NRL, AFL and Union to shutdown for 8 weeks

[Paullyboy]

That post by Chriso was just sad. It really was, the arrogance being displayed would indicate that his sport was in a position of power in our country. I hate to break it to you, it's not.

Soccer has high participation rates for two reasons - it's the safer option for younger children and parents lean towards that and because it's played in more schools, once again, because of the safety element. When these kids are old enough to make their own choice about what sport they play soccer gets ditched straight away.

There was one other point in your post I wanted to bring up. You made it very clear you are very much against anglo-saxan Australians, yet have the nerve to suggest someone who doesnt support the Australian soccer team is not Australian enough? I love this country, but I have no interest in the Socceroos and couldn't care less if they never won another game. They dont represent me, they represent Manchester, Leeds and Aston Villa for all I care.

 

[Chriso]

Hi Guys and Kurt Angle

I didnt mean to upset anyone. Both sports are entertaining. Can't we all agree its unAustralian to reject a sporting competition when it would inject $6 billion into our economy.

On other notes:

1. Trend Toward Football (Soccer) Than League Amongst Children

Refer to the table "Childrens Participation in Organised Sports" at the Australian Bureau of Statistics (the following link).

It indicates far stronger numbers in Football than any other sport. 160,000 more children were reported to play Football than League in 2000, 2003 and 2006.

2. Anti Skip Comments

You can't believe how surprised I am to hear that. I'm an Aussie. Born and bred here, my family goes back many many generations

Regarding the Mediterranean Descendant Ball Comments: I think every kid gets smacked around a little bit in Primary School in one way or another, personally didnt bother me as much as the psychological assessment you offerred me

However from my own encounters, Mediterranean Descendants are amongst the most passionate supporters of Rugby League. Aren't the Bulldogs team one of the most supported teams in League with a large ethnic followship?

3. More Technically Challenging for a Child

Ok, we're talking kids here, not the adult level of the sport.

Question: What would happen if you put an 8 year old against a 13 year old in a Rugby League match?
Answer: the 13 year old would be more likely to win because of the massive strength advantage marginalising the benefits good technique offers.

This is an issue with with children because onset of puberty results in children with differentiated levels of relative strength at any given age group. This differentiation makes a contact sport less appealing, especially to those that experience puberty later on.

This early onset of puberty and physical development is more common amongst Pacific Islanders. A reference that discusses this is

SMH (eh)
"Islanders in Junior Leagues, It's a Really Big Issue"
(cant post links because my post count is less than 20.)

4. Standard of Football in Australia

The A-League is undoubtedly better than the NSL. Although I would accept that someone who isn't interested in Football wouldn't identify the difference.

Crowd attendances may of gone down this year. It's likely been affected by the current recession, perhaps like most sports in Australia.

Other reasons may be the "Flavour of the Month" affect the A-League has enjoyed has declined. This would be natural; if this has occured and its still got these crowd levels then the transformation from NSL to A-League has been extremely successful so far.

Henceforth it would be an issue of continued brand development. Passionate supporter bases are constructed over time; a new club needs to integrate itself with the community for a long time before it becomes comfortably adopted by the masses.

Other issues the standard of Football in Australia will suffer from are the inevitable losses of their best players to foreign nations. It's highly unlikely A-League will ever compete with the top European clubs for the best talent, thus will always remain a secondary level of global competition.

However this might also be an avenue to develop more homegrown talent in professional competitions, allowing the construction of a stronger national team.

5. National and International Developments

Well, the Socceroos are playing infinately more games than they were in say 2000. Heck, their actually playing! The entrance into the Asian confederation means their receiving top quality competitive international matches reguarly, as opposed to a two leg shootout for the final World Cup position. This change means a display of respect from world nations regarding Australia's importance on the global stage.

The increase in games means more players are getting international experience; improving our player base in domestic leagues enabling greater competitiveness in the domestic A-League product.

Development of younger players: we're producing better overall players: perhaps not as many at the Harry Kewell, Mark Viduka, Tim Cahill level; however these players are recognised as the most successful in Australian History. It's a bit much to ask they step up and become equally, if not more successful.

The reference to the Australian Under 20's performance was interesting. The team admittedly lost each of its 3 matches; with suggestions added that the quality of these players is below average.
Strategy; combined with player ability does win matches. Perhaps the team was deficient in these areas; however only 1 or 2 players per generation need step up to the full international Socceroo team to ensure the progression of the squad.

I believe their is good talent in as yet unknown players Vidosic, Holman, Carle, that will improve over time.

6. Country Players Make Up The QLD and NSW Teams; Not PI's

I'm not sure of this but correct me if I'm wrong.

Doesn't the State of Origin act as a catalyst for selecting the those players that represent the Kangaroo's?

If so; wouldnt the percentage of Pacific Islanders (who have foreign loyalties); more likely not be involved thus explaining why most of the NSW team might come from Country locations?

Just putting it out there...

7. Kids Prefer Ronaldo, Beckham, instead of Moimoi, Hayne..etc

You asked me to quantify this belief. It's admittedly hard to measure; however I'd suggest the number of jerseys that possess Football loyalties compared with League clubs might be a start.

I see hundreds more Manchester United "Beckham, Rooney, Ronaldo" shirts than I've seen League jerseys. Maybe that might be an acceptable initial insight into the popularity of these sports.

8. Statement of Changing Demographic Interests

An example I can think of about changing demographics affecting the interest in different types of sport would be Japan.

Sumo has and is struggling with changing preferences of younger demographics over time with the onset of Baseball, Union, Football, Motor Racing, etc.

These new sports maintained critical interest in younger demographics as well as holding them into their older stages of life. Over time; this continued growth cemented their strength at the expense of Sumo.

Perhaps its arguable that a World Cup would inspire and hold interest in younger demographics longer..in which case that would be an issue for League; but altogether unavoidable.

9. Continue the NRL in Regional, Island Locations

If its capable of being held without compromising local security then it might be possible. However would it be wise of the NRL who are motivated by TV ratings, brand retention of sponsorships, etc...to compete directly with the BIGGEST (bigger than the Olympics, Superbowl - Im a Chicago Bears Fan BTW) Sporting event in the world?

It would seem obviously a smarter decision to stop the NRL for a period of 8 weeks than risk upsetting relationships with existing local fans, sponsors etc.

Would it be possible to start the NRL competition perhaps 3 weeks early; ending 3 weeks later than normal? Or provide mid week matches?

10. However the Most Important Issue Is!

I didn't mean to upset anyone. Both sports are entertaning. Can't we agree that its unAustralian to reject a sporting competition that could inject $6 billion into our economy throughout all states of the nation?

Fortunately, even if you don't agree, unbiased minds will make the decision and legislate necessary changes in law to ensure its successful performance.

-Chriso

 

[BIKER_DRAGON]

Tell 'em their f**king dreaming

 

[Nevan_]

4. Standard of Football in Australia

The A-League is undoubtedly better than the NSL. Although I would accept that someone who isn't interested in Football wouldn't identify the difference.

Crowd attendances may of gone down this year. It's likely been affected by the current recession, perhaps like most sports in Australia.

Other reasons may be the "Flavour of the Month" affect the A-League has enjoyed has declined. This would be natural; if this has occured and its still got these crowd levels then the transformation from NSL to A-League has been extremely successful so far.

Henceforth it would be an issue of continued brand development. Passionate supporter bases are constructed over time; a new club needs to integrate itself with the community for a long time before it becomes comfortably adopted by the masses.

Other issues the standard of Football in Australia will suffer from are the inevitable losses of their best players to foreign nations. It's highly unlikely A-League will ever compete with the top European clubs for the best talent, thus will always remain a secondary level of global competition.

However this might also be an avenue to develop more homegrown talent in professional competitions, allowing the construction of a stronger national team.

The salary cap is the major issue regarding the standard. The salary cap is a must in the A-Leagues infancy. Without it, clubs like Gold Coast, Sydney and Melbourne would have an advantage on the other teams. The standard has slowly been improving since the leagues inception. Which means the average players skill is increasing because of better coaching, training and facilities etc. The salary cap will be lifted once the clubs are safe financially.

The game is also improving at the grassroots level. The FFA have implemented new programs to train and develop young, talented players. In 25 years, the standard of the A-League should be much higher than it is today.

 

[BIKER_DRAGON]

This story being true has about as much credability as Norman Gunston's Dreamtime Stories......Especially the one about the underpants.

 

[Devilous]

Chriso, mate, seriously.

The FFA need to tread very lightly with this bid, if they piss off the AFL and NRL and there goes the bid.

End of story.

 

[Red Bear]

A world cup in Australia would be brilliant

Some very short sighted people here - the benifits with stadia etc will be huge, i am willing to have a slightly diminished season as a one off if we can get the 2022 world cup (2018 will almost certainly go to England, if not them another european country, although then europe is out of the 2022 running).
You can say also that soccer participation rate sdrop once kids get to make up their mind, but fact of the matter is it would still comfortably the most participated in sport at all levels (juniors, mens, womens, 35+). My personal favourite sport as far as spectating goes is rugby league, but soccer is much better to play IMO

 

[BIKER_DRAGON]

A world cup in Australia would be brilliant

Some very short sighted people here - the benifits with stadia etc will be huge, i am willing to have a slightly diminished season as a one off if we can get the 2022 world cup (2018 will almost certainly go to England, if not them another european country, although then europe is out of the 2022 running).
You can say also that soccer participation rate sdrop once kids get to make up their mind, but fact of the matter is it would still comfortably the most participated in sport at all levels (juniors, mens, womens, 35+). My personal favourite sport as far as spectating goes is rugby league, but soccer is much better to play IMO

Last time i looked this was Australia, the 2 biggest winter time sports in this country are Rugby League and Aussie Rules. Why the hell should their comps be interupted by this tired old boring Dinosaur game known as Soccer. Whats next....both games are stopped for 2 months for the World Series of Soggy Sao.

Soccer in Australia can go to Hell for all i care.

 

[Loudstrat]

Chriso you twat. If you see plenty of Man U jumpers with Beckham's name on it they are obviously not Beckham fans anymore than a kid with a Tigers jumper with "Prince" on it!

And how can Fifa (should be FISA BTW because it doesn't include all football codes) stop the NRL playing? How can it stop Parra v Saints at Parra? Obviously the NRL would have to be onside before Soccer Australia even considers a bid, or FISA would ignore the bid and give it to Chad or some other country without more popular sports for it to disrupt.

In local high schools here League balls during recess/lunch are more common than Soccer balls by at least 2-1. Which is Soccer's problem in Australia. Apart from the US - Soccer has never held a world cup where it wasn't the dominant football code. SA will be the second, but it has only one competitor - Union. In Australia there are 3 football codes competing with Soccer on a comparable scale. In the UK where Union and League are strong, Soccer is on a completely different scale, and wouldn't disrupt either code bar a few northern grounds. Again I ask the question: were the NFL/Basketball/baseball seasons interrupted at all during the US Soccer WC?

 

[ElectricEelMan]

7. Kids Prefer Ronaldo, Beckham, instead of Moimoi, Hayne..etc
I see hundreds more Manchester United "Beckham, Rooney, Ronaldo" shirts than I've seen League jerseys. Maybe that might be an acceptable initial insight into the popularity of these sports.
-Chriso

Seriously, where the F*CK do you live?
In Brisbane there is about a 100:1 ratio of leagus jerseys to soccer jerseys

 

[Loudstrat]

And Rooney played for Penrith anyway.

 

[duck_dodgers]

Again I ask the question: were the NFL/Basketball/baseball seasons interrupted at all during the US Soccer WC?

If the NFL was played during June & July then probably but the NFL season runs between September and January . 30 of the existing 31 NFL stadiums are part the USA's current bid for the World Cup .

The NBA season runs between November & May and their courts aren't compatible with soccer fields either

And the MLB did run , however 1994 was the year of the infamous players strike which halted that sport in August and damaged it for years afterwards .

Hope that helps .

 

[Loudstrat]

Cheers.

If the NBA ran, how come League can't run on grounds Soccer won't use?

 

[duck_dodgers]

Cheers.

If the NBA ran, how come League can't run on grounds Soccer won't use?

Ever notice how much bigger the USA is than Australia ? And all the stadiums they already have ? There's college football grounds that hold more than 100K ... http://www.collegecharlie.com/stadiums.html

Drawing analogies between the 2 countries is like saying Wendell Sailors @rse is the same as an ants .

But the grounds thing is only part of the issue .

rightly or wrongly FIFA want all available police and public transport systems to concentrate on their tournament and nothing else for that period . It is after all the world's biggest sporting event and our football codes changed their schedules to accomodate the world's 2nd biggest sporting event in the year 2000 .

As for playing games at suburban grounds like Parra , Leichhardt , etc that aren't being used for the WC games ... you have to remember that there will be 32 teams setting up camp and training at most of those venues prior to the event actually starting . There's individual players in most of those teams that get paid more than the NRL salary cap on their own . Expecting them to train on sub standard fields has a snowflakes chance in hell .

If the miracle happens and Frank Lowy greases enough palms to jag the event down under , then the only way the NRL & AFL comps can continue during that period is probably in the bush .

 

[Coppo_ForeverYOUNG]

If it were to happen an 8 week world club tournament also including smaller rugby league nations should run I reckon. Also if the season is to be cut shorter due to the world cup, season ticket holders should be given free tickets to attend matches if not compensated by FIFA for what they would be losing out on

 

[Loudstrat]

Ever notice how much bigger the USA is than Australia ? And all the stadiums they already have ? There's college football grounds that hold more than 100K ... http://www.collegecharlie.com/stadiums.html

Drawing analogies between the 2 countries is like saying Wendell Sailors @rse is the same as an ants .

Whose comparing countries sizes? Im comparing the disruption caused by a soccer WC.

But the grounds thing is only part of the issue .

rightly or wrongly FIFA want all available police and public transport systems to concentrate on their tournament and nothing else for that period . It is after all the world's biggest sporting event and our football codes changed their schedules to accomodate the world's 2nd biggest sporting event in the year 2000 .

Surely the cannot expect the nations workforce to grind to a halt, which is what you are suggesting if the nations infrastructure cannot cather for the needs of the woprkforce. During peak hour (now 8 hours per day in Sydney) there IS no available public transport.

As for playing games at suburban grounds like Parra , Leichhardt , etc that aren't being used for the WC games ... you have to remember that there will be 32 teams setting up camp and training at most of those venues prior to the event actually starting . There's individual players in most of those teams that get paid more than the NRL salary cap on their own . Expecting them to train on sub standard fields has a snowflakes chance in hell .

Were there not 32 soccer teams in the Sydney Olympics in 2000? We coped then - and a hell of a lot bigger than a 32 team comp with 11 players per side spread over an entire country.

Ending the season 2 weeks early for the greater good of sport was the right thing to do. An 8 week disruption for a competitor is a totally different thing, and if FIFA are going to use 10 rl grounds, the SCG, Showground, Concord, NSO, the Redfern training facility, and Belmore and the Union grounds like Milner Field, Manly Oval, Coogee Oval, Trumper Park as well as Bluetongue and Win when they are only playing games at SFS and ANZ - what's that - almost one ground per player? All would be suitable for training venues, plus specialist training venues belongong to clubs and other sports.

There are plenty of training locations available. Hell, they can even be shared.

 

[Teddyboy]

The good,the bad and the ugly.
The good
as the NRL only draws big crowds to it's suburban grounds and not the ANZ/SFS so it doesn't make any difference.
A great advert for Rugby League(and sadly AFL)as Soccer fans from aboard might be popping in to Brookvale amongst others for a night of local sport(as well as the big screens will be out at the NRL; grounds for the soccer).

The bad
Anymore upgrades for a Rugby League ground will result in more empty seats and the NRL should watch and learn from what will happen to South African Rugby Union and Soccer after 2010 world cup ends.

The ugly
Soccer is f**king sh*t and it's supporters are narrow minded wankers.

 

[Goddo]

Teddyboy, I think you are wrong on the upgrades, it will be good.

As has been said, the NRL won't be run during the world cup if we get it. Teams will be camped at grounds, eg Brazil is at WIN stadium, England at Parramatta, France at Brookvale et cetera. 32 teams requiring world class facilities. This will mean training facilities at our clubs will be upgraded big time.

Canberra probably loses quite a few fans because the weather at their stadium is terrible. If they get a nice all seater with a good roof and improved transport, their crowds will probably go up. I hate sitting there in the freezing wind and rain, fog settling in. Not fun.

Most of the 45k venues (latest goss being Penrith, EA Stadium, Dairy Farmers, Canberra, (and ovals Adelaide Oval, Carara)) would be reduced after the event and would end up longer term more like Skilled Park. The removable stands would be relocated to other grounds (such as behind the goals at Parra or Campbeltown), better facilities and capacity brought to 30k ish for those used in the bid, so its win win for everyone.

The only places where there will be more empty seats will be the grounds permanently upgraded, but they will be the big city venues or venues that want to draw bigger events (possibly Canberra and Newcastle) so its not a problem.

 

[The Engineers Room]

They won't use all the venues. I can see us cutting a deal to keep some grounds and continue with split rounds and/or teams having their home games weighted to both sides of the lock out.

 

[Raidersrawesome]

They will hold super weekends at grounds like Narellan Sports Ground.