That beats SOO1 and NRL Grand Final

[AuckMel]

I predicted getting a flame posting this topic.

Well, you did leave yourself open with the subject line.

 

[gaterooze]

eastsrule, the Union bashing should wane now -- it only started as a counter to all the hype. If there wasn't all those out & out lies and BS hype, I doubt many of us would have said anything at all.

Should point out your maths are off, too -- the points scored aren't even between the two codes, i.e. 5 for a try, not 4, 3 for goals, not 2 or 1.

But who said Union was bad because not enough points were scored? That's a weird one. I thought people were bagging the WC because of all the massive scorelines?

 

[eastsrule]

Quotes like "It is just that it was decided by a field goal." express the points insult.

I am happy to accept constructive critism, for example you points for a try arguement.

And I agree some of it was overhyped in some parts, it just angers me that a lot of the critism is just jumping on the bandwagon.

 

[gaterooze]

btw, I forgot to point out, there are 7 games per round in NRL, but only 6 in S12. It would probably end up pretty much the same, anyway. Personally, I think sometimes there are too many points scored in the NRL, when some teams just give up in the second half and get flogged. Gladly, the 2003 season had a large majority of tight games that went to the wire.

With Union, I don't think that "It is just that it was decided by a field goal." is a problem, what bores people is that in big games *most* of the points are only penalty or field goals.

It can very exciting in League for a team to snatch a win with a single-point field goal in the last second, but the difference is all game they have been trying to score tries, and the scores are even because of that, while in Union it often feels like they have no interest in scoring tries (except in 'walkover' matches), and are just waiting around for the next penalty or field goal shot. Two field goals will beat 1 try, while in League you'd need to kick 5 field goals to beat a single try. The focus of the game is different. But whether you prefer one way or the other, is a personal choice.

I'm not sure if changing the points made by a field goal will make a lot of difference in Union. Lowering penalty goal points would, but then the game starts to lose its identity... why alienate true Union fans to try and draw in League viewers? Doesn't seem right.

The two codes *should* be different, because then they each cater for different audiences. I wouldn't want League to change things to be closer to Union, so I can't imagine any real Union fans would want the same for their code. If you get a hankering for elements of the other, just watch both!

 

[Bluebag]

Eastrules,

There are less tackles made in union, less tries and the defence is ordinary, in league players are coached to put players on their backs yet in union players are allowed to turn over in a tackle to put the ball back into play for their team. A league coach would pan to not allow this to happen, very little time is spent on defence in union, otherwise this would be reduced.

 

[syphon]

that being said, more people watched this game than have EVER watched a rugby league match at any one time.

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

 

[Edwahu]

If the defence is piss poor then why do both the best defensive sides in world union have league players as defensive coaches. Its because league defence is technically a hell of alot better then Unions.

There are up to 700 tackles in a game of league. Thats at least three times your average Union game, yet even with the larger workload league players make a higher percentage of effective tackles over the 80 minutes.

I laughed when I heard the commentator say that England had made 80 tackles at about the 70 minute mark last week. Later that night I watched Fielden make 45 tackles in the league test, including plenty of big hits. Plus, he was working hard in the tackles to win the ground, something that doesn happen in Union( as Bluebag mentioned). Of course, thats just one of the many tactical aspect of the game, you know, those tactics that league supposedly doesnt have.

Sailor was a shit defender in both codes. The difference is that he had better defenders around him in league.

Its an out and out lie to state that Union defence is better then leagues.

 

[El Diablo]

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

Well why do Union hire many leaguies to coach them in defence?

read this article here

 

[Edwahu]

To illustrate my point, there were 699 tackles in the league grand final and 70 missed tackles, or 10 percent. In the NZ v Australia WC semi there were 223 tackles and 37 missed tackles, or 16 percent.

The only time that Union would definitely have better missed tackles stats is when there is very little expansive play and goalline pressure (something which is everpresent in league), like in the final. Generally they are probably pretty simmilar at the top level until you consider the workload.

Just dont bring up sides like Manly and Souths though :lol:

 

[gaterooze]

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

Well why do Union hire many leaguies to coach them in defence?

read this article here

A funny bit from that article:

"After all, the basics of the two codes are so similar that anything employed in one is almost certain to be considered by the other. Witness the emergence of the short kick-off as a regular feature of NRL matches this season."

Um... they've been doing the shot kick-off for years, mate. It's just a low-percentage strategy, so a team will only use it when they're desperate to get back into the game.

 

[incredible_holc]

and another thing you try both options:
Standing 1m behind the ruck or standing 10m behind the ruck and tell me which is harder????????

 

[bayrep]

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

Well why do Union hire many leaguies to coach them in defence?

read this article here

A funny bit from that article:

"After all, the basics of the two codes are so similar that anything employed in one is almost certain to be considered by the other. Witness the emergence of the short kick-off as a regular feature of NRL matches this season."

Um... they've been doing the shot kick-off for years, mate. It's just a low-percentage strategy, so a team will only use it when they're desperate to get back into the game.

I actualy think that the league defence is killing the attack in union. You saw league defence employed in S12 after the first sesion of S12 to try and nullify the attacking play.

 

[Bluebag]

Union has two extra defenders on the field and the techniques are very ordinary, even AFL teams use league tackling skills to improve defence. If a league team was standing so close to the ruck as they do in union there would be less field goals as the players would have gotten to Wilkinson faster than the Aussies did.

 

[iggy plop]

that being said, more people watched this game than have EVER watched a rugby league match at any one time.

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

Go ask Garrick Morgan what he thought of his time and tackling in league? :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[iggy plop]

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

Well why do Union hire many leaguies to coach them in defence?

read this article here

A funny bit from that article:

"After all, the basics of the two codes are so similar that anything employed in one is almost certain to be considered by the other. Witness the emergence of the short kick-off as a regular feature of NRL matches this season."

Um... they've been doing the shot kick-off for years, mate. It's just a low-percentage strategy, so a team will only use it when they're desperate to get back into the game.

I actualy think that the league defence is killing the attack in union. You saw league defence employed in S12 after the first sesion of S12 to try and nullify the attacking play.

Watching some of those old Wallaby Tests from the 80's I think attcking play in union was already stuffed.

They were shockers.

 

[bayrep]

PS: defence in RL is piss poor. Just ask Wendell. stood out like dogs nuts.

Well why do Union hire many leaguies to coach them in defence?

read this article here

A funny bit from that article:

"After all, the basics of the two codes are so similar that anything employed in one is almost certain to be considered by the other. Witness the emergence of the short kick-off as a regular feature of NRL matches this season."

Um... they've been doing the shot kick-off for years, mate. It's just a low-percentage strategy, so a team will only use it when they're desperate to get back into the game.

I actualy think that the league defence is killing the attack in union. You saw league defence employed in S12 after the first sesion of S12 to try and nullify the attacking play.

Watching some of those old Wallaby Tests from the 80's I think attcking play in union was already stuffed.

They were shockers.

Read my post again Iggy!

 

[ripper]

And yet 10's of millions prefer union over league worldwide

 

[rugged]

it might even get worse in the future ie the defence in union. junior rugby players don't tackle until they are about 9 or 10, whereas they tackle from under 7s in junior league. not sure how many years this has been going on for.

you can really see the difference with the league players when they compete in the school rugby competition and rep carnivals. the union players don't have the timing of the tackles when players are coming at them quickly. they are so used to just hugging people when they come at them slowly.

 

[russ13]

Ripper why was the global audience so small.


taken from (London)Times on Line article by John Goodbody 16 December 2003.

At the moment Jonny Wilkinson drop-kicked England to victory over Australia in the final, there were 15 million viewers in Britain. The match produced an average audience of 12.7 million. This was rugby’s highest in the UK since the World Cup final at Twickenham in 1991, when an average of 13.6 million saw the game between the same countries.

The 2003 figures also represent more than half the confirmed global television audience for the final last month. Initiative, the international media agency that specialises in collating data, reports that 22 million watched the game worldwide.

 

[ripper]

And yet only 26,000 people turned up to a semi-final in the 2000 rugby league world cup featuring the home team, on a crap night, while around 55-60 thousand turned up to one on an equally crap night in Sydney for a France vs England Game which every one knew was going to be a borefest because Wilkinson was playing