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NRL considering eligibility overhaul

hutch

First Grade
Messages
6,810
Did anyone see the crisis story in today's daily telegraph about Polynesians taking over rugby league and ruining the Kangaroos. Dean Ritchie is an absolute merkin of the highest order, a buzz rothfield clone. These big bad Polynesian men taking our spots, even though half of them are Aussies. As for graham lowe, why would he even care. Just enjoy the fact that the kiwis are the best team at the moment. The fact that he said Samoa and Tonga have gone past Australia is quite possibly the dumbest thing I've read.
 

deal.with.it

Juniors
Messages
2,086
We need a stand down period of 2 years if you want to swap nations.
After this SoO eligibility changes are made, nation swapping will be the biggest hurdle we need to overcome in our search for respect as a world sport.
These eligibility changes will see rugby league quickly overcome rugby union as the code with more competitive nations.
In 10 years, we will see Serbia, Ukraine, Russia, USA, Canada, joining our second tier nations of pacific islands and celtic nations.
We will also see the likes of Samoa, Fiji, PNG and hopefully Wales moving up to tier 1 status.
It's the inevitable, and we should be planning for such a scenario.
Tonga, Scotland and Ireland need to follow the path that previous mentioned tier 2s have taken.
It is difficult to see Cook Islands, Vanuatu, Jamaica etc. ever moving beyond tier 2. But that is ok.
Rugby union really only has 4 nations capable of winning the WC. Rugby League has 3.
The times will change very quickly.
 

juro

Bench
Messages
3,826
Had to laugh at the bit where he said all Australia could dangle in front of players eligible to play for multiple nations was State of Origin. What about the cash? Or regular international games?

It will continue to be the case for many years to come that Australia will get first pick of the players, with countries like Samoa picking up whatever is left afterwards.
 

franklin2323

Immortal
Messages
33,546
We need a stand down period of 2 years if you want to swap nations.
After this SoO eligibility changes are made, nation swapping will be the biggest hurdle we need to overcome in our search for respect as a world sport.
These eligibility changes will see rugby league quickly overcome rugby union as the code with more competitive nations.
In 10 years, we will see Serbia, Ukraine, Russia, USA, Canada, joining our second tier nations of pacific islands and celtic nations.
We will also see the likes of Samoa, Fiji, PNG and hopefully Wales moving up to tier 1 status.
It's the inevitable, and we should be planning for such a scenario.
Tonga, Scotland and Ireland need to follow the path that previous mentioned tier 2s have taken.
It is difficult to see Cook Islands, Vanuatu, Jamaica etc. ever moving beyond tier 2. But that is ok.
Rugby union really only has 4 nations capable of winning the WC. Rugby League has 3.
The times will change very quickly.

Yep. Can't just miss out on a tier 1 and go straight to a tier 2. Just crazy
 

mikail-eagle

Bench
Messages
3,067
http://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/sta...mpelling-feature/story-fn31yxah-1227339636422


Making Pacific players eligible for State of Origin risks ruining the series’ most compelling feature

Paul Kent The Daily Telegraph


NOBODY can properly explain why State of Origin works. It shouldn’t.

In the early 1980s Queensland had no team in the big competition in Sydney but they won anyway. For many years they had one team, the Broncos, against 10 Sydney clubs plus Canberra, and they still won.

Even now they have just three teams and yet just a gentle reminder and they will tell you they have still won eight of the past nine series.

You could argue Queensland put an unhealthy emphasis on Origin. Just a short walk down Caxton St is required to confirm it.

But it works because only a Queenslander understands and because we have no other choice but to take them at their word.

And now the NRL wants to tinker with that.

A planned review of the eligibility rules will surely include State of Origin eligibility and whether, given the mighty performance of the Pacific teams over rep weekend, their development might be further accelerated by allowing players to turn out for Fiji or Tonga or Samoa or wherever they are from but also play for Queensland or NSW.

Don’t blow it.

Origin’s mystery formula is still the magic that makes it work.

Nobody can guarantee that if it is ever broken they will be able to get it back.

And for what? To cash in on a feel-good moment after unexpected fun from one weekend of rep football.

We must stop using Origin as a bargaining chip.

When Sam Burgess signed to play rugby last year South Sydney owner Russell Crowe came out the following day saying that if Burgess had been allowed to play Origin he might have stayed.

It immediately created debate, driven by emotion, so always the worst kind, over the role Origin should play in strengthening the NRL competition.

Sonny Bill Williams never deserted his Kiwi allegiance but an offhand remark about how he’d love to play Origin sparked a thousand conversations.

Williams was saying it from a competitive point of view, an acknowledgment that Origin was considered the toughest environment in rugby league and he would love to test himself.

The Blues even examined whether Williams could play Origin in 2013, only to learn he no longer satisfied the revamped eligibility criteria.

Don’t worry, it was a possibility.


Making Pacific players eligible for State of Origin risks ruining the series’ most compelling feature
Paul Kent The Daily Telegraph May 06, 2015 10:55PM SHARE

20
Origin: Rep round reaction4:43
NOBODY can properly explain why State of Origin works. It shouldn’t.

In the early 1980s Queensland had no team in the big competition in Sydney but they won anyway. For many years they had one team, the Broncos, against 10 Sydney clubs plus Canberra, and they still won.

Even now they have just three teams and yet just a gentle reminder and they will tell you they have still won eight of the past nine series.

You could argue Queensland put an unhealthy emphasis on Origin. Just a short walk down Caxton St is required to confirm it.

An exciting weekend of Pacific Test footy has raised Origin eligibility questions.
An exciting weekend of Pacific Test footy has raised Origin eligibility questions.Source: News Corp Australia
SHAKE-UP: NRL considering eligibility overhaul

IKIN: Why Test shaming spells trouble for NSW



VIDEO: Origin crisis? What crisis, says Daley

But it works because only a Queenslander understands and because we have no other choice but to take them at their word.

And now the NRL wants to tinker with that.

A planned review of the eligibility rules will surely include State of Origin eligibility and whether, given the mighty performance of the Pacific teams over rep weekend, their development might be further accelerated by allowing players to turn out for Fiji or Tonga or Samoa or wherever they are from but also play for Queensland or NSW.

Don’t blow it.

Origin’s mystery formula is still the magic that makes it work.

Nobody can guarantee that if it is ever broken they will be able to get it back.

And for what? To cash in on a feel-good moment after unexpected fun from one weekend of rep football.

We must stop using Origin as a bargaining chip.

When Sam Burgess signed to play rugby last year South Sydney owner Russell Crowe came out the following day saying that if Burgess had been allowed to play Origin he might have stayed.

It immediately created debate, driven by emotion, so always the worst kind, over the role Origin should play in strengthening the NRL competition.

Who's a Roo no more?3:04
Sonny Bill Williams never deserted his Kiwi allegiance but an offhand remark about how he’d love to play Origin sparked a thousand conversations.

Williams was saying it from a competitive point of view, an acknowledgment that Origin was considered the toughest environment in rugby league and he would love to test himself.

The Blues even examined whether Williams could play Origin in 2013, only to learn he no longer satisfied the revamped eligibility criteria.

Don’t worry, it was a possibility.

Should Pacific players be eligible for Origin?
Yes, they're such a big part of the NRL now anyway
Something to consider, the game has to keep growing
No, it's NSW v Qld - and if it ain't broke, don't fix it
VoteView ResultsPolldaddy.com
On NRL360 on Tuesday night a viewer put up the idea whether a Pacific nations tour, brought together much like the England and Ireland Lions, would be feasible.

It is such a tremendous idea the leagues should be working on funding for a northern hemisphere tour right now.

Send them over for when New Zealand tour England at season’s end.

Turn that investment into development, but don’t pollute Origin by bringing in players whose priority is elsewhere.

For years this has frustrated the growing force in international football, New Zealand.

Benji Marshall was on NRL360 on Tuesday night questioning its place as a second-rate contest.

“We thrive on representing our country and there just seems to be many people in Australia that talk about Origin being the pinnacle, and not so much playing for your country,’’ Marshall said.

“And that’s a little bit confusing for me because wouldn’t you want to represent your country more than your state?

“It just seems like Origin is pumped up, it’s more important to make Origin than it is for Australia.”

Origin’s rise to prominence happened organically.

It’s appearance in the 1980s coincided with a drop in international standards — the Kiwis and Great Britain struggled for any consistent result against the Kangaroos — and in that vacuum Origin stepped up.

Nobody came in and said they were going to make Origin the number one game in town. Channel 9 did not create the interest, but reacted to it.

It was the football that got it there.

It happened because Queensland upped the stakes and forced NSW to equally buy in or get left behind.

New Zealand is finally getting itself to a similar place. If the Kiwis can continue their trajectory Australia will be forced to match them or get left behind.

Other nations should be encouraged to do the same, not gifted Origin starts to cash in on current trends of goodwill.
 

Craig Johnston

First Grade
Messages
5,396
what's he on about, it's very easy to explain why origin is so popular, it's because you have 1 side that has a GIANT chip on it's shoulder from years of being flogged pre origin now forever trying to outdo big brother and the other side being the old master if you will, bigger better stronger etc...and we have a right to feel that way and always will.

bit like us vs the poms in the ashes. it's called a RIVALRY. until the kiwis start getting up on us regularly like the toads did from origin a rivalry on that level will never exist. the kiwis getting their act together at the moment is a good thing for international league
 

RedVee

First Grade
Messages
7,194
We need a stand down period of 2 years if you want to swap nations.
After this SoO eligibility changes are made, nation swapping will be the biggest hurdle we need to overcome in our search for respect as a world sport.
These eligibility changes will see rugby league quickly overcome rugby union as the code with more competitive nations.
In 10 years, we will see Serbia, Ukraine, Russia, USA, Canada, joining our second tier nations of pacific islands and celtic nations.
We will also see the likes of Samoa, Fiji, PNG and hopefully Wales moving up to tier 1 status.
It's the inevitable, and we should be planning for such a scenario.
Tonga, Scotland and Ireland need to follow the path that previous mentioned tier 2s have taken.
It is difficult to see Cook Islands, Vanuatu, Jamaica etc. ever moving beyond tier 2. But that is ok.
Rugby union really only has 4 nations capable of winning the WC. Rugby League has 3.
The times will change very quickly.

OK - so Samoa becoming a Tier 1 then precludes their players from Origin.... Which causes less Australian Samoans to choose Samoa... and with still very few Island based players do they then fall to Tier 2 when the players that took them to T1 decline.

Or is T1 forever set at Eng, Aust, NZ ?

I didn't bother reading m-e's post once I saw who the author was.

He talks about the strong performance of the Island teams yet just days before the games declared he would not watch them....
 

siv

First Grade
Messages
6,782
Allow players to switch from the Big 3 to Tier 2 nations immediate up until RLWC 2017

But after that players need to sit out 2 years before they can change eg Mead situation

Also U18s U20s and domestic reo games to also count in determjning qualification
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
Allow players to switch from the Big 3 to Tier 2 nations immediate up until RLWC 2017

But after that players need to sit out 2 years before they can change eg Mead situation

Also U18s U20s and domestic reo games to also count in determjning qualification

Yep, i definitely reckon there needs to be a window for the current lot to pick their allegiances...

For one, i reckon Aku Uate would love to get back into the Fiji jumper if it meant not giving up his shot at the NSW team.
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
How does this work? Only emerging nations concerned? Sounds good...

I guess it means you can pick NSW/QLD (assuming you qualify) and any 2nd/3rd tier nation...

But, once you play for England, NZ (or any nation that moves up to the 1st Tier), they are out of Origin contention.

seriously though, i can see this hurting the kiwis, for example someone like roger tuivasa scheck's agent going up to him and saying "rodger you can earn more by playing origin and samoa then you can just playing for nz". who would he choose to play for?

Could happen with the English team as well...

Ireland, Scottland, etc. are 2nd Tier, so the English lot could jump there and potentially qualify for Origin. (but i would question how many Kiwi/English players would qualify under the "played in Aust. before they were 13")
 
Last edited:

Rodney

Juniors
Messages
243
RTS wouldn't be eligible for Origin, Neither pretty much all the English team besides maybe Jack Reed and Adam Cuthbertson if he gets picked.

They would only lose out on people living a decent chunk of their lives in Australia, who along with being eligible for them are eligible for a tier two nation which is a minority.

The major effect a move like this will have is that fringe Origin players will be much more willing to align with heritage teams as they'd probably be equally as likely to win an origin spot.
This'll get difficult if Test Nations start playing matches during origin though when Origin goes standalone again.

I don't think its going to happen
 

roughyedspud

Coach
Messages
12,181
In reguards to englishmen being eligible for origin....im deadset against it but technically jack reed would be....but yeah im fine with englishmen and kiwis not being eligible....go for your life with fiji,tonga,samoa,ireland,wales etc...


But i can see it damaging nz abit....if a player is eligible for oz by residency,nz by birth and a island via heritage..and thats a decent number of players,then they are going to choose "origin & a island" aren't they?
 

RedVee

First Grade
Messages
7,194
So how is tier 1 determined into the future ? I hope there is a " home competition " threshold, so that only nations with a sizeable domestic setup can become tier 1.

Is there a father/son clause in the Intl eligibility rules?
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
So how is tier 1 determined into the future ? I hope there is a " home competition " threshold, so that only nations with a sizeable domestic setup can become tier 1.

Is there a father/son clause in the Intl eligibility rules?

I assume teams would have to partition for their own assent, so i doubt unwilling groups will be forced...

There would be benefits to being Tier 1 (eg. automatic selection in major tournaments), but, as you say, there would need to be a decent domestic comp.

(i wouldnt be surprised is PNG become tier 1 if they ever get a local NRL team)
 

Scubby

Juniors
Messages
395
Meninga didnt pick that team. Keep trying though.

Yep, he had nothing at all to do with this according to this article :sarcasm:

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...under20s-and-bypass-samoa-20140426-zqzv7.html

"It has been reported Queensland coach Mal Meninga has held discussions with the 19-year-old about his possible selection in this year's Origin series, prompting him to withdraw from Samoa,.

Meninga did not return calls on Saturday, but Walters admitted it was unfortunate the schedule hasn't allowed Milford to play for both Samoa and Queensland."
 
Last edited:

geordie_saint

Juniors
Messages
141
So how is tier 1 determined into the future?

It shouldn't be determined; there should be no such thing. Classifying nations such as Samoa, Ireland et al as Tier 2 nations is a tool used by Australia, NZ and England to do as they please. Simply allow those Australian or Pacific Island players eligible to play in Origin to play for the Pacific Islands as well without having to declare for Australia if they don't want to.

Make people make a decision early in their careers and stick to it based around an enhanced international competition where nations like Tonga and Scotland play a good number of international fixtures. I don't think it would weaken either Origin or International RL in general but boy would it remove the mess we are currently in.
 
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