The ARLC must tackle wrestling in NRL

[clutch]

The game evolves.

The wrestle is one of the main tactics of some of the most dominant teams in game the last few years, i.e., the Melbourne Storm teams.

When a teams have been as successful as they have, others will see it as the winning strategy and attempt to mimick it.

Canterbury largely believed they had the game to succeed against the Storm's (and ultimately the rest of the competition's) defensive tactics. It certainly was against the bulk of their opposition this season which is why they had such a great year. Ball playing forwards that kept the ball moving, and utilising the width of the field generally which limited the opportunity for multi-player tackles such as those in 1 or 2 from the ruck plays, or dominant tackles by getting towards the outside of outside defenders.

The GF was truly a battle of the coaches and strategy and those who didn't appreciate it are fickle fans who are would rather be entertained with the razzle dazzle of touch footy.

This year's GF was again the chess game of two great rugby league masterminds in their now regular end-of-year grand championship finale.

Bellamy countered the Hasler ball players by moving his defenders positioned 2 or more from the ruck quicker than the ability of Haslers forwards to ball play. It shut them down. Frankly, no ball playing forward is not going to be as quick and agile as one of the three ball playing halves. The Storm dominated Canterbury's ball playing forwards, and Canterbury's forward became stuck in no man's land and unable to adapt from what had been so successful for them all season.

There will be a team that will utilise tactics and will suceed against Melbourne's wrestle. Until then, it is going to be the preferred tactic of most teams, as long as Melbourne are winning premierships with it. Amending rules such as the 40m can promote kicking early sets an is an over reaction. We don't want rugby league replicating union. Running the ball out of the defensive redzone and pressure of a dominant defence in this instance is one of the highlights of rugby league. Fiddling around with rules as a knee-jerk reaction to the strategic facet of part of the game can lead to unwanted implications elsewhere.

 

[LRC69]

I like the wrestle... It stops too many dummy half runs.

If you want to beat it then use a good off load and create 2nd phase footy and play some footy off the back of that..this is what leagues about not fast play the balls with dummy half runs and safety first footy.

Why would a team try to pass it around or be creative when the play the ball is so fast?

And I absolutely cant stand the submissive tackle where a player hits the defence and drops to his belly so he can get a quick play the ball.

The problem with the game is not the speed of the play the ball, its the lack of having the ability to play 2nd phase footy.

So to compensate for the wrestle and slower play the balls you would need some bigger guys who can hit the line and off load and have your smaller blokes play off this.

This would also mean you'de have bigger guys in the defence for the smaller guys to target.

Another issue is playing so much night footy with dew on the ground...you don't need to spread your defence as much as player cant play the full width of the field for fear of being slid out...therefore the defence is even harder to break (especially with more mobile players today)

 

[eozsmiles]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/nrl/the-arlc-must-tackle-wrestling-in-nrl/story-fndujljl-1226489456158

I can understand that Paul Kent wants to see more footy. But I have to disagree with his assertion that a team that is good at wrestling does well in the competition. You're not going to win games doing more head locks, chicken wings and the like. A team that has a better defensive structure and strategy will. One of the main reasons why Melbourne won the comp because they nullified the Dog's ball playing forwards early.

Players are stronger and a lot faster today. They have the ability to break out of tackles easy. Hence why more effort is required to bring them down. The only way to eliminiate so called "wrestling" is for the player being tackled to surrender early like touch rugby. That way, you don't need 3 to 4 players in the tackle to pin him down.

That's what wrestling is - a huge part of the defensive strategy. Getting tackled players on their back, holding them up to get 7+ second play-the-ball's, spinning them so they don't face the goal line. You want to slow down the 1st/2nd receiver? Get it done before the dummy half gets the ball lol.
You've got the dark side that makes it all happen....rushing off the line to test the ref's 10m patience is the first trick and it happens before a player gets touched, plus splitting and spreading markers....this makes the wrestle easier to adopt. Shrink the time for the 1st receiver and then comes the chicken winging and head locking, attacking tackled players wrist and elbow to force a drop ball thus making him slow down his play the ball, ditto knees and ankles, defensive players rolling off tackles deliberately across the limbs of the attacking player, the list goes on.

Every team practises wrestling and that is one thing. It's the right hook. But you need the left jab first - quick/illegal line speed and a dirty mind. Get those right and after that it doesn't matter what attack the opposition has - they don't have the time or space or territory to make it happen.

 

[adamkungl]

The game evolves.

The wrestle is one of the main tactics of some of the most dominant teams in game the last few years, i.e., the Melbourne Storm teams.

When a teams have been as successful as they have, others will see it as the winning strategy and attempt to mimick it.

Canterbury largely believed they had the game to succeed against the Storm's (and ultimately the rest of the competition's) defensive tactics. It certainly was against the bulk of their opposition this season which is why they had such a great year. Ball playing forwards that kept the ball moving, and utilising the width of the field generally which limited the opportunity for multi-player tackles such as those in 1 or 2 from the ruck plays, or dominant tackles by getting towards the outside of outside defenders.

The GF was truly a battle of the coaches and strategy and those who didn't appreciate it are fickle fans who are would rather be entertained with the razzle dazzle of touch footy.

This year's GF was again the chess game of two great rugby league masterminds in their now regular end-of-year grand championship finale.

Bellamy countered the Hasler ball players by moving his defenders positioned 2 or more from the ruck quicker than the ability of Haslers forwards to ball play. It shut them down. Frankly, no ball playing forward is not going to be as quick and agile as one of the three ball playing halves. The Storm dominated Canterbury's ball playing forwards, and Canterbury's forward became stuck in no man's land and unable to adapt from what had been so successful for them all season.

There will be a team that will utilise tactics and will suceed against Melbourne's wrestle. Until then, it is going to be the preferred tactic of most teams, as long as Melbourne are winning premierships with it. Amending rules such as the 40m can promote kicking early sets an is an over reaction. We don't want rugby league replicating union. Running the ball out of the defensive redzone and pressure of a dominant defence in this instance is one of the highlights of rugby league. Fiddling around with rules as a knee-jerk reaction to the strategic facet of part of the game can lead to unwanted implications elsewhere.

Excellent post.

There might be an argument to speed up the ruck but most of the complaints are so far of the mark it's embarrassing. Especially when they're paid to analyse Rugby League...

 

[AlwaysGreen]

Wrestling is not the exclusive domain of the defending team. Attacking sides are just as bad as hanging onto defenders and slowing down the play as the tacklers. The ruck is so ambiguous and badly policed that attacking teams are prepared to have a slow play the ball in the hope that they may get a penalty.

We have 2 referees now. One referee's sole job is to police the ruck and penalize both sides as he sees fit.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Wrestling is not the exclusive domain of the defending team. Attacking sides are just as bad as hanging onto defenders and slowing down the play as the tacklers. The ruck is so ambiguous and badly policed that attacking teams are prepared to have a slow play the ball in the hope that they may get a penalty.

We have 2 referees now. One referee's sole job is to police the ruck and penalize both sides as he sees fit.

Agree, but it is weird that since we have had the 2 refs the problem has got worse instead of better.

I would hope the commission has a big review on this matter. Subtle changes rather than a sledgehammer approach is required BUT action needs to be taken soon.

 

[BunniesMan]

Something must be done to speed the game. I've had a feeling the game has slowed down but when every man and his dog keep saying it's faster than ever you think you're crazy. Then someone comes up with numbers proving you're not.

There is a problem. The Storm started it, now everyone is doing it. It has to be fixed. But I don't know what the solution is.

 

[adamkungl]

You don't even know what the problem is, let alone the solution.

 

[lockyno1]

Half the interchanges and you see less wrestling, it is really that simple. I'll take 6, but I would be pushing for 4 interchanges, and I am sorry but if you can't run your 130kg butt around, then too bad. Less interchanges, the less likely players like Kasiano will have a sleep on the attacker!

 

[Apey]

Half the interchanges and you see less wrestling, it is really that simple. I'll take 6, but I would be pushing for 4 interchanges, and I am sorry but if you can't run your 130kg butt around, then too bad. Less interchanges, the less likely players like Kasiano will have a sleep on the attacker!

:crazy:

Less interchanges = more tired forwards = more wrestling to slow down the game and ensure team mates are back onside. Honestly laughable that anyone thinks less interchanges would encourage less wrestling :lol:

Less interchanges has its merit but not for that reason.

 

[Bman26]

:crazy:

Less interchanges = more tired forwards = more wrestling to slow down the game and ensure team mates are back onside. Honestly laughable that anyone thinks less interchanges would encourage less wrestling :lol:

Less interchanges has its merit but not for that reason.

This. All I hear on the radio / read in the paper is that less interchange will speed up the game, not a chance.

 

[God-King Dean]

Kent's a kent.

 

[RufusRex]

Treating symptoms not the cause ...

The reason teams wrestle is that they want to slow the play the ball down so that the defensive line can reset again. Bring back the 5m rule for both Attack and Defence .. use the two refs to get both sides back.

No more requirement to slow the play down so much as your defensive line needs less time to get back. Dummy half play will be limited as the defensive line is closer. The 5/8 will make a return as a required link between the forwards and the outside backs. We may even see the return of footballers and not athletes/robots.

 

[Pierced Soul]

i'm thinking 7m myself. 5 may be a bit too short. cut the interchanges as well so we see more small players getting a chance to use their skills.

regardless of a team slowing down the ruck, you still need to be able to score points. you can have a team of expert wrestlers but if you cant score points it doesnt mean shit. broncos in the last 2 months couldnt score a try to save their lives, wouldnt have mattered if they slowed the ruck down to 10 secs

 

[LineBall]

Treating symptoms not the cause ...

The reason teams wrestle is that they want to slow the play the ball down so that the defensive line can reset again. Bring back the 5m rule for both Attack and Defence .. use the two refs to get both sides back.

No more requirement to slow the play down so much as your defensive line needs less time to get back. Dummy half play will be limited as the defensive line is closer. The 5/8 will make a return as a required link between the forwards and the outside backs. We may even see the return of footballers and not athletes/robots.

This.

The increase in wrestling didn't just start to happen for no reason.

The play the ball now has become such an important aspect of the game when it never used to be.

Make the defence stand back 5 metres and reduce the interchange to 4.

Also the refs need to be instructed to have absolutely no tolerance for the tacklers hanging on too long. But they also need to come down heavy on the ball carrier. Some of the attacking players, the way they move off the mark and push forward and don't submit when the ref calls held makes the problem even worse, as a defender is not going to let go if the player is always trying to pinch an extra few metres.

 

[t-ba]

Agreed on reducing the gap between the lines. Top that with an elimination of the wrestle and I think the game would be better for it in the long run.

Getting rid of the wrestle without changing anything else would probably result in touch football...

 

[super_coach]

In 2005 we had a really quick game,The Tigers and the Cowboys were the masters of the lightning play the balls, the quick dashes out of dummy half and than quick shifts of the ball to the edges.That resulted in some great attacking games of football.

After the Tigers won, their was an outcry from some coaches and in particular Ricky Sticky who had assembled a team of monsters who could not go the pace so the Nrl decided to slow things down in 2006 and ever since than its got slower and slower.

Of course their are other factors, teams are all being coached in ways of slowing the game down but really it all comes down to what Harrigan and Raper want. They could speed things up tomorrow. Although like others I dont want to see Rugby score lines in the NRL and I like to see teams rewarded for excellent defensive structures. On the other hand we have to give guys like Thurston,Marshall,Barber,Farah,Slater and so on every chance to be able to attack and that is not happening at present

 

[docbrown]

Would encourage more kicking early in the set as well.

A general 40m kick advantage would totally change the nature of sets. Rather than aiming for routine completion teams are encouraged to seize attacking opportunities at any time either through early kicks to exploit a lazy defence or passing the ball more often, all of which leads to a more enjoyable game.

 

[southwalesrabbitoh]

If you reduce the gap between the teams to 7 or 5m then you'll see less of those thrilling passing plays with lots of decoy runners. I love them. That's why I want to see the gap increased to 12m. But it's 12m most of the time in the NRL now in any case. So refs need to make sure the defensive team does not start their run until the ball has cleared the ruck. Also I like seeing a good legs tackle rewarded by the tackler being able to hold onto the attackers' legs. And as I've said I like seeing as some wrestling. It's still be in the vast majority of the 80 minutes, rugby league you'll be watching. Reduce the interchanges and the numbers on the field, then you'll see a positive effect on the sport. But I suppose it's what you like to watch. It seems to me that some of you need to change your diets and take on less sugar. Maybe do some relaxation exercises too.

 

[clutch]

i'm thinking 7m myself. 5 may be a bit too short. cut the interchanges as well so we see more small players getting a chance to use their skills.

regardless of a team slowing down the ruck, you still need to be able to score points. you can have a team of expert wrestlers but if you cant score points it doesnt mean shit. broncos in the last 2 months couldnt score a try to save their lives, wouldnt have mattered if they slowed the ruck down to 10 secs

7m? another poster had 12m?

the markings on a rugby league field are in 10m intervals and guide refs to set the defence.

i guarantee, you'll never get a consistent defensive line if refs need to get back 7 or 12m.