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Rugby League 11-a-side, Better game?

Chapsta

Juniors
Messages
456
I've seen the League World 7's though. It's fun for a day out but I wouldnt watch it every week. That's what your idea would be closer to.

Im not sure if you can count, but 11 is closer to 13 than it is to 7.

If you don't like this idea stop posting in this thread. Instead of cyber stalking every comment i make.
 

Eels Dude

Coach
Messages
19,065
If you don't like this idea stop posting in this thread. Instead of cyber stalking every comment i make.

Cyber stalking eh :lol:. If you want to start a thread like this then you're opening yourself up to criticism. Forums are for debating and people expressing differing opinions. It doesn't matter what you start a thread on, you shouldn't be just expecting everyone to agree with you. If you don't like it don't start threads, especially ones poorly thought out and lacking any explanation.
 

Yosh

Coach
Messages
11,909
11 players per team would benefit the game in almost every aspect of play. e.g:
Ball movement would be spread wider, looking for gaps in defense. (11 players defending 68m, rather than 13 players defending 68m)

There would be more creative play from the halves, and many more benefits..


11-a-side would still be Rugby League, albeit a better game.

Rugby League defined itself form the "other" game (becoming 13-a-side), lets set ourselves up for another 100 years with an even better spectacle (11-a-side)!

No offence...

You are a bloody idiot
 

fourplay

Juniors
Messages
2,236
If you look at the evolution of the play-the-ball, there is an argument to support cutting the numbers down from 13-aside.

From 1906 when the play-the-ball was introduced to c.1950, the play-the-ball was truly a contest (even more than the ruck in modern RU today). As a result it kept all 12 forwards within very close proximity to the ruck/play-the-ball. The space available to the backs at EVERY play-the-ball was roughly akin to what we see today at a scrum.

From 1950 onwards, players were increasingly getting away with cheating at the play-the-ball to keep possession - while there occasional instances of the ball being raked back by the marker (even into the early 1990s), for the most part the team in possession kept the ball. Proof of this was the bash-and-barge era of the early 1960s - which could only have existed if the play-the-ball was hardly a contest.

The point I'm getting to is...when the play-the-ball was a real contest, attracting all 12 forwards, there was space everywhere for the attacking team.

During the 1950s and early 1960s, with teams knowing that they were less likely to win the play-the-ball, only 2 forwards were committed to the ruck area (marker and 2nd marker), with the other 4 forwards then taking up places AND SPACE in the defence line.

This led to the need to set a minimum distance for the defence to stand back, and has now evolved to 10m.

If you watch RU today, you can see the same trend developing - the ruck is for the most part not really a contest (despite what many RU people say), and defensive forwards are not all getting involved at each "break-down", but opting to stand in the defence line. For RU, having 8 forwards instead of RL's 6, means that attacking rugby is even less likely - hence they have been forced to look at their rules (the ELVs).

If RL teams were dropped to 11-aside, then the 10m would definitely have to be cut down to 5m.

American football came from rugby (mid-1870s), and almost from the outset made the scrimmage irrelevant as a contest for the ball (as we have now done with the scrum and play-the-ball), and changed from 15 aside to 11.

The risk in cutting down RL teams to 11, is that very soon after RU would drop to 13 - they don't do it now as RL and 13 aside are synonymous with each other.

The advantage of RL teams dropping to 11 (with a 5m rule) is that expansive ball-passing play is more likely. Additionally, as there was in 1906 when RL dropped from 15 to 13, there is an enormous economical benefit to clubs - it is cheaper to field teams with 2 less players. It would also be easier for RL at the semi-pro and social level to play, and to fill teams.

I don't think dropping to 11 is a ridiculous idea, but it would be a seismic-shift in the code's history, and a step not be taken without a lot of trials and consideration. The influence of the $ should never be ruled out in a pro sport.

12-aside RL was played in NU competitions in the 1903/04 season:
http://www.RL1908.com/articles/1904.htm

Great post as always!!
 

Johnny Bravo

Juniors
Messages
489
How about instead of using simple insults you explain why you think it is a bad idea.

What advantage does the 13-player game have over the 11-player game?
You insulted "Eels dude" for expressing his views, simply because his were different to you. Hypocritical much?

Everyone has disagreed on the 11 man idea has expressed very similar reasoning. It is up to you whether or not to take it on board or now.

I can tell you right now though, reducing the numbers of players on the field will not make a more expansive game because you'll be able to create gaps alot easier in the middle of the field. That line of thought simply doesn't make sense.
 

Chapsta

Juniors
Messages
456
You insulted "Eels dude" for expressing his views, simply because his were different to you. Hypocritical much?

Everyone has disagreed on the 11 man idea has expressed very similar reasoning. It is up to you whether or not to take it on board or now.

I can tell you right now though, reducing the numbers of players on the field will not make a more expansive game because you'll be able to create gaps alot easier in the middle of the field. That line of thought simply doesn't make sense.

I think your jumping to conculsions with the "able to create gaps alot easier in the middle". It's only two less players on the field, do you get it?. The 10m rule would be dropped back, being no need for dummy half defense, so those two players you usally see defending the ruck area would be spread along the defensive line. As is already the case in todays game.

Also if you read the history RL1908 provided you can see why an 11 man game would work, the rules of todays game arn't tailored to make the best of 13 players.Also read the link provided.
 

Knight87

Juniors
Messages
2,181
very interesting to hear all this talk about reducing to 11 per side. I was just watching the Big League April 1993 video (which had extended highlights of the World Sevens that year, probably the most well known out of all the World Sevens competitions held), and they interviewed players, fans, coaches who attended the event. There was the question raised about whether Sevens was the future of the game, with less players per side, faster play etc. Even back then, there was talk that the 13 per side game was too slow.
 

Green Machine

First Grade
Messages
5,844
Warren Ryan is always saying there is a perfect rugby league game between 7 and 11 men. It would be interesting to see what kind of game would evolve with 11 against 11 with a 10m defence. I would like to see the 10m shortened to 7m and see what effect it has on the defenders holding the attacking play up whilst the other defenders get back in the line. When I started playing, it was get off the tackled player as quick as possible and jog backwards to the line. Now, its hold the player up as long as possible while the other sprint back to the line.
I would like to see the pre season comp started again so rule changes can be tried out,
 

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