Jimmy Anderson - Where does he rank of all time, for fast bowlers?

[simmo1]

Who'd have thought the dyed hair plodder in the 06/07 ashes would end up with more wickets than McGrath.

 

[ANTiLAG]

Even from bowlers I've seen - Hadlee, Lillee, McGrath, Akram, Waqar, Imran, Marshall, Garner, Holding, Ambrose, Donald and Steyn (off the top of my head) are better IMO

Then there's Croft, Patterson, Walsh, and of course Bishop, Boult, Bond, Wagner, Philander, S Pollock, MM Morkel, K Abbott, K Rabada (this L Ngidi looks great potential too) S Akhtar, J Gillespie, Simon Jones, J Pattinson, P Cummins, J Hazelwood, and of course Billy McDerrmott,

Look - Jimmy's a fine bowler. But he's fighting to being for his life to be in the 20 best of the last 30 years. Let alone all time (I know Croft falls outside this parameter in tests).

If Boult or Alderman had been born in England, this wouldn't even be a conversation.

 

[JJ]

Then there's Croft, Patterson, Walsh, and of course Bishop, Boult, Bond, Wagner, Philander, S Pollock, MM Morkel, K Abbott, S Akhtar, J Gillespie, Simon Jones, J Pattinson, P Cummins, J Hazelwood, and of course Billy McDerrmott,

Look - Jimmy's a fine bowler. But he's fighting to being for his life to be in the 20 best of the last 30 years. Let alone all time (I know Croft falls outside this parameter in tests).

If Boult or Alderman had been born in England, this wouldn't even be a conversation.

Not too many of them could be considered better TBH if longevity etc is key

 

[ANTiLAG]

Not too many of them could be considered better TBH if longevity etc is key

What is longevity? Does Anderson even have it? How many tests has he missed since his debut?

I'll guess off the top of my head at 50. Someone statsguru it. That is roughly 2/3 Hadlee's career give or take who played himself at 39 years of age taking wickets in England of all places. Whatever his actual count is, I bet its more than all the above, and its not because Jimmy is old at 36.

That's the ridiculous thing about the the India era odi limited overs stats and the soon to be England era of test stats.

Jimmy is not an ATG, he's fine. But never at any time has he been in a group of ATG bowlers better than the rest. He has been in Steyn's (And Philander, and Morkel then Abbott and now Rabada and prolly soon Ngidi) shadow throughout. Then there's the Aussie lads. The plucky Kiwis. And even Gabriel and Roach are starting to bust a move for the WI before Jimmy retires. Heck maybe even Bumrah and BK join that list.

And all the names who cross over above with him that I mentioned earlier, have good claims in their respective time frame against him as better bowlers given their home conditions.

KP didn't need a test batting average of 50 to be respected like one who did, why is Jimmy even in a debate?

And btw - Ewan McGrady was a helluva footballer, and much better than many of the 300 game players today, longevity or not!

To be ordinary, better yet - decent, even good and injury free for a long time doesn't make you great as a player. Just ask Chris Heinington.

I'd rather watch Jimmy bowl in England than McGrath anywhere in the world. McGrath was boring, metronomic even, but highly effective. And I don't think Jimmy is fit to tie Glenn's, Ian's, Shane's and many more modern player's laces in any ATG A, B or C team. Jimmy entertains, but he leaks.

 

[TheParraboy]

He's in my top 100.

If he played his whole career in England he'd be in my top 80.

after this indian series (2 more tests)

Jimmys test venues

Home 83 tests
Away 54 tests
Neutral 6 tests

So a big chunk of home tests, his best conditions

 

[ANTiLAG]

after this indian series (2 more tests)

Jimmys test venues

Home 83 tests
Away 54 tests
Neutral 6 tests

So a big chunk of home tests, his best conditions

He's a fine bowler, and will be a record holder, but noone globally outside England really rates him

 

[TheParraboy]

Jimmy is not an ATG

correct

 

[JJ]

correct

Had to be something worthwhile in all that

 

[ANTiLAG]

Had to be something worthwhile in all that

Ironic, tell me more about Anderson's longevity chump

See - long isn't necessarily good you nutter.

Now go take a left at the hypocrisy turnpike

If you think I am disrespecting you; I am, but anything to get my point through your thick skull and its limitations of sound bite-highlight "Anderson is a modern ATG because of longevity" thinking

 

[hineyrulz]

A fine bowler no doubt but he needs to do a helluva a lot more to be mentioned alongside John Snow. A damn sight more!

Bet the merkin couldn't bowl in a horse blanket either.

 

[Fufu Andronez]

Are we all taking the absolute piss by mentioning Trent Boult in these discussions about all time greats and comparisons etc?

 

[ANTiLAG]

Are we all taking the absolute piss by mentioning Trent Boult in these discussions about all time greats and comparisons etc?

Gawd - I hope so. Sadly I am deadly serious that Boult has a proven head to head better than Jimmy Anderson's record. Look it up if you beg to differ. But its fact. Boult's really shat all over Jimmy in their combined games played against each other. Both in England and New Zealand. And this is many years now, and 4 tours, 2 each way. And Boult has many more years left in him to do it again. (And then there's the fact he has a better record than Jimmy in Australia and Sri Lanka as well).

I don't think Boult is an ATG. I do think he is better than Anderson head to head, though. Easily proven on games played, as much as England fans won't like to concede it - but 58 out all bowled is 58 out all bowled in conditions that Nicholls scored a century on against Jimmy (and he is no world class batsman quality by any stretch).

Ergo, If Boult is not an ATG, and he's not, Jimmy really isn't in the debate. Boult isn't the issue - rating Jimmy when he can't even clear Boult's ability (that you clearly don't rate highly) as an ATG is just laughable. Sadly. Boult out swings Jimmy with both the Kookaburra and the Dukes. Jimmy is kinda looking lame head to head. Jimmy needs both England and the Dukes. Boult makes the Kookaburra talk somewhere outside of England, and the Dukes talk more in England. Facts are facts.

Look if Boult or Alderman were born in England, this Jimmy conversation would no be happening. That's my opinion and I am sticking by it. Jimmy's a fine test bowler, ATG - get out of here If Pattinson could stay fit for half a season - he'd eat Jimmy alive.

 

[TheParraboy]

He's a fine bowler, and will be a record holder, but noone globally outside England really rates him

If Tommy Smiths (well thought out and fair) logic is anything to go by, many in England don’t either

 

[JJ]

Ironic, tell me more about Anderson's longevity chump

See - long isn't necessarily good you nutter.

Now go take a left at the hypocrisy turnpike

If you think I am disrespecting you; I am, but anything to get my point through your thick skull and its limitations of sound bite-highlight "Anderson is a modern ATG because of longevity" thinking

Just feeling lucky to be in the presence of such an erudite, yet verbose, egotist - quite the case study at times

 

[hineyrulz]

Trent Boult is a poor mans Murphy Sua.

 

[JJ]

If Tommy Smiths (well thought out and fair) logic is anything to go by, many in England don’t either

He has to be rated, clearly he achieved a lot as a test bowler - but there are many better English fast bowlers, and Trueman (I think) is the one that's as good as anybody

 

[JJ]

Facts are facts.

.

Correct

 

[AlwaysGreen]

Trent Boult is the first guy picked in my all time great XI.

 

[hineyrulz]

Trent Boult is the first guy picked in my all time great XI.

I’d have him just behind Woakes, number 8 batsman FFS AG!!

 

[hineyrulz]

He has to be rated, clearly he achieved a lot as a test bowler - but there are many better English fast bowlers, and Trueman (I think) is the one that's as good as anybody

And Barnes, his record is outrageous.