Parra Juniors

[Terry the Parra God]

What is wrong with the Parra JRL system?
Parra spend a lot of time developing young players and then fail to keep them blaming the salary cap.
Surely they can plan a lot better than they are for these situations.

 

[MarkInTheStands]

I fail to see how that is a JRL Problem or even a Junior Reps Problem.

So far the 2 Players from our junior System we have let go are John Mannah and Tony Williams. Both were let go because they were offered better money by other teams. It is our Prioritising of these Juniors and the amount of money available in the Salary cap that limits us from keeping them. If we didn't have a cap, I am quite sure we would be able to match their offers, but in this cap environment, some of these players are not valued as highly as they maybe at other clubs when you compare our entire list.

 

[jono]

As MITS says , it's not the fault of the Junior league .If anything ParraJRL should be congratulated for the outstanding job it does in cultivating and nurturing such an ultimately successful pool of juniors who are all obviusly the envy of all the other NRL clubs .
There would not be ONE NRL club who does not have at least one successful Parra junior amomgst its ranks.
No ,the blame for losing a promsing junior such as Tony Williams lies with
a. primarirly the NRL's lack of cap concession for juniors and
b. the crap shoot that is the Parra DRLC selection of keeping the RIGHT juniors.

 

[parra-matters]

nothing at all wrong with our jnr system, just we have so many quality juniors some have to leave to get paid what they are worth, with the salary cap you can't keep all your superstars or even some of the potental ones.
It's just a fact of life in the NRL and until the NRL can get more revenue (a better tv rights deal would help) then all clubs with big junior bases will lose some of their young talent or the NRL will keep lossing players to the ESL.

 

[bartman]

The cap is a very good thing too, just quietly. I'd much rather have it in place so the teams whose leagues clubs can make the most money (through pokies etc) don't just have open slather with their cheque books over the rest of the clubs - that's not a competition that becomes fun to watch, and it's not a recipe for making our game sustainable or competitive in the crowded sports market.

Even if it means that we lose some juniors to the higher offers of other clubs as part of needing to meet the cap, I think that's OK, and just the price we pay for being one of the best junior development areas in town.

I don't think raising the cap is the answer, as there's not enough money in the game. I think it's about rebuilding the attitude among young players that they should be proud to play for their club and there's no need for forever escalating player wages, as opposed to having players and their managers acting like mercenaries chasing blood money from wherever they can get it (union, England, other clubs, or bending their own club).

 

[parra-matters]

Don't get me wrong, i'm not blaming the cap, without we would be down to about 6 teams now. The cap is good, and if the NRL could get more money in and up the grant to clubs then the Cap could be raised higher and we could keep more players at their junior club and in the NRL.

 

[Gronk]

As MITS says , it's not the fault of the Junior league .If anything ParraJRL should be congratulated for the outstanding job it does in cultivating and nurturing such an ultimately successful pool of juniors who are all obviusly the envy of all the other NRL clubs .
There would not be ONE NRL club who does not have at least one successful Parra junior amomgst its ranks.
No ,the blame for losing a promsing junior such as Tony Williams lies with
a. primarirly the NRL's lack of cap concession for juniors and
b. the crap shoot that is the Parra DRLC selection of keeping the RIGHT juniors.

Cap concessions make sense. Develop a player from Harold Matthews level into a top 25 player and you should get a return on your investment.

 

[Tizzun]

Cap concessions make sense. Develop a player from Harold Matthews level into a top 25 player and you should get a return on your investment.

I like the idea but clubs with a small junior base (read Roosters and Manly) will fight it. If it did happen then those clubs would just focus on "recruiting" (read throw money at) the better HM players from Parra and Penrith.

I would like to know (but it would be a difficult process to determine) the stats on how many HM players from each team go on to play NRL for that team or another? I'm guessing Parra and Penrith have a better conversion rate than most?

 

[Gronk]

I like the idea but clubs with a small junior base (read Roosters and Manly) will fight it. If it did happen then those clubs would just focus on "recruiting" (read throw money at) the better HM players from Parra and Penrith.

All ready happening Tizzun. Roosters won S G Ball this year right ? Their junior league consists of Paddo, Bondi, Clovelly & St Charles all of whom play in the Souths Juniors comp. Clearly they recruited their whole squad.

 

[murraymob]

the whole concesion thing was brought up a the recent ceo meeting only supported by i think penrith parra tigers i am sure it was opposed by the other clubs

 

[Suitman]

the whoole concesion thing was brought up a the recent ceo meetting only supported by i think penrith parra tigers i am sure it was opposed by the other clubs

This is where the NRL should step in and show some leadership.
Seriously, where is the incentive for clubs like the Eels, Panthers Tigers and St George to develop juniors, when others will just come in and pay overs for them anyway?

Suity

 

[Tizzun]

All ready happening Tizzun. Roosters won S G Ball this year right ? Their junior league consists of Paddo, Bondi, Clovelly & St Charles all of whom play in the Souths Juniors comp. Clearly they recruited their whole squad.

Fair point. Out of interest were many players in that SG Ball winning team from the Parra/Penrith junior system?

 

[Terry the Parra God]

mmmm, nothing wrong with the junior system you say.
How about the fact that certain clubs are well looked after by the district club while the others have to fight it out to get a fair go and retain their juniors from predator clubs that the junior league actively support.
The JRL hierarchy scoff at club suggestions for improvements to the competition and blindly forge ahead with dicisions that hurt struggling junior clubs which cant be good for the junior system.
Players are being lost and they are told that they can be replaced so they gladly go to union or stop playing.
Tell me the jnr comp is in good shape when the C geade comp is a shambles and the A grade has a six team first and second division and an 11 team third division. WTF.
How good is it watching that 3rd division?

 

[jono]

This is where the NRL should step in and show some leadership.
Seriously, where is the incentive for clubs like the Eels, Panthers Tigers and St George to develop juniors, when others will just come in and pay overs for them anyway?

Suity

I'm a Parramaniac BUT you can chuck in the biggest nursery of all , Newcastle and the Hunter.
Constantly gets plundered , witness the NSW SOO 2 squad , 7 hunter products

 

[Suitman]

I'm a Parramaniac BUT you can chuck in the biggest nursery of all , Newcastle and the Hunter.
Constantly gets plundered , witness the NSW SOO 2 squad , 7 hunter products

Agreed - my bad.

Funny thing is, if they have sooooo many great juniors, how did we end up with Lowrie?

Suity

 

[Terry the Parra God]

Seriously, the Parra NRL (who ultimately have responsibility for the JRL) have to take a complete look at their junior system and listen to their junior club.
I know it might be a big ask but they need to put the politics aside and that might mean a complete cleanout of the officialdom, but they need to come out of the dark ages and move into the 21st century.
With Parra and Penrith having the some of the biggest and most talented junior nurseries in the RL world we should not have to look outside of the district for NRL players particularly if the NRL move towards nursery and loyalty discounts it will be more important than ever.

 

[Ant]

I personally don't think there is much we can do about this situation. Quite simply it is better to be producing a lot of these kids rather than having to pay over the odds to bring them to your club.
A club like parramatta with a large junior base and very strong junior rep sides almost every year are always going to have other clubs grabbing those players. But quite simply you are a better chance of keeping them if they are already wearing your colours, than signing them from another club.
To be honest its actually pretty rare that you lose a junior who has not yet played first grade who turns out to be a fulltime first grade player or better at another club. I reckon you could count them on one hand over the last 10 years. Thats because quite simply unless a club pays way above the odds for a quality junior that junior is likely to stay at your club.

Like the Tony Williams situation, as good as some people think he is its a massive gamble to spend $150000 on a player unproven in first grade. On that sort of money he almost has to be a starting player for you, at the very least permanently in the top 17. Manly signed him on u/20 form only, its a huge gamble. They may have rolled the dice and got themselves the next Tony Puletua, or they might have grabbed the next Jack Afamasaga or something even worse. I think the name Karl Filiga has been used a few times in the Tony Williams debate, $200000 sitting in the u/20s.

The whole process of recuitment and retention is simply that a gambling process. The bonus of the player already being in your club is that he may feel some loyalty to you and sign for a lower fee. That is simply why it is better to have a lot of quality kids in your system and have a quality system in general than to not have one.

I think the possibility on getting money off on your local juniors is never going to happen. How much time do you need to put in, because honestly clubs don't do much for kids under the age of 16, especially if they are on scholarship and live outside the immediate zone.

 

[caylo]

I think a transfer system, where an amount of money is to be payed to the club that the player is coming from. This transfer rate should probably be related to their annual salary and how long they were contracted at the previous club (including Jnr years).

Also restrictions on how much a player can make on their rep status might be another idea, i.e someone with no firstgrade experiance might be limited to 70k year when they sign there contract. This may lead to players being held back to after contract talks are up etc, but I think these sort of restrictions need to be made to stop player potching and development of jnrs.

If manly had to pay 80-100K to parramatta to sign T.Williams, would they have gone ahead with it, this way the rich clubs who could also afford signning big names bring the lower and less wealther clubs into the frame of it with player selection.

Clubs like parramatta could also make money from producing jnrs, and less money would be needed from pokie taxes in NSW (since that were alot of Jnrs are produced)

 

[Ron Jeremy]

why isn't there a transfer system, can someone tell me why? it would only benefit struggling clubs imo, and limit the spending from big clubs.