RLWC2017 Crowd Watch

[Stormwarrior82]

Perth Red you have somehow blamed the Nrl for the perceived faults of the running and organizing of the rlwc. Incredible. Always Nrls fault.

I thing I do agree with you about, is the tickets prices. I have sat here and read everyone complain about ticket prices. Someone complained about paying $175 each for him and his son for the game. Yet there were 1000s of cheap seats available? I’d love to watch the game every week in a corporate box but I can’t afford it. So I sit in the cheaper seats. I don’t complain about the corporate boxes being to expensive. Yes maybe the tickets overall were a little too expensive or maybe the fans just don’t feel engaged so don’t attend games.

 

[Stallion]

Most Australians don't see it as a major sporting event. We can sugar coat it all we want and say they should but the fact is they don't. I've been banging on about this for 6 weeks now but only a drastic increase in competitiveness will fix this, which we are a long way off.

Out of interest what do you think USA/Canada/South Africa would have got for some of these games? There could be some truly embarrassing crowds in the world cups hosted there.

The tv ratings reflect a popular event? I'd suggest other issues were involved with respect to attendances.

 

[DC80]

But you have to question why the public didn’t value the tournament enough to pay the prices. They pay a lot more for other events so it’s not prices on their own. It’s a combination of price v interest in attending. If you raise the latter you can raise the former.

I still think if you can see a World Cup final for $70 there’s hardly any excuse from a cost point of view for not going if you are a rugby league fan.

You are absolutely right. Was just reading about Adele packing out stadiums all over Aus this year, and those tickets wouldn't have come cheap. 95k and 100k in Sydney.

The issue is the lack of drawing power of the tournament. The reason for this is obvious - especially when you listen to Aussie pundits as I have - they don't rate the opposition. Winning the tournament is seen as a formality.

 

[DC80]

But you have to question why the public didn’t value the tournament enough to pay the prices. They pay a lot more for other events so it’s not prices on their own. It’s a combination of price v interest in attending. If you raise the latter you can raise the former.

I still think if you can see a World Cup final for $70 there’s hardly any excuse from a cost point of view for not going if you are a rugby league fan.

Was it really just $70? That is ridiculously cheap for a final. There is nothing comparable to that in other sports, concerts etc. I go to roughly 15 home Premier League games every season at Anfield, each game costs me £65, exchange rate that's over $100 per game. A RLWC final ticket is $30 cheaper than a ticket for a regular PL game.

 

[DC80]

Most Australians don't see it as a major sporting event. We can sugar coat it all we want and say they should but the fact is they don't. I've been banging on about this for 6 weeks now but only a drastic increase in competitiveness will fix this, which we are a long way off.

Out of interest what do you think USA/Canada/South Africa would have got for some of these games? There could be some truly embarrassing crowds in the world cups hosted there.

My impression too. Aussie pundits treated the games as though it would be a walk in the park. If the pundits show an apathy towards the games - and it's in their interest not to do that given it's their livelihood - what chance has the average viewer?

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Having sobered up from a very big night last night lol I can honestly say you couldn’t live in Brisbane and and not know the rlwc Final was on here. Well done to the organisers on that one. Banners and flags everywhere, the RLWC giants, poster boards right through the city centre and a great RLWC square for events on Friday and Saturday.

I’d estimate there was around 15k English and other fans there last night so that means only 25k Australian fans turned up. So why would that be? Well it can’t be because they didn’t know it was happening. It may have had something to do with ticket prices but like I said the main unsold blocks in the ground were the cheapest seats so that would suggest those that did go valued it enough to pay for better seats. I think concessions could have been much cheaper for kids but organisers clearly expected a sell out and didn’t want to lose revenue that way, someth8ng we see for any major event these days,

So why the 20% of capacity unsold tickets? For me fundamentally it c9mes down to two things, lack of positive media coverage for the tournament. Look at how much hype there has been for the ashes series for months and compare it to the total lack of interest from fox, nine and the nrl about the RLWC until a few weeks out.

Secondly the nrl doing a terrible job on building the kangaroos brand. Roos need massive more attention and marketing, they need to be playing 3-4 test matches EVERY year. They need to be play8ng ashes series and nz series that generate interest, they need to ditch the prime ministers xiii nonsense and play proper tests in png.

Until they do this the kangaroos will always be of minor interest to Australians and we will get disappointing public responses to attendances like we have just seen.

Still 80% full isn’t the end 9f the world. I haven’t heard any mention 9fmthe 70% full Adelaide stadium today, seems just RL that Likes to beat itself up.

I agree with this. The respect given to the Kangaroos jersey from their own Governing body is appalling. Until the ARLC put the Kangaroos on the pedestal that they deserve to be on, then the media and general sports fan will not either. For me, that is the one and only issue in Australia for international RL. I paid $150 to watch Fiji play Australia in the semi-final and was more than happy to do so as I was watching the world’s best rugby team and some of the biggest starts in the game run around in a world cup.


The other excuses are just myths:

1. The games is a joke because of the eligibility rules – false: the media use it as an excuse to beat up on the game because the ARLC don’t respect the Kangaroos or international Rugby League enough. RU does not get bashed for this although Wales, Samoa, Tonga, Japan, Scotland and France all have around one third of their squads filled with players not born in the country they represent. The only thing RL needs to stop is nation swapping.
2. International Rugby League is not competitive – false: The Kiwis won the 2005 tri-nations, the 2008 World Cup, the 2010 World Cup, the 2014 four nations and took the world number 1 ranking in 2015. A gutsy England lost a highly intense and competitive final to a Kangaroos side in top form and the Kiwis lost the 2006 tri-nations final in golden point extra time. England / GB have beaten NZ in test series in 2007 and 2015 and both played an epic World Cup semi-final in 2013. Add that to the fact that Italy has beaten England (non-test match), New Zealand drew with Scotland last year and lost to Tonga and Fiji in this world cup.
3. No one cares – false: In the 2013 world cup in the Northern Hemesphere we saw a record World Cup aggregate attendance including big crowds at iconic stadia such as Millenium Stadium, Wembley and Old Trafford. The 2016 four nations drew a big crowd for the final an Anfield also. In the Southern Hemesphere we have seen very, very strong TV ratings – channel 7 were prepared to write a cheque for $12million and I would say if they got the chance again in the future the cheque will be much bigger. The Australia v England World Cup final out-rated the Ashes Cricket, that shows you how much people care and the Australia v New Zealand RL tests consistently outrate the Bledisloe Cup.

What needs to change? Not much, our authorities need to show this hugely popular game more respect and the media and sporting public will follow and pay big money to attend our events because they are worth it.

 

[DC80]

I agree with this. The respect given to the Kangaroos jersey from their own Governing body is appalling. Until the ARLC put the Kangaroos on the pedestal that they deserve to be on, then the media and general sports fan will not either. For me, that is the one and only issue in Australia for international RL. I paid $150 to watch Fiji play Australia in the semi-final and was more than happy to do so as I was watching the world’s best rugby team and some of the biggest starts in the game run around in a world cup.


The other excuses are just myths:

1. The games is a joke because of the eligibility rules – false: the media use it as an excuse to beat up on the game because the ARLC don’t respect the Kangaroos or international Rugby League enough. RU does not get bashed for this although Wales, Samoa, Tonga, Japan, Scotland and France all have around one third of their squads filled with players not born in the country they represent. The only thing RL needs to stop is nation swapping.
2. International Rugby League is not competitive – false: The Kiwis won the 2005 tri-nations, the 2008 World Cup, the 2010 World Cup, the 2014 four nations and took the world number 1 ranking in 2015. A gutsy England lost a highly intense and competitive final to a Kangaroos side in top form and the Kiwis lost the 2006 tri-nations final in golden point extra time. England / GB have beaten NZ in test series in 2007 and 2015 and both played an epic World Cup semi-final in 2013. Add that to the fact that Italy has beaten England (non-test match), New Zealand drew with Scotland last year and lost to Tonga and Fiji in this world cup.
3. No one cares – false: In the 2013 world cup in the Northern Hemesphere we saw a record World Cup aggregate attendance including big crowds at iconic stadia such as Millenium Stadium, Wembley and Old Trafford. The 2016 four nations drew a big crowd for the final an Anfield also. In the Southern Hemesphere we have seen very, very strong TV ratings – channel 7 were prepared to write a cheque for $12million and I would say if they got the chance again in the future the cheque will be much bigger. The Australia v England World Cup final out-rated the Ashes Cricket, that shows you how much people care and the Australia v New Zealand RL tests consistently outrate the Bledisloe Cup.

What needs to change? Not much, our authorities need to show this hugely popular game more respect and the media and sporting public will follow and pay big money to attend our events because they are worth it.

An awful lot of exaggeration and wishful thinking there. The eligibility rule is fine, the problem is when it's entire teams of players using it. Those RU teams you mentioned have a core of home grown players, the support for the game is already there. RL doesn't have that. Teams made up of players from abroad indicates no growth or support for the game. Second point, Australia have just won yet another RLWC, that's 10 of the last 11 I believe, or is it 9 in 10? That's far from competitive. I haven't followed Aussie pundits before until this tournament, what they said shocked me. They don't rate anyone that plays Australia - I accept the lack of competition - what shocked me was the fact they openly said it as its in a pundits interest to promote the game and make it seem competitive even if it isn't. They display an apathy. Third point, "No-one cares" is clearly not something to argue against as obviously it has interest. The issue is not enough care.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

An awful lot of exaggeration and wishful thinking there. The eligibility rule is fine, the problem is when it's entire teams of players using it. Those RU teams you mentioned have a core of home grown players, the support for the game is already there. RL doesn't have that. Teams made up of players from abroad indicates no growth or support for the game. Second point, Australia have just won yet another RLWC, that's 10 of the last 11 I believe, or is it 9 in 10? That's far from competitive. I haven't followed Aussie pundits before until this tournament, what they said shocked me. They don't rate anyone that plays Australia - I accept the lack of competition - what shocked me was the fact they openly said it as its in a pundits interest to promote the game and make it seem competitive even if it isn't. They display an apathy. Third point, "No-one cares" is clearly not something to argue against as obviously it has interest. The issue is not enough care.

The world cup as we know it has only been in the current format since 1995 and following the 2000 WC disaster we pretty much started all over again as an international game. Prior to that It wasn't hard for Australia to win 8 world cups when only GB, France and New Zealand played in them. My point on competitiveness is that as an expanded international sport we are in our infancy and for the results to be what they are at this stage - it is pretty competitive.

Yes - we have a bigger heritage problem but seriously - Union has taken the international game very seriously for decades now and some of those countries listed are some of the most established nations they have. We are not talking about one or two players either - each of the nations listed had about 10 to 12 players in their squad not born in the country they represented at the last World Cup two years ago. My points was that we need to stop worrying about that aspect so much. Union gets taken seriously because their governing bodies take it seriously - yes, we will have detractors but people within the game need to do everything they can to respect it and currently that doesn't happen.

I've heard many media comments and articles over the last five weeks claiming that no one cares - I was simply pointing out that, that is not the case.

 

[Springs09]

You are absolutely right. Was just reading about Adele packing out stadiums all over Aus this year, and those tickets wouldn't have come cheap. 95k and 100k in Sydney.

The issue is the lack of drawing power of the tournament. The reason for this is obvious - especially when you listen to Aussie pundits as I have - they don't rate the opposition. Winning the tournament is seen as a formality.

That is not the issue at all. 2008 drew much better and we had a stronger Kangaroos side then, and a weaker NZ and England. 2014 drew better and the recent ANZAC Tests and Pacific Tests have got better crowds. Not to mention the TV ratings have been great.

The issue comes down to the organisers doing a crappy job.

Most of everything about the poor crowd number has been said, but the crowd itself was appalling. QLDers booing the Australian players that come from NSW even when they came on stage to receive their medals, seriously? And then there were more English supporters remaining for the ceremony than Aussies. Most of us walked out. It was bad enough in 2008 when they walked out on the Kiwis but on their own team?

QLD can have their Broncos and their Origin team and nothing else for all I'm concerned. The praise for their crowds are overexaggerated anyway. And I thought Sydney fans were insular.

Our game deserves better than crowds like that. The Kangaroos also deserve to play in front of Aussie fans, not QLD fans. The contrast between Wembley and Old Trafford in 2013 and Brisbane this year makes us Aussie fans look very bad indeed.

 

[Perth Red]

Perth Red you have somehow blamed the Nrl for the perceived faults of the running and organizing of the rlwc. Incredible. Always Nrls fault.

I thing I do agree with you about, is the tickets prices. I have sat here and read everyone complain about ticket prices. Someone complained about paying $175 each for him and his son for the game. Yet there were 1000s of cheap seats available? I’d love to watch the game every week in a corporate box but I can’t afford it. So I sit in the cheaper seats. I don’t complain about the corporate boxes being to expensive. Yes maybe the tickets overall were a little too expensive or maybe the fans just don’t feel engaged so don’t attend games.

Nrl bid for the cup, nrl put its people in charge, nrl put it in their strategic plan. Who would you blame?

 

[Perth Red]

That is not the issue at all. 2008 drew much better and we had a stronger Kangaroos side then, and a weaker NZ and England. 2014 drew better and the recent ANZAC Tests and Pacific Tests have got better crowds. Not to mention the TV ratings have been great.

The issue comes down to the organisers doing a crappy job.

Most of everything about the poor crowd number has been said, but the crowd itself was appalling. QLDers booing the Australian players that come from NSW even when they came on stage to receive their medals, seriously? And then there were more English supporters remaining for the ceremony than Aussies. Most of us walked out. It was bad enough in 2008 when they walked out on the Kiwis but on their own team?

QLD can have their Broncos and their Origin team and nothing else for all I'm concerned. The praise for their crowds are overexaggerated anyway. And I thought Sydney fans were insular.

Our game deserves better than crowds like that. The Kangaroos also deserve to play in front of Aussie fans, not QLD fans. The contrast between Wembley and Old Trafford in 2013 and Brisbane this year makes us Aussie fans look very bad indeed.

I was amazed at how the stadium emptied and all that was left for the cup ceremony was a lot of English fans with a small smattering of Australian fans. Fans of the game are very half arsed in their support here.

I was also really surprised at the lack of colour, flags and general atmosphere at the final. The crowd at nib was nearly just a third but much mich louder and more into it. They really needed to create a couple of england supporter sections tomget some atmosphere in the place, which I know is hard to do without knowing who is in the final.

 

[Springs09]

I was amazed at how the stadium emptied and all that was left for the cup ceremony was a lot of English fans with a small smattering of Australian fans. Fans of the game are very half arsed in their support here.

I was also really surprised at the lack of colour, flags and general atmosphere at the final. The crowd at nib was nearly just a third but much mich louder and more into it. They really needed to create a couple of england supporter sections tomget some atmosphere in the place, which I know is hard to do without knowing who is in the final.

They didn't give out the Aussie/English flags like they did at the opener for some reason. Any pommy chants didn't get going as there were only 10 or so together instead of all up one end.

I wouldn't say the support is half-arsed, just the respect is atrocious. In 2013 the English crowd stayed for the ceremony out of respect for the occasion and what was quite easily the best team I've ever seen.

 

[deluded pom?]

Someone on LU timed it from the end of the match to when Smith got his hands on the trophy at 23 minutes! Way too much fannying around. We don't bother with all the speeches like you do. All the speeches by the players and officials never have anything original in them. Get rid of them.

 

[taipan]

Nrl bid for the cup, nrl put its people in charge, nrl put it in their strategic plan. Who would you blame?

It was in fact a combined Aust and NZ bid.

 

[Stallion]

The world cup as we know it has only been in the current format since 1995 and following the 2000 WC disaster we pretty much started all over again as an international game. Prior to that It wasn't hard for Australia to win 8 world cups when only GB, France and New Zealand played in them. My point on competitiveness is that as an expanded international sport we are in our infancy and for the results to be what they are at this stage - it is pretty competitive.

Yes - we have a bigger heritage problem but seriously - Union has taken the international game very seriously for decades now and some of those countries listed are some of the most established nations they have. We are not talking about one or two players either - each of the nations listed had about 10 to 12 players in their squad not born in the country they represented at the last World Cup two years ago. My points was that we need to stop worrying about that aspect so much. Union gets taken seriously because their governing bodies take it seriously - yes, we will have detractors but people within the game need to do everything they can to respect it and currently that doesn't happen.

I've heard many media comments and articles over the last five weeks claiming that no one cares - I was simply pointing out that, that is not the case.

It's very easy for government bodies to take union seriously as union does not have to deal with not being recognised as a sport by influential international sporting organisations that apparently have clout? Not sure if that recent petition (by Steve Mascord) requesting such recognition to be a sport has achieved anything of substance at as yet!?

 

[Perth Red]

It was in fact a combined Aust and NZ bid.

Well technically it would have included pngrl as well but in reality we all know it was the nrl and Dave smith who promised to better Sth Africa’s bid.

 

[Perth Red]

Good to see the English have already started with the rlwc2021 marketing campaign! Now if they can just get the ticket prices right lol

 

[Stallion]

Good to see the English have already started with the rlwc2021 marketing campaign! Now if they can just get the ticket prices right lol

The Poms got the ticket prices right last time! It's the Aussie organisers that charged too high not the English in 2013! Needless to point many of the major game crowds were impressive unlike what happened in 2017 except for the Tonga v England semi. (Which had lower ticket prices than the other major games!)

 

[Perth Red]

The Poms got the ticket prices right last time! It's the Aussie organisers that charged too high not the English in 2013! Needless to point many of the major game crowds were impressive unlike what happened in 2017 except for the Tonga v England semi. (Which had lower ticket prices than the other major games!)

Really? I didn’t know that you felt that way.

 

[taipan]

Well technically it would have included pngrl as well but in reality we all know it was the nrl and Dave smith who promised to better Sth Africa’s bid.

Then blame the admin under Smith and the prior RLWC director Brown who resigned, not Greenberg or the current guy.None of us know as to what stage of stadiums and govt discussions/agreements had been reached when Brown resigned.When the TV deal was done and the main sponsors which were still being signed up this year.
TBH the cost of of women's RLWC may have exceeded expectations as well as the crowds.The marketing was awful.I think the SA at this early stage would have been crowd disaster.Not that East Coast Oz crowds were anything to brag about.
The biggest problem, staging such events in this country ,is it is a large geographic spread and even for Pmmy visitors because of the cost, they may have had to limit attendances.Ntoice the biggest rows were in PNG and NZ,the latter surprising.