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Sons of guns forced to pack their bags

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/n...-pack-their-bags/story-e6frfgbo-1225812905002

Sons of guns forced to pack their bags

* By James Phelps
* From: The Daily Telegraph
* December 23, 2009 12:00AM

BORN into rugby league royalty, Nathan Wynn and his cousin Tim should be playing for the Dragons. Or maybe the Eels.

But the sons of 1980s legends Graeme and Peter Wynn have been forced to fly 17,000km around the world to get their rugby league fix as the Toyota Cup threatens to wipe out a generation of footy players.

Without a proper reserve grade since the introduction of the under-20s national competition, the Wynn boys packed their bags and headed to France to get a competitive game of rugby league.

Their dilemma saddens Graeme, who owned the 1980s while playing in the forwards for the mighty St George Dragons.

"It has really closed up for blokes like Nathan with the under-20s now," said the 193-game veteran.

"You will find about 2000 promising players heading overseas now because there is no opportunity left in Australia. It is a massive issue.

"If you haven't made it by the time you are 20, then there is just nowhere to play."

Nathan's story is not uncommon. A promising junior with the Bulldogs, the 91kg halfback was left with few options when reserve grade made way for the Toyota Cup in 2008.

Good, but not good enough for the NRL in his earlier 20s, he was spat out of the rugby league system.

But there is nothing to say that, after a few years with hardened players in an old-school reserve grade competition, young Wynn would not have developed into a player capable of following in his dad Graeme's famous footsteps.

"I went over to the Bulldogs and was playing reserve grade in 2007," Nathan said.

"I was going well and then they announced the Toyota Cup would be coming in the next year. They just stopped offering contracts and it was the same story everywhere. And that was pretty much it because there was no real pathway for anyone over 20."

So Nathan and his merry band of mid-20s rejects went and played glorified park football in the NSW Cup. The new reserve grade.

"I ended up playing a year for the Sydney Bulls," he said.

"You would play in front of a couple of hundred fans and at some pretty ordinary grounds."

Frustrated, Nathan looked abroad. If he wasn't going to be an NRL player, maybe he could make football his passport to the world.

"An opportunity came up to go over to Toulouse and play," Nathan said. "I thought it would be a good way to see the world and make some money but it has turned out to be more than that.

"We play in a competition which is like reserve grade to the Super League, and we have a real good shot of getting into that competition.

"We are now getting about 4500 people to our games and it could prove a real pathway. That's why Tim [Peter's son] came over, and why we have blokes like Brendan Oake in our team who should still be playing in the NRL now."

Graeme would still like to see his son play in the NRL, but it appears that may never happen. But Australia's loss will be Europe's gain.

"They are getting some good young Aussies over there," Graeme said. "All because they can't get an opportunity here."
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
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94,107
they still need something for these blokes and it's the down side of the under 20's

maybe raising it to under 23's would be better
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
69,489
They need to improve the NSW and Q'land cups so we eventually end up witha 2nd division that can include expansion states. If England/France can run a second division that gets crowds of up to 4,000 in stadia like this there should be no reason why Australia, where the game is more popular and wealthy, can't.

Leigh
3237531202_aee4e06d26.jpg


Widnes
241266


Doncaster
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Messages
23,965
And the majority fell for the U20's being the bees knees of pathways to the NRL. Reserves always helped those in the under age groups develop their game against men, not boys.
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
69,489
There is a place for both imo. We need somewhere for the 20-25 year olds to play that doesn't feel like park footy for a game fee of $500 and a slab of meat from the local butcher. Mind you if they are complainign about NSW cup they should try playing in teh Bundy cup at some of the grounds!
 

1 Eyed TEZZA

Coach
Messages
12,420
I think the system we had before was better, perhaps if it was done for all NRL clubs. I dont see why there needs to be an age limit on the reserve grade comp. Let the best 25 play in the top grade, let the next best 25 play in the lower one.
 

Jankuloski

Juniors
Messages
799
Cry me a river... His daddy was a player, and he didn't make it.. boo frikin' hoo...

The really good players get through the toyota cup and into the NRL (the ones that are to become first grade players). I don't think we've lost any genuine tallent by people dropping into the NSW cup. And it's better for the young players to play against their own peers, they can express themselves more and it's safer because of the phidique development. And on the other side it provides an opportunity for not so good players to taste the top competition. And if we compare the average 23 year old player and an average 19 year old player, I think the 19 year old has an advantage as there is more chance for him to be a late bloomer.

Most important point of all: Toyota cup's a massive motivation for junior development. There'll be a lot more juniors training if they know 30 of them have a chance of making the reserve grade comp then if they know only 5 of them will because it's filled with average players with a lot more experience.

That's one side of the story done.

The second side of the story is why the NSW cup is not as popular as the Co Operative. Don't know about that.
 
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Flapper

First Grade
Messages
7,825
The second side of the story is why the NSW cup is not as popular as the Co Operative. Don't know about that.

Because of the teams involved in the co-op. NSW Cup is basically reserve grade except for a few die hard foundation club fans, but the co-op has different teams than the ESL with years of tradition, Widnes being the obvious example.
 

The Tank

Bench
Messages
4,562
Why can't they just play in the NSW Cup/QLD Cup to "get their rugby league fix"? If all they want to do is play then there are heaps of clubs in NSW/QLD in the lower grades. Otherwise, they're not good enough.
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Money issues aside, it'd be great to see 3 games of league in the one day. U20's, Reserves, Main Game.

Maybe it's something our fabled independent commision will look at.
 

OVP

Coach
Messages
11,627
Cry me a river... His daddy was a player, and he didn't make it.. boo frikin' hoo...

The really good players get through the toyota cup and into the NRL (the ones that are to become first grade players). I don't think we've lost any genuine tallent by people dropping into the NSW cup. And it's better for the young players to play against their own peers, they can express themselves more and it's safer because of the phidique development. And on the other side it provides an opportunity for not so good players to taste the top competition. And if we compare the average 23 year old player and an average 19 year old player, I think the 19 year old has an advantage as there is more chance for him to be a late bloomer.

Most important point of all: Toyota cup's a massive motivation for junior development. There'll be a lot more juniors training if they know 30 of them have a chance of making the reserve grade comp then if they know only 5 of them will because it's filled with average players with a lot more experience.

That's one side of the story done.

The second side of the story is why the NSW cup is not as popular as the Co Operative. Don't know about that.

You DO realise that most props dont start hitting their peak at around age 26 dont you ? That means that we are throwing away a hell of a lot of talent in the 21 to 25 years age bracket, simply because there is no proper reserve grade. Bring back Reserve grade ... some players are slow to peak, but at least in the past we got to see them become first graders because there was somewhere for them to play ie reserve grade until they hit their straps. Bring it back in all its glory i say. Plus we get to see an extra game too.
 

The Colonel

Immortal
Messages
41,992
Tim Wynn isn't a bad player but when he was with the Eels he was playing in the reserve grade side but there were much better players ahead of him...... if I remember rightly I'm not sure Nathan Wynn was much of a standout at halfback for the Dragons Flegg side either.
 

Danish

Referee
Messages
32,016
Matt King is the perfect example of a player who in today's circumstances would not have had a chance.


We need a reserve grade comp with minimal age restrictions. Something like the old under 23s which had concessions for a certain amount of players outside the age bracket to be in the side.
 

Parra

Referee
Messages
24,900
3 grades - best for the fans, players, everyone except one group.

The only thing that ruined the best system was third parties who came on board and put their hand in the till - private team owners and media companies with a direct financial interest in the game.

The money used to support three grades is still there - it is in the pockets of greedy bastards instead of the clubs.

Same for funding for schools & juniors. And some idiots support this proposed 'commission'. Once that happens wave goodbye to U20's as well.
 

babyg

Juniors
Messages
1,512
Qld Cup seems to be working well, gets good coverage and is working as a feeder system to a few NRL teams.
 
Messages
616
we should come up with a system where we have a sencond teir comp that uses different clubs to the one in the nrl (still have links to a club) like the jets do now
 

Loudstrat

Coach
Messages
15,224
The old reserve grade exposed these young guns to some of the old hard heads prior to FG. Now, they go from a kiddies comp straight into first grade and get belted. There is NO reason to suggest a player who is 21 will never make the NRL.

F*ck the age restriction bullsh*t - it is irrelevant.
 

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,971
NSW/QLD Cup should be treated as a proper reserve grade comp and played before FG whenever possible.

Chalk this one up as another "to do" when we have some more cash from the next TV deal
 

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