Nathan Hindmarsh and Nathan Cayless

[cirque]

I do not think so Freak. I agree with colnel - Hindy and Cayless is not up to their standard they have set in. Cayless' s mind is elsewhere....

 

[cardinal]

Read Colonel's post again. And again if necessary.

I read his first post and thats when I sent mine. He said Cayless was frustrated and implied that Burty was a better leader at this stage. All I am saying is there are big reasons he is playing frustrated and if he needs to sit out some more games than maybe he should. I will not write off this club untill the season is gone and I have seen Cayless be an inspirational captain to many times not to back him to lead us out of this slump and that could start on sunday

 

[Freak2]

I don't doubt them as players and what they would do to win a premiership for this club. I do however doubt their credentials when the pressure is applied and the team starts to crumble.

Did you miss the arguments with the referee from both players or the stupid penalties that were given away out of sheer frustration? For me as two players who in your words "are the only players that truely bleed it and would do anything in their power to win a premiership for the club" I think it is a poor sign as leaders.

I don't doubt that their individual games warrant the points they receive but they are much more than individuals in this team. When the team really needs their heads to be level at a lot of times they aren't and for two guys who I respect as much as a lot opf players who have come and gone through this team its very disappointing to watch.

It is very hard to get a true sense of the occassion and the alledged discipline of players from a TV broacast. Yes you could (& I did) get a sense of their frustration but just look at the frustration this board has in the last 12 hours. It's only due to the hunger for glory! and maybe that isn't the best way to react to tough times but if it was a consistant issue fine, but I honestly believe Cayless leads by example and has done so for the good part of the last decade and for you to question that leadership pisses me off to be perfectly honest with you!

 

[The Colonel]

I think some people have missed the point - this isn't about the workrate of these two players. These two players above any other are the Mick Cronin and Ray Price of the early eighties - the heart and soul of the team, the players that everyone else looks to when they are behind on the scoreboard like they were last night. They should be setting the example for the young players.

When they are frustrated, arguing with the referee and giving away stupid penalties within our own half then you know it is going to be a long night. Once they have lost their heads it is hard to blame the rest of the team for losing theirs.

I think there are plenty of players last night who should be dropped for poor play but as long as our on field leaders are going to struggle when the team does we are always going to lose the games we shouldn't.

 

[The Colonel]

It is very hard to get a true sense of the occassion and the alledged discipline of players from a TV broacast. Yes you could (& I did) get a sense of their frustration but just look at the frustration this board has in the last 12 hours.

It is hard, but I have also had the pleasure of gaining the true sense of the occassion while sitting on the sideline too. My thoughts aren't necessarily based on one game.

It's only due to the hunger for glory! and maybe that isn't the best way to react to tough times but if it was a consistant issue fine, but I honestly believe Cayless leads by example and has done so for the good part of the last decade and for you to question that leadership pisses me off to be perfectly honest with you!

I don't care if it pisses you off to be perfectly honest and funnily enough I don't think I am the only person on the board who shares the same concerns. I think he is a very tough player who does a very good job within the Eels team but as a leader I think he struggles when the pressure is really applied and when a leader is truly needed. I have had that concern for a long time but as more and more senior players leave it becomes more evident. You need only look back to the game in 2005 versus the Cowboys and how our senior players played that day.

 

[Freak2]

Fair enough Colonel!

Luke Burt is obviously a better option, just ask all the boys and more importantly the coaching staff next time your down on the sideline!!!

I know your just as frustrated as I am and we have the common goal but we are going to have to agree to disagree on this matter!!

 

[cardinal]

I think some people have missed the point - this isn't about the workrate of these two players. These two players above any other are the Mick Cronin and Ray Price of the early eighties - the heart and soul of the team, the players that everyone else looks to when they are behind on the scoreboard like they were last night. They should be setting the example for the young players.

When they are frustrated, arguing with the referee and giving away stupid penalties within our own half then you know it is going to be a long night. Once they have lost their heads it is hard to blame the rest of the team for losing theirs.

I think there are plenty of players last night who should be dropped for poor play but as long as our on field leaders are going to struggle when the team does we are always going to lose the games we shouldn't.

Yeah Burty fits that discription just fine :sarcasm: . Mate Burt has played some great footy this year but he is not a captain and I think he would laugh if it were suggested to him. As I said he has player some good footy but his style of play as a fullback is to drift in and out of a game and there has still been to many games from him over the last few years where he has not given a yelp all game. The fact is we do not have a Price or Cronin in the side, so we will keep moving along with what we have.

 

[The Colonel]

Maybe Burty isn't the natural choice, nor the right one, but I'm not overly certain that Hindy and Caylo are either at this point in time. I'm not exactly certain we have a real leader within the team nor the lower grades at this point.

 

[Hellsy]

The boys have stated on many occaisions that they want Caylo as a leader, they must have some faith in him... not that that is the be all and end all, but as an employee you ahve to have faith in your leader

 

[Freak2]

As I suggested. This Sunday when holding up the run through flag simply drop the question to the players on the bench and the coaching staff. Maybe Johno might even have a opinion on this one!!

UNBELIEVABLE!!

 

[Bigfella]

think some people have missed the point - this isn't about the workrate of these two players. These two players above any other are the Mick Cronin and Ray Price of the early eighties - the heart and soul of the team, the players that everyone else looks to when they are behind on the scoreboard like they were last night. They should be setting the example for the young players.

And with them as the core of our leadership group, how many close games do we win?

How often do we win games in the last 10 or 20 minutes when they are in the balance?

How often do we perform our best at the end of the season?

How often do either of them produce an inspirational run or break when we are behind?

They are not immune from criticism as leaders. Hindmarsh is virtually above criticism as a player. Cayless as reportedly our highest paid player a front rower and captain is certainly not.

 

[BRAD BELLICK]

At one stage in the first half...after defending repeated sets on our line Cayless told the boys at the scrum to 'make sure they got to the kick'. It got picked up by the ref mic.

problem was he forget to tell himself and 4th tackle dropped the ball with a loose carry.

Anyone bagging Hindmarshs performance last nite has no idea. 60 odd tackles, and 15 carries is leading by example.

 

[Jono078]

What happend to Hindmarsh happend to Gidley..

Gidley was close to best player in the comp before origin, then he got injured and hasnt returned the same, atleast not playing the same role in the team as he did before origin..

Before origin Hindmarsh was on fire running wide, scoring a try a game..

Since he's come back from origin he's gotten into old habits of playing in the middle and defending everything? Although that could be a coaching thing, but it's silly because he was going great out wide earlier in the year.

Cayless has been great for you guys this year, but the problem is all your forwards are the same, Cayless and Cordoba are bloody identical, you need impact off the bench with a moimoi or Cannings.

IMO

8. Cayless
10. Cannings
14. Cordoba
15. Moimoi

That way you got impact and a steady player starting and coming off the bench.

Last night I didnt even know you had frontrowers playing besides Moimoi, not great if he's doing all the work and then expect him to make an impact.

Oh, and you definitely need Burt back, if not that, move Inu to fullback. Hayne has showed so little urgency, early in the second half he ran back to get the ball and he didnt even put his foot down to get out of his own in goal? And as it went the Dragons got an EASY dropout..

And ive noticed a lot of you talking about Grothe lately.. What's doing with him? In 2005 he was probably the best winger.. that year he looked so enthusiastic and confident.. I still remember against the Tigers he ran up and belted someone and then scored a try off the forced error, he needs to fire up or something with the finals just weeks away now.

 

[hineyrulz]

I have to agree with some of your points Colonel, but what do we do about it???? The cap is stretched to the limit. So it looks like more of the same next year.

 

[The Engineers Room]

There are some younger guys coming through but the real issue recently is the way we don't trouble opposition defences.

 

[CrazyEel]

I have to agree with some of your points Colonel, but what do we do about it???? The cap is stretched to the limit. So it looks like more of the same next year.

That's what quite a few of us have been concerned about for some time.

 

[Parra Guru]

I dunno Big C, I think it was hard to vote this week because so many played like sh*t

 

[Hurriflatch]

Parra lost the game when Ian came off

after that big break the Dragons got their heads switched on

Parra lost theirs and the game

 

[Haynzy]

I agree that Hindy and Caylo have shown frustration and a lack of strong leadership lately.
They need to be challenged.

Earlier in the season when Caylo was playing out of his skin and Hindy seemed to be discovering some of his old flair and the team was winning I don't recall anyone questioning their leadership ability.

Yes a good test of leadership is how it stands up under adversity but as the boys have proven in the past they CAN do the job.

I hope that the coaching staff have picked up on it and are able to get them back on track.

As Hells said, the boys have all said they want Caylo as captain.....If they and the Coach agree it's unlikely to change anytime soon.

The fat lady is warming up but she hasn't started singing yet.

 

[goboggo]

I agree that Hindy and Caylo have shown frustration and a lack of strong leadership lately.
They need to be challenged.

Earlier in the season when Caylo was playing out of his skin and Hindy seemed to be discovering some of his old flair and the team was winning I don't recall anyone questioning their leadership ability.

Interesting that at the start of the year Hindy and Caylo both said that being out of their comfort zones with a new coach had motivated them. Now Hagan is playing all the vets and they seem to have a mortgage on their positions.

I think Hages needs to rattle a few cages.