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Is Bennett past it?

Red Bear

Referee
Messages
20,882
Is the problem Bennett or is the problem Newcastle?

Bar a couple of moments when Joey was actually fit they've been pretty puss since 2003 and the attitude of the place has been poor. The only time they looked like turning it around IMO was when Smith was coaching there, he kicked the deadwood out and was building something, that then fell apart midseason when they only offered him a year and he took the Roosters job instead.

Hooker is a huge concern for them.
 

Misanthrope

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
47,627
Is the problem Bennett or is the problem Newcastle?

Bar a couple of moments when Joey was actually fit they've been pretty puss since 2003 and the attitude of the place has been poor. The only time they looked like turning it around IMO was when Smith was coaching there, he kicked the deadwood out and was building something, that then fell apart midseason when they only offered him a year and he took the Roosters job instead.

Hooker is a huge concern for them.

I don't really feel like hooker is a big problem area for us when fit. Buderus was still looking bloody good up until his injury, and Clydesdale is a future starter who just needs an opportunity.

The losing culture ingrained in the club is definitely a concern, but enough guys have come and gone for the worst of that to have dissipated by now. If a master of motivation like Bennett can't work his magic there, I begin to doubt that motivation is the issue.
 

Ronnie Dobbs

Coach
Messages
17,441
Not even the great man can polish a turd.

The knights have been pile of mediocre shit since forever.

Just shows how great a player joey was.
 

Ronnie Dobbs

Coach
Messages
17,441
Kade snowden is shite. None our 2010 squad are worth a pinch of shit at present and waddell simply isnt an nrl player.

Bennett is making a mint though.
 

Grapple

First Grade
Messages
5,014
He's still better than quite a few other coaches in the NRL. I wish he went to The Warriors though. Would love to see that club and their players under a decent coach.
 

Dazzat

First Grade
Messages
5,919
Any professional operating in the high performance, competitive arena will go through their ups and downs, and I reckon Wayne Bennett is definitely going through a down at the moment.

One could make a few excuses when it comes to team injury, with Newcastle having issues with their captain, and their spine this year. The forward pack is less than inspiring as well.

Newcastle just maybe a longer term operation than St George, which had a pretty solid squad for their two years with Bennett, particularly in the spine - Boyd, Soward, Hornby and Young/Fein.

And Bennett, because of his age, may just be a little more set in his ways than he was and a little slower in implementing his well-tested strategies.

But I'm still amused at those who brush of the man's long term success because he has enjoyed coaching good players. This just flies in the face of the facts.
 

aqua_duck

Coach
Messages
18,636
I also think the junior system needs to be looked at, for such a massive junior catchment we've really struggled to produce any quality youngsters in the past 5-6 years, our NYC teams have been below average since 08 and the only blokes who have graduated to the top grade have mainly been imports. We've had quite a few good prospects in recent years (Australian schoolboys reps, NSW underage reps etc) and literally none of them have kicked on, it's not even a case of them not getting a go it's a case of them not developing
 

aqua_duck

Coach
Messages
18,636
Yeah, the wrestle reminds me of Union mauls, their on-going big boring pile-ups of days gone by. The purists loved them but they turned newbies away from the game. The wrestle is Leagues equivalent. The knowledegable understand and appreciate their significance, everyone else finds them at best - amusing, more often than not though - boring.

As for Benny, the man's a legend, end of...

It's boring and ugly no doubt but it's an important part of the game and when you play the way we play dominating the ruck is vital, unfortunately if you are below par in the wrestle you'll never dominate the ruck
 

Ronnie Dobbs

Coach
Messages
17,441
I also think the junior system needs to be looked at, for such a massive junior catchment we've really struggled to produce any quality youngsters in the past 5-6 years, our NYC teams have been below average since 08 and the only blokes who have graduated to the top grade have mainly been imports. We've had quite a few good prospects in recent years (Australian schoolboys reps, NSW underage reps etc) and literally none of them have kicked on, it's not even a case of them not getting a go it's a case of them not developing

Good points. I think thats relevant to every club though. The 20s is a shit comp in regards to preparing nrl players.
 

legend

Coach
Messages
15,150
Leagueunlimited.com/is-bennett-still-the-messiah/

The Craig Gower signing left me scratching my head. What can he possibly add to any side at his age?



The Knights already have Gidley, Buderus, Mason, Tahu, Hilder, Quinn and Smith in the over thirties club so why not add another? Hell, why not bring back Danny Wicks on match payments? That makes more sense if you ask me.


Gower is 35 and has been plying his trade with the worst team in the ESL, The London Broncos. He wants to finish his career in the NRL, which is fine, but coming from a team that would be lapped by a NSW cup side, what can Gower bring to a Knights side that is wildly inconsistent?


The signing has led me to ask the question about the decision making abilities of Wayne Bennett. To be honest, I expected more success from Bennett with the Knights in a similar fashion to the way way he made St George Illawarra a premiership threat in his first season, culminating in the 2010 premiership victory over the Sydney Roosters.


The Knights recruitment has been mediocre at best. Darius Boyd was a solid signing as was Jeremy Smith, but the Knights have received no value from Beau Scott and to a lesser extent, Danny Buderus.


No doubt it takes a great coach to win premierships with two different clubs but it seems Bennett has bitten off more than he can chew with the Knights. On the surface, their seems to be resistance to the “Bennett”way of doing things. At St George Illawarra, Bennett’s inimitable style was ingrained in every aspect of the Dragons play and it yielded results immediately, with the Dragons in 2009, Bennett’s first year, a premiership force who were put to the sword by one man, Jarryd Hayne.


In 2010 they won the Dragons first premiership since 1979. Bennett had achieved mission impossible. A job well done. A new challenge on the horizon. That challenge was the Knights. Did he bite off more than he could chew? Only time will tell on that one.


2013 marks Bennett’s second season with the Knights and they will struggle to make the top eight for a second consecutive year under Bennett if recent form is anything to go by. After a promising start the Knight are now 6-6 and don’t seem to be buying into the Bennett way. The top four is set and there are some quality teams looking to replace the Knights in the top eight, namely the Bulldogs and Raiders. The Knights flogged one and were flogged by the other.


The quality of the Knights play is inconsistent. Yes, they have a heavy injury list but the Knights look befuddled on the field with the ball in hand. They have had their moments, but not enough of them. Bennett can’t use his signature wrap around play that was so successful at the Dragons because it has been done to death and teams know how to defend it now.


Hunter Stadium is not a fortress that can be relied upon to give the Knights the home ground advantage that teams like the Raiders and Storm receive by being cold weather teams. Hunter Stadium is a picturesque, benign home ground that looks beautiful on a sunny Sunday afternoon but that’s as far as it goes for the Knights. It is not imposing and the fans aren’t feral enough (at least on game day) to make it a graveyard for visiting teams.


One question Knights fans are within their rights to ask is, why not promote from within instead of signing a 35 year old player, who has been out of the NRL for over five years and is as old as time itself? Good question you ask. Craig Gower played for the Panthers in Super League back in 1997. Just thought it was worth mentioning.
Has Bennett evolved with the game to the point where he can keep his side not just competitive, but a premiership threat because being near enough is not good enough for a man like Bennett. Wayne is in his sixties and his premiership window with the Knights is beginning to close for good. Will his legacy be tarnished with a “bridge too far”club like the Knights or will he always be revered for his achievements with the Broncos and the Dragons?
 

Ronnie Dobbs

Coach
Messages
17,441
Leagueunlimited.com/is-bennett-still-the-messiah/

The Craig Gower signing left me scratching my head. What can he possibly add to any side at his age?



The Knights already have Gidley, Buderus, Mason, Tahu, Hilder, Quinn and Smith in the over thirties club so why not add another? Hell, why not bring back Danny Wicks on match payments? That makes more sense if you ask me.


Gower is 35 and has been plying his trade with the worst team in the ESL, The London Broncos. He wants to finish his career in the NRL, which is fine, but coming from a team that would be lapped by a NSW cup side, what can Gower bring to a Knights side that is wildly inconsistent?


The signing has led me to ask the question about the decision making abilities of Wayne Bennett. To be honest, I expected more success from Bennett with the Knights in a similar fashion to the way way he made St George Illawarra a premiership threat in his first season, culminating in the 2010 premiership victory over the Sydney Roosters.


The Knights recruitment has been mediocre at best. Darius Boyd was a solid signing as was Jeremy Smith, but the Knights have received no value from Beau Scott and to a lesser extent, Danny Buderus.


No doubt it takes a great coach to win premierships with two different clubs but it seems Bennett has bitten off more than he can chew with the Knights. On the surface, their seems to be resistance to the ?Bennett?way of doing things. At St George Illawarra, Bennett?s inimitable style was ingrained in every aspect of the Dragons play and it yielded results immediately, with the Dragons in 2009, Bennett?s first year, a premiership force who were put to the sword by one man, Jarryd Hayne.


In 2010 they won the Dragons first premiership since 1979. Bennett had achieved mission impossible. A job well done. A new challenge on the horizon. That challenge was the Knights. Did he bite off more than he could chew? Only time will tell on that one.


2013 marks Bennett?s second season with the Knights and they will struggle to make the top eight for a second consecutive year under Bennett if recent form is anything to go by. After a promising start the Knight are now 6-6 and don?t seem to be buying into the Bennett way. The top four is set and there are some quality teams looking to replace the Knights in the top eight, namely the Bulldogs and Raiders. The Knights flogged one and were flogged by the other.


The quality of the Knights play is inconsistent. Yes, they have a heavy injury list but the Knights look befuddled on the field with the ball in hand. They have had their moments, but not enough of them. Bennett can?t use his signature wrap around play that was so successful at the Dragons because it has been done to death and teams know how to defend it now.


Hunter Stadium is not a fortress that can be relied upon to give the Knights the home ground advantage that teams like the Raiders and Storm receive by being cold weather teams. Hunter Stadium is a picturesque, benign home ground that looks beautiful on a sunny Sunday afternoon but that?s as far as it goes for the Knights. It is not imposing and the fans aren?t feral enough (at least on game day) to make it a graveyard for visiting teams.


One question Knights fans are within their rights to ask is, why not promote from within instead of signing a 35 year old player, who has been out of the NRL for over five years and is as old as time itself? Good question you ask. Craig Gower played for the Panthers in Super League back in 1997. Just thought it was worth mentioning.
Has Bennett evolved with the game to the point where he can keep his side not just competitive, but a premiership threat because being near enough is not good enough for a man like Bennett. Wayne is in his sixties and his premiership window with the Knights is beginning to close for good. Will his legacy be tarnished with a ?bridge too far?club like the Knights or will he always be revered for his achievements with the Broncos and the Dragons?

Excellent stuff.

Personally, he can do as he pleases after 2010. My life and the lives of those around me are far far better for him finally getting us over the line!
 

Bengal

Juniors
Messages
877
It's boring and ugly no doubt but it's an important part of the game and when you play the way we play dominating the ruck is vital, unfortunately if you are below par in the wrestle you'll never dominate the ruck
Its importance isn?t in question - its entertainment value is. Dominating the ruck means nothing to kids and newbie potential fans to the sport.

As for Benny, doesn?t matter who you are if you don?t have the cattle then you?re not going to do much. Take Bellamy, fantastic Storm coach but didn?t have the cattle to get NSW over the line. Look at Hasler, goes great guns when the Doggies have their best players on the paddock, looks ordinary when they don?t. I wonder not if Benny has chewed off more than he can handle but whether he?s been given or gotten everything he thought he would get when he first signed up for the job.
 

Amadaca

Juniors
Messages
2,217
Its importance isn?t in question - its entertainment value is. Dominating the ruck means nothing to kids and newbie potential fans to the sport.

As for Benny, doesn?t matter who you are if you don?t have the cattle then you?re not going to do much. Take Bellamy, fantastic Storm coach but didn?t have the cattle to get NSW over the line. Look at Hasler, goes great guns when the Doggies have their best players on the paddock, looks ordinary when they don?t. I wonder not if Benny has chewed off more than he can handle but whether he?s been given or gotten everything he thought he would get when he first signed up for the job.

Thinking of Bennett's time at the Broncos.

Shouldn't this cut both ways?
 

aqua_duck

Coach
Messages
18,636
Its importance isn?t in question - its entertainment value is. Dominating the ruck means nothing to kids and newbie potential fans to the sport
who gives a f**k what they think besides most kids and newbie fans aren't informed enough to realise what's going on, but the fact is it's vital to the success of a football team. I don't care about Bennett's philosophical objections or who he has to hire to fix it, until we fix it we'll be alsorans
 

Amadaca

Juniors
Messages
2,217
who gives a f**k what they think besides most kids and newbie fans aren't informed enough to realise what's going on, but the fact is it's vital to the success of a football team. I don't care about Bennett's philosophical objections or who he has to hire to fix it, until we fix it we'll be alsorans

Shrewd post.

From the outside looking in at least, seems Bennett is missing the point by allowing his ego to dictate the (ineffective) wrestle-free gameplan.
 

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