got a breif start in the big time this year that should/would be there fulltime if there weren't so many old has-beens in front of them.

Point is,at most clubs the quota players are marquee players.The 30 year old has been that are floating around the bottom clubs are usually the off-quota ones,as clubs don't want to waste a quota spot on them.They probably wouldn't be there if there wasn't the threat of relegation anyway.

3 is a fair number IMO.Maybe if clubs stopped signing as many off-quota players,the competition would be healthier.As it is though,reducing the number of overseas players you're legally allowed to sign would just lead to lower quality imports,which would damage the comp.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Maybe.
What's damaging English RL is the fact that GB can't beat Australia or even NZ at the moment and one of the reasons for that is the lack of depth in the English ranks. NZ has become so strong it is now considered world championship material and I believe it is because since the Warriors came into the NRL the number of Kiwis playing at the top professional level has exploded. More players, more depth, stronger Kiwi sides. Meanwhile the RFL is allowing British clubs to reduce the number of British players playing at the top level. Whether they are missing out to quota players or non-quota players, it doesn't matter. Reduce the number of imports, somehow, some way.

 

[deluded pom?]

I would assume that Bai . Vainikolo . Gene and Vagana are classed as PI players to get them in under the Kolpak ruling . I remember when the Kolpak ruling came in . Bradford had something like six or seven overseas players in their squad . Lo and behold virtually overnight they only had Shontayne Hape classed as a New Zealander . the rest were suddenly PI players . If a club declares a player as a PI then he should then become ineligible for NZ . I doubt very much whether many players would be willing to distance themselves from the chance to play for the Kiwis . And if they were big enough to actually do it then surely that's even better for the PI Nations .

 

[Evil Homer]

To be fair to Bai and Gene,they have always been PNG Kumuls.

 

[deluded pom?]

True Homer but Vainikolo and Vagana have ALWAYS played internationally for the Kiwis yet technically aren't New Zealanders . Do we mean 30 something has beens like Nutley , Dunneman or De Vere who will all be running around in the NRL next year ?

 

[The Observer]

As for the comparison with the NRL. There are three imports in the NRL this year - Morley, Carney and Edmonson. Kiwis and Pacific players are hardly imports. It might be an Australian competition but with the Warriors involved it's a Pacific comp really, just like France has made SL into more of a European comp. If Kiwis are included as imports in the NRL the French would have to be included as imports in the SL, bringing the number of imports in SL to about 120 this year.

Come on, East Coast. Our comp is the National Rugby League competition of Australia. It evolved from the ARL and NSWRL, and from 1908-1995 it was only an Australian competition.

The main fact is that guys like Roy Asotasi and David Kidwell were NZers who grew up and learned their RL in the NZ system, at an Auckland junior club, at a Christchurch junior club. They were recruited by NRL clubs and brought over for the eventual purpose of playing in the NRL system. Like all the NZers and Islanders I mentioned in my list, they are unequivocally imports.

Let's remember, imports aren't a bad thing. Importing players is good for NRL, SL and competition - imports bring fresh playing style, new ideas and increases interest in the comp. Furthermore, its good for the international game, because having them strengthens the talent pool of NZ and the PIs immensely.

BTW if the French were included, the number of imports in English RL would only increase by about 4, because there are only about 4 French players at English SL clubs.

 

[The Observer]

I think 2 quota players would get to the point where it would lower the quality of the league.3 is a good number IMO.

I don't agree that it would lower the quality of the league. Nearly every SL club has a player or two on the overseas quota whose omission wouldn't affect the standard of the League:

The players in bold are those that could be omitted from a reduction in the overseas quota:

Bradford
QUOTA - Meyers (Kangaroo), Hape (Kiwi), Ben Harris
EXEMPT - McKenna (Kangaroo), Withers (both Ireland passports), Bai, Gene (PNG Kumuls) Vainikolo (Kiwi, Tongan passport), Joe Vagana (Kiwi, Samoan passport)

Cas
QUOTA - Nutley, Roarty
EXEMPT - McGoldrick (Aussie, UK passport - England), Dyer (Aussie, UK passport - Wales), Bird (Aussie, RFL exemption - Gateshead merger), Fa'aoso, Viane (Aussies, Samoa RL reps), Manu (Aussie, Tongan RL rep), Davis (old 5 year residency rule), Fletcher (Aussie, Greek RL rep)

Quins
QUOTA - McLinden, Temata, Dorn, Hopkins, Randall
EXEMPT - Bradley-Qalilawa (Aussie, Fijian passport), Gafa (Aussie, Maltese passport), Haumono (Aus SL rep & Tonga test rep) Lolohea, Tyrone Smith (Aussies, Tonga RL reps), Heckenberg (Aussie, Scotland RL rep, UK passport), Leuluai (Kiwi, Samoan passport), H Paul (Kiwi, old 5 year residency rule, but eligible for UK passport through English mother), Luisi (Samoan/Tongan passport), Tookey (QLD/Aboriginal rep, Welsh ancestry), Weisner (Irish passport)

Hudds
QUOTA - De Vere (Kangaroo), Gannon (USA Tomahawk), Drew (Country)
EXEMPT - R Paul (Kiwi, old 5 year residency rule, but eligible for UK passport through English mother), Nero (Aussie, Italian passport)

Hull FC
QUOTA - Blacklock (Kangaroo), Swain (Kiwi), Domic (Aboriginal rep)
OFF - Tony (Kiwi, Samoan passport), McMenemy (Irish passport)

Leeds
QUOTA - Toopi (Kiwi), Millard (USA Tomahawk), Donald
OFF - Lauitiiti, Poching (Kiwis with Samoan passports)

Catalans
QUOTA - Chan, Jones (Kiwis), Beattie (QLD Origin), Murphy, Rudder, Wilson
EXEMPT - I Hindmarsh (COuntry Origin, eligible for UK passport - Scottish ancestry), Hughes (NSW Origin, eligible for UK passport - Welsh ancestry)

Salford
QUOTA - Dunemann, Moule (NRL GF winner),
EXEMPT- D Gower (UK passport - England), Langi? (Niuean passport??), Lima (Samoan passport), Rutgerson (SA passport), Wilshere (PNG passport)

Saints
QUOTA - J Cayless (Kiwi), Lyon (Kangaroo), Hooper
EXEMPT - Anderson (Kiwi, Tongan passport), Fa'asavalu (actually Samoan raised), Meli, Talau (NZers, Samoan passport)

Wakefield
QUOTA - Catic, MacGillivray, Jeffries
EXEMPT - Betham, Solomona (Kiwi reps with Samoan passport), Elima (French), Evans (Wales RL rep), Halpenny (Aussie, Irish passport), Demetriou, Korkidas (Aussies with Greek passport), Obst (Aussie, English passport??), Tadulala (Fiji rep), Watene (Cook Islands passport???)

Warrington
QUOTA - Rauhihi (Kiwi), Grose (eligible for UK passport through Welsh ancestry?), Sullivan
EXEMPT - Fa'afili, Swann (Kiwis with Samoan passports), Kohe-Love (NZer, English mother, 5 year rule), Leikvoll (Aussie, UK passport - England)

Wigan
QUOTA - Dallas (Kangaroo), Fletcher (Kangaroo), Dobson
EXEMPT - Logan (Scotland RL rep, UK passport), Richards (Aussie, UK/Irish passport), Paleaaesina, Vaealiki (Kiwis with Samoan passports)

Evil Homer, the omission of certain players from SL like Ben Harris, Roarty, Dorn, Hopkins, Randall, Drew, Donald, Rudder, Wilson, Dunemann, Hooper, Jeffries, Sullivan, Dobson would not lower the standard of the League. OTOH those players would lift the standard of NL 1 if the quota was standardised across the divisions.

SL is in trouble if you think some of these guys are indispensible.

Furthermore, there are plenty of good off quota players in the NRL that your clubs mysteriously don't bid for e.g. three NRL GF winners - Kangaroo/Warriors prop Steve Price, Kangaroo/Panthers winger Luke Rooney, and Tigers forward Chris Heighington would all be off quota as all have English parents and thus could get a British passport. However NONE of those players were targeted for recruitment by SL clubs when they were last off contract.

This is ignoring all the other PI ancestry players SL clubs haven't bid for.

I don't think 50 between 9 clubs is too bad,and considering Wakefield will probably be down next year and Cas will have no need for the 'SL survival Aussies' anymore,there is no need to change the rule IMO.

How do you know the club promoted from NL1 (be it Leigh, Widnes, HullKR)won't do what Wakefield did and sign 11 overseas imports?

 

[ParraDude_Jay]

Hudds
Drew (Country)

He's one of the best players in Super League...

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Come on, East Coast. Our comp is the National Rugby League competition of Australia. It evolved from the ARL and NSWRL, and from 1908-1995 it was only an Australian competition.

The main fact is that guys like Roy Asotasi and David Kidwell were NZers who grew up and learned their RL in the NZ system, at an Auckland junior club, at a Christchurch junior club. They were recruited by NRL clubs and brought over for the eventual purpose of playing in the NRL system. Like all the NZers and Islanders I mentioned in my list, they are unequivocally imports.

Let's remember, imports aren't a bad thing. Importing players is good for NRL, SL and competition - imports bring fresh playing style, new ideas and increases interest in the comp. Furthermore, its good for the international game, because having them strengthens the talent pool of NZ and the PIs immensely.

BTW if the French were included, the number of imports in English RL would only increase by about 4, because there are only about 4 French players at English SL clubs.

Okay so it'd debatable whether Kiwis are mports in the NRL or not but I think the main difference between the NRL and SL is that there are still heaps of Australian players getting their chance to play at the top level and Australia hardly has a problem competing at international level. The Poms however are being limited and are struggling to match the other two at international level. I agree having Kiwis in SL is good for NZRL, but many of them should be playing NRL anyway. In some ways the rise of NZ has actually hurt GB because now it has another competitor strong enough to beat the Lions regularly.
As for the French point, I was talking about French players playing in SL. The new club has in itself cut the number of English sides to 11 already. I'd rate the inclusion of more French players in SL the same as more Kiwis in the NRL. It's bloody good for those countries but in SL's case it does mean even less English players. Hopefully there'll be 14 clubs in 2009 and that will help get more English players into SL than ever before.

 

[Evil Homer]

He's one of the best players in Super League...

Indeed - rumours are that Drew's nominated for Man of Steel.Hardly damaging to the competition:?

Dunemann,Dorn,Dobson,Hopkins and Jeffries are all very important to their teams too,in fact chances are Dunemann,Dobson and Jeffries will all be playing NRL next year.

I think that post has proved that The Observer isn't quite as knowledgable on the British game as he makes out.