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Raidpatch

Messages
144
I just wrote out a long detailed post regarding you inquiry Lord Ted and lost it when I went to send. Quite frankly I couldn't be bothered to do it again now. Infact, I'm quite pissed off about it mate!
I may try again in the future days ahead..but then again may not mate. I'm not too wrapped in the direction this thread is heading, as to me it seems like people are happy in bagging law enforcement and their ways. There are no finer people in their career position than law enforcement officers, in my humble opinion, and I'm not about to sit here and see them all ridiculed and called corrupt in whatever way one may imply ... if infact at all. I'm not saying that's what you were doing mate, but I get the feeling it could open the flood gates... and I won't be a part of it.
I might just let things be as they arefrom here on-in....
Raidpatch.
 
J

Johnsy

Guest
Its funny how the people who bag cops, have no idea of what it takes to do the job, shame really. If more people understood what it does take, the police may get a bit more respect. Its only a miniscule percentage of "bad" cops who spoil it for the other "thousands" of good cops.
Johnsy
 
Messages
222
Raidpatch,
My comments were of a general and observational nature.
If you have construed them in some way to be a statement about your integrity,this was not my intention and please accept my apology.Sorry.
In fact, whilst I do not resile from my remarks,they were meant to be a comment on policy, not personal.
Raidpatch,you have made a more than reasonable comment,when you said you did not like the way this thread was headed.This thread was bought about with the good intention of allowing members to become more familiar with one another.This does not mean it becomes an avenue of argument.This thread does not deserve to be a target of ill-will.
P.S. I have also made very lengthy replies to a fellow forummer and lost it in the process,and it really does give one the shits.

 

Javaman

Juniors
Messages
76
I think Raidpatch has been very kind in what he has provided thus far and should be commended to great lengths. I didn't getsee both the replies that he originally posted, then chose to delete, but a fellow forumer was kind enough to email both sets to me.I think it goes without saying that much of the information he posted was very usefull for probably all of us here in one way or another. I get the feeling he possiblyrevealed more than he probably wished he had, but the best thing he could of done was not leave them up for too long a period of time, which he did by deleting them both. I don't think anyone here is attacking your former profession Raidpatch, but many times we do question as lame people what exactly goes on behind the scenes in law enforcement and how certain things eventuate and happen as they do.

Javaman appreciating your work here Raidpatch and thanking you kindly.

 
J

Johnsy

Guest
Java
I think there is one point to make here. the people who generally bag police to the hilt, where would their first phonecall go when something happens to them. The police. It is a hard job and as I said earlier its a few that F&*K it for the majority of honest decent cops.
Johnsy
 

Javaman

Juniors
Messages
76
I do 100-percentagree with your comments Johnsy. I hope I wasn't implying something else, because I wasn't.
 
J

Johnsy

Guest
Java
No probs mate, and no you did not imply anyhting negative. Its just that some people are a bit quick with a judgement.
Johnsy
 
Messages
286
I also was mailed all the posts you did here Raidpatch, and must say thankyou up front. It'll definitely come in handy for a lead foot like me.
I know, and can see, that this thread got a little further than you probably wished, but I would like your opinion and views on the following peice of very worthy reading material I was sent by a friend, specially considering you were undoubtably a former police highway patrol officer. The last paragraph of the peice is my primary concern as to your views. Of course you may wish to not respond, or you may indeed, but either way I think it's a worthy read for many posters here. Please let me make myself clear that I'm in no way trying to degrade your past profession. I'm merely wanting the opinion of a former badge.
Please note alsothat the article is an American one with referals to American studies and speed limits. The general theme of the article is the most important thing.
*****************************
You often hear the expression "speed kills" when people or government agencies are discussing highway safety. In a manner of speaking this is true. At least one vehicle involved in a traffic accident needs to be moving in order to cause a fatal accident; therefore, speed does kill, however, there has never been a documented case of a fatal accident from two vehicles at rest. The real question is how much speed actually kills and is speed the real culprit at all?
A recent study by the Federal Highway Administration revealed some surprising statistics that weren't generally publicized. The study revealed that the slowest 5% of all drivers had the highest accident rates. In addition, the study also showed that the drivers who had speeds at 10-15 mph above the speed limit were the safest group of drivers with the lowest accident rate. The sole reason is that slower drivers are less attentive than faster drivers. Faster drivers realize that they are traveling faster than the speed limit legally allows and therefore they are significantly more attentive as they watch for any sign of a potential police car ready to present them with a speeding ticket. Furthermore, the same study also found that 70% of all drivers exceed the speed limit and that most current speed limits are set at least 10 mph slower than they should be. It should be noted that this study was before the change in the national 55 mph speed limit but more on the national speed limit later.
It is generally considered that the average speed of traffic, or the flow of traffic, is the speed that the majority of drivers consider to be prudent and safe for the existing conditions, regardless of the speed limit. This is the basis for what is referred to as the 85th Percentile Rule. This is a system that has been used by traffic engineers for over fifty years. Simply stated, the 85th Percentile Rule means that the safest speed for any particular road is the speed that 85% of all drivers travel at or below, under normal conditions. Remember that the Federal Highway Administration tests showed that 70% of the drivers were exceeding the posted speed limit by 10 mph. These drivers are the flow of traffic and are the majority of the drivers who make up the statistic for the 85th Percentile Rule.
The National Speed Limit was established at 55 mph in 1974 as an answer to the oil shortage. The theory was that slower speeds used less fuel and as a result, conserved energy. A noble theory at the time but why did it take over twenty-years to change this speed limit when the oil shortage ended only a few years after the 55 mph limit was established? The answer is due to the money train that was created for city and state governments as well as the insurance companies. Lower speed limits are a golden egg for some small municipalities.
In some rural areas, traffic ticket fines make up 90% of a small town government's operating budget for the entire year.
During the later period of the 55 mph speed limit, the majority of drivers on major highways usually traveled between 65-75 mph. As you can see the bottom end of this is the magic 10 mph that the Federal Highway Administration test referred to. In fact, the percentage of drivers traveling 70-75 mph would suggest that the 55 mph limit is really more like 15 mph lower than it should be. The original speeds on most of the major highways started at 70-75 mph before the national speed limit went into effect. These speeds were set years prior by traffic engineers who used the 85th percentile rule to determine what the speed should be for these particular roads.
Now that these speeds have been increased to 65-70 mph, you will still find the majority of drivers traveling at the 65 -75 mph speed. The speed limit increased but the driver's speeds did not. The reason goes back to the principle of the 85th percentile rule. Most drivers feel that the safe speed is contingent on several factors, including: <DIR> <DIR> · Road conditions - dry, wet, ice, etc. · Vehicle condition - good tires, engine in good shape, etc. · Driver's ability - do you feel comfortable traveling at 75 mph · Traffic conditions - is the road relatively clear or is it bumper to bumper · Visibility - Clear and sunny or rain with fog </DIR></DIR>
Common sense is what the majority of the drivers use. The same drive who will do 75 mph down the interstate highway on a clear and dry day, is likely the same driver who will do 55 mph on a rainy night.
The final verdict is that speed doesn't kill. Speed generates revenue. A real example of this is the unmarked police car. If speed is so dangerous, why are there any unmarked police cars? We all know that everyone slows down when they see a police car. Wouldn't it make sense to have all police cars marked so that more drivers would see them and as a result, slow down? The unmarked police car is proof positive the governmental agencies are aware that the speed limits are too low and people are going to exceed them. The way to capitalize on these people is the unmarked car whose sole purpose is to essentially entrap drivers who are part of the 85th percentile rule. The governmental agencies aren't the only group responsible.
Thanks - Raging Bulldog

 
Messages
286
Actually, here is the other peice I've decided to postI got from the same person. This is actually about insurance companies and their hidden scams, but you'll see how these parasites factor in speeding to make their millions. Scumbags!

<table cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 width=800 border=0> <tbody> <tr> <td nowrap width=10></td> <td valign=top align=middle width=557> <table cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 width="100%" bgcolor=#ffcc00 border=0> <tbody> <tr bgcolor=#d7d7ff> <td bgcolor=#ffcc00> <center>Why Insurance Companies Love Speeders</center></td></tr></tbody></table>
<table width="99%" border=0> <tbody> <tr> <td valign=top width="50%"> In the past, insurance companies assisted in highway safety through the sponsorship of driver training programs, conducting public information campaigns and providing grants for highway safety research. Those days are behind us now. These noble ides have been abandoned in favor of the tax exempt lobby group. The principal group of all the major insurance companies is the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS). Quite an honorable sounding name for a well funded machine with three primary goals: <ul> [*]Promote unrealistically low speed limits. [*]Endorse and fund covert methods of speed detection. [*]Expansion of auto manufacturing regulations. [/list] Surprising as it may seem, speeding tickets are not about highway safety. Speeding tickets are about big income for local and state governments as well as the insurance companies. In the introduction we discussed how the major cities in the United States generate millions of dollars a year in speeding ticket fines. Some smaller, more rural towns can generate most of their annual operating budget from speeding ticket revenues. The insurance companies are right behind them all the way as they wave the flag of highway safety while collecting an average of a 15% policy increase for three years. The insurance companies and local governments are all aware of the studies by the Federal Highway Administration that revealed the slowest 5% of all drivers on the highway accounted for the largest percentage of accidents. The same study showed that the motorist with the lowest accident rates are those who typically travel at speeds anywhere from 10 to 15 mph over the posted speed limit.
IIHS is completely aware of the 85th Percentile Rule and hopes that a very small group of the public is also aware of this rule. Simply stated, this rule shows that the safest speed for any road is the speed that 85% of the drivers would travel, under good conditions, if there were no posted speed limit. A quick proof of the 85th Percentile's accuracy is on the federal highways now that the speed limit has increase from 55 mph to 70 mph. During the days of 55 mph, drivers usually averaged between 65 and 75 mph. Now that the speed limit has been raised, the majority of the drivers still do not exceed 75 mph.
The reason isn't because they only want to travel at X miles per hour over the speed limit. These drivers realize that this speed is realistic and a speed at which they are comfortable driving.
IIHS has continuously pushed to outlaw radar detectors, and even convinced GEICO Insurance not to insure drivers with radar detectors. Their arguments against radar detectors are: <ul> [*]Radar detectors increase accident rates and cause people to drive faster than they would without the detector. [*]Insurance companies don't get an accurate portrayal of driver's performance since the radar detectors allow them to avoid speeding tickets. [*]Since radar detector owners are the fastest drivers, the insurance companies shouldn't have to provide them with insurance. [/list] The Insurance Commissions of both California and Maryland told GEICO and IIHS that these arguments were totally unfounded. They also pointed out that their own studies showed no correlation between radar detector use and increased accidents.
One new tactic among insurance companies is to make a major marketing production out of the local agent presenting the local law enforcement agency with a radar gun in the name of highway safety.
Let's apply a little business economics to this scenario.
1. The radar gun is purchased for $2,500.00 by XYZ Insurance.
2. This radar gun will be used to write an average of 80 tickets per month (this is a very low figure, some officers write over 150 tickets a month).
3. The average XYZ auto policy costs a driver $750.00 per year.
4. XYZ insures 5% of the drivers in this state and figures that 1/3 of the tickets will be written to out of state drivers.
5. XYZ will increase a driver's premium by 15% for a speeding ticket.
Now let's take a closer look at the math: <table cellspacing=3 cellpadding=5 bgcolor=#ffcc00 border=2> <tbody> <tr> <td> 80 tickets times 2/3 (for in state drivers) = 54 tickets per month</td></tr> <tr> <td> 5% of these drivers are XYZ customers = 54 x .05 = 3 drivers per month</td></tr> <tr> <td> XYZ will charge these 3 drivers an extra $112.50 per year = $337.50</td></tr> <tr> <td> Over the next twelve months XYZ will gain 12 x $337.50 = $2,193.75</td></tr></tbody></table> Wasn't it generous of XYZ to spend $2,500.00 for the radar gun donation? Remember, the increase premiums last for 3 years! You can quickly see that XYZ wasn't quite so noble.
One other big issue with IIHS is covert speed detection through the use of unmarked police cars. If the insurance companies were so concerned with driver safety, wouldn't they rather see all marked cars on the highway? What do you do when you are traveling along at 75 mph on a 65 mph highway and see a state trooper about to come down the on ramp? You slow down, that seems to support IIHS's notion of highway safety much more than an unmarked car hiding in the bushes and waiting to write a ticket. As you can see, the insurance industry might talk a big line for highway safety, but the proof is in the profits.</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table>
 

Navigator

Juniors
Messages
87
G'day all.
I was reading some older posts from the archives earlier tonight and came across this interestingone.
The person who started this thread seems to have departed the forum,based on the "Can't Find Member Profile" message.
I get the impression from reading throughout thethread that Raidpatch provided some type of links or meassages on beating the dreaded speeding ticket. Is this correct? But the messages that Raidpatch (I'm guessing they were his) providedseem to have dissappearedI into thin air. Why were they deleted? Anyway, Isee Willow (and others possibly) may have stored them somewhere on his personalfiles or this forum, judging by his replies throughout this thread. Some others may have too.I'd love to see what was written or links posted. I get the impression from replies that the information was usefull.
Can Willow or someone else who stored a copy of the information provided, please be kind enough to repost it again here. I can't figure out why they would have been deleted. Was it usefull information/links?
If I'm overstepping my boundries in asking and resurfacing this thread topic, or it's simply inappropriate of me to do so, than I apologize in advanceand dissregard this post.
Gracias.


 

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
109,612
Navigator, its fine to ask about anything.

I just read back through the thread and remember it now. Unfortunately, the actual replies that I copied have been lost following various hard drive formats after several virus attacks, but I do recall the gist of it all.

Raidpatch and others deleted their own posts and we have to respect that.

Nevertheless you can read from my replies that it is apparently acceptable to drive over the speed limit by a few kilometres. Anything over10 kms is asking for a ticket.
The only hint I recall was to drive in 'packs'. That is, if its absolutely neccessary to push the speed limit, be sure to do it in the shadow of other vehicles. There was something else about the colour of the car as well... radar having trouble picking up certain colours, but its all lost from the memory banks now. In any case, technology changes and I would trust it forever anyway.

Having said all that, Raidpatch's biggest hint was to drive safely and not to speed.

If you're reading this Raidpatch, thanks for the input and I look forward to your return one day.
 

Navigator

Juniors
Messages
87
Thanks for the reply post Willow. Nevermind.
If anyone else may have happened to have saved the replies, I'd appreciate if you could maybe forward them here on this disscussion, or send me a mail through my hotmail account.
chris_field_02@hotmail.com
 

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