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The Salary Cap Is Not Fair

nqboy

First Grade
Messages
8,914
LINK

THERE probably isn't too much sympathy for the Bulldogs over Mark O'Meley's defection to the Roosters. The Bondi club forked out massive money for "Shrek'', which led to Dogs coach Steve Folkes reportedly telling O'Meley that he would be crazy not to take the deal. The Bulldogs are probably the only club to stick stringently within the NRL's salary cap after being docked 37 points in 2002 for breaching the system. They have been bleeding for the past five seasons as a result, losing player after player.

Missing from the Dogs' 2004 premiership-winning team are Johnathan Thurston, Roy Asotasi, Braith Anasta, Steve Price, Jamie Feeney and Hutch Maiava. They also turned Nate Myles into an Origin player, only to lose him to the Roosters. They bought all those players as kids and developed them - some into international stars and others into very good first graders. Like the Broncos, the Bulldogs have a history of developing their own talent, of turning unknowns into household names.

Sonny Bill Williams and Willie Mason were scouted and now command massive contracts. To keep them at the club, the Dogs had to off-load the likes of Anasta, O'Meley and Myles. The Bulldogs aren't the only ones to suffer - look at the Dragons - but they are a glaring example of what is wrong with the salary cap. Clubs simply aren't rewarded for developing their own talent.

The Dogs spot players such as Thurston, Asotasi and Anasta, bring them along and watch them blossom, only for clubs that are too lazy to develop their own talent to come along with big-money offers and steal them away. Where's the justice in that?

The NRL says the cap is about having an even competition, using as evidence of its success the fact six different teams have won the competition since 2000. But it's an even competition at the expense of loyalty. The fact is, great eras are defined by great teams, such as the Dragons' reign in the '60s, the Eels in the '80s and the Raiders of the late '80s and early '90s. Teams these days don't get a chance to build a dynasty.

Price, Asotasi, Thurston and Anasta should have been Bulldogs for life but that can't happen under the present system. Which means the Bulldogs have to turn another kid into a star and watch as in three, four or five years the unfair process repeats itself. Next time around it may be Mason or Williams they are forced to off-load.

And that's just not fair.
 

shaggy

Juniors
Messages
885
boo hooo

the brisbane lions won three grand finals because their players accepted less money to stay together so they could win comps, you can build a dynasty its just up to the clubs

but i agree players should be awarded concessions for developing players

or you can do what the raiders are doing and that is instead of using the salary cap to buy established first graders, spend it to tie up your yonuger players to long term deals
 
Messages
229
The salary cap is fairer then any other self centered system your f**king ass is going to come up with.

How do people not see this.......
 

[FKN-SIK]

Juniors
Messages
1,470
The salary cap is fair and i suppose it provides an even playing field, however clubs who develop their own juniors should be rewarded somehow so that other lazy clubs can't poach them with large amounts of money.
 

perverse

Referee
Messages
26,683
larger salary cap concessions for long serving players (scaling upward from around 15% at 5 years to 50% at 10 years) including junior football is my answer.
 

gregstar

Referee
Messages
20,465
7 different premiers in 8 years.

the cap works.

i have every reason to loathe it given the amount of talent we've generated for other clubs, but i'd rather see regular changes at the top for the sake of fans.

so be it.
 

bobmar28

Bench
Messages
4,304
Who wants to see the same club win the premiership 4 or 5 years in a row? Only fans of that club. The salary cap works.
 

Hurriflatch

Referee
Messages
22,093
the dogs cheated to get these players in the first place so they should never have been there to begin with
 

Nathan B

Juniors
Messages
556
gregstar said:
7 different premiers in 8 years.

the cap works.

i have every reason to loathe it given the amount of talent we've generated for other clubs, but i'd rather see regular changes at the top for the sake of fans.

so be it.

Why don't we just roll a dice, then?

I want to see 3-4 teams given a good 5-year period to win as much as they can, and the rest of the league playing catch-up. BUT... after those 5 years those 3-4 teams will be the ones playing catch-up, and there'll be 3-4 new teams fighting it out for the spoils.

Why do I want this...

1. We'll get the chance to see great sides again. With 16 even teams there's no chance for greatness. No team comes remotely close to going back-to-back these days, so what are the chances of a threepeat? Do you think the NBA regrets the 90's Bulls, 80's Celtics and 80's Lakers? Do we regret the 80's Dogs, 80's Parra, 90's Raiders, Broncos and Manly? Of course we don't. Great teams define a sport's history. In 10 years time when my kids ask who were the great teams in the 00's I'll just tell them to get the old NRL dart board out and go for their life. Just don't ask me to match a year with the team.

2. It will reward the strong clubs. The clubs that actually know how to run a professional football club. These clubs will make the strong periods count with titles, and the weak periods go very quickly. These days the strong clubs are just like the rest of them... go through the regular season in 3rd gear because any higher is next to impossible to maintain, hope to go on a few winning streaks to get in the eight, pray for a low injury toll, hope to hit some form at the right time.

3. Loyalty. That's what makes rugby league so great. But it's dwindling away, and soon we'll be just like the NFL and other US sports. Don't get me wrong, I love US sports, but club loyalty is hardly an issue over there.
 

Nathan B

Juniors
Messages
556
Hurriflatch said:
the dogs cheated to get these players in the first place so they should never have been there to begin with

Who was in our 25-man squad in 2002 and 2001?

I know Sonny is a young talent, but I seem to remember him scraping pigeon sh*t off of Belmore Oval and playing SG Ball as a 15-year old rather than being included in any sort of salary cap.
 
Messages
3,818
Boooooo bloody hoooo!..let them take a pay cut if they want to stay..or of coarse be coached by that coach.who would have thought 2 or 3 yrs ago that the cowboys v south would be a top game..tho after 5 yrs tyhere should be a concession and after 10 should not be included.
 

Hurriflatch

Referee
Messages
22,093
Nathan B said:
Who was in our 25-man squad in 2002 and 2001?

I know Sonny is a young talent, but I seem to remember him scraping pigeon sh*t off of Belmore Oval and playing SG Ball as a 15-year old rather than being included in any sort of salary cap.

O'meley signed from the Beagles in 2000
Ryan signed from Parra in 2002 (signed before cheating was known about)
El Masri
Patten
Price (prior to leaving once the cheating was found out about and he couldn't be kept under that system)
Etc

all retained under the cap cheating.


and last time I checked the dogs re-signed Sonny Bill but they are now being forced to make those decisions other clubs have had to make before when the Dogs were cheating the cap.
 

t-ba

Post Whore
Messages
59,607
Nathan B said:
1. We'll get the chance to see great sides again. With 16 even teams there's no chance for greatness. No team comes remotely close to going back-to-back these days, so what are the chances of a threepeat? Do you think the NBA regrets the 90's Bulls, 80's Celtics and 80's Lakers? Do we regret the 80's Dogs, 80's Parra, 90's Raiders, Broncos and Manly? Of course we don't. Great teams define a sport's history. In 10 years time when my kids ask who were the great teams in the 00's I'll just tell them to get the old NRL dart board out and go for their life. Just don't ask me to match a year with the team.

Good to watch. But do you care to remember the Gold Coast, Wests, Balmain, Souths, Easts, Cronulla sides of Canberra's golden era? They were dire football sides that would probably struggle to match the Sydney Bulls and the Belrose Eagles...People forget just how terrible the bottom sides in the NSWRL were. They were pub comp sides FFS!

It also does nothing for a clubs health if they can't compete financially and suck for years on end as a result. You could forget about clubs like North QLD, Auckland and Melbourne surviving if there was no cap.

2. It will reward the strong clubs. The clubs that actually know how to run a professional football club. These clubs will make the strong periods count with titles, and the weak periods go very quickly. These days the strong clubs are just like the rest of them... go through the regular season in 3rd gear because any higher is next to impossible to maintain, hope to go on a few winning streaks to get in the eight, pray for a low injury toll, hope to hit some form at the right time.

No it won't, it will reward the clubs with a solid leagues club network. That's hardly the 'strong' and 'well run' clubs. Look at the Panthers. They've been a rabble most of their existance, but if they were allowed to release the financial resources of the Panthers Gaming Empire on the player market, they'd be the most powerful club in Sydney.

3. Loyalty. That's what makes rugby league so great. But it's dwindling away, and soon we'll be just like the NFL and other US sports. Don't get me wrong, I love US sports, but club loyalty is hardly an issue over there.

Really? Johnny Raper started life out as a Newtown Bluebag, but because his busted arse of a club was a rabble, he ended up at St George to win a premiership. Same deal with Ken Irvine and Manly, and any number of good players you could look at through history. It doesn't breed loyalty, it breeds obediance to the dollar. Which is basically the same as it is today, except that only the Broncos and the Sydney clubs with well run gaming empires would stand a chance of getting this kind of 'loyalty' out of these players.
 

Nathan B

Juniors
Messages
556
Hurriflatch said:
O'meley signed from the Beagles in 2000
Ryan signed from Parra in 2002 (signed before cheating was known about)
El Masri
Patten
Price (prior to leaving once the cheating was found out about and he couldn't be kept under that system)
Etc

all retained under the cap cheating.


and last time I checked the dogs re-signed Sonny Bill but they are now being forced to make those decisions other clubs have had to make before when the Dogs were cheating the cap.

Astoasi? Thurston? Myles? You're not including a lot of players considering your first post didn't care to mention any names whatsoever.

We're losing players now that had nothing to do with the salary cap drama. There's no need to bring it up.

Oh, and Price did remain in a cap-cheating system. It just wasn't ours!
 

851

Bench
Messages
3,141
The WestsTigers premiership team of 2005 has been torn apart to,6 players from the starting 13 in the GF have left the club.
But we are rebuilding again for another tilt at it,so the Dogs are not alone there.
 

Nathan B

Juniors
Messages
556
t-ba said:
Good to watch. But do you care to remember the Gold Coast, Wests, Balmain, Souths, Easts, Cronulla sides of Canberra's golden era? They were dire football sides that would probably struggle to match the Sydney Bulls and the Belrose Eagles...People forget just how terrible the bottom sides in the NSWRL were. They were pub comp sides FFS!

Friday night was the worst football I care to remember. Actually, include Thursday night's 'rep' game and it's definitely the worst pile of sh*t I've ever seen.

On the other stuff... I do want a salary cap. I just don't like the one we've got at the moment.
 

Hurriflatch

Referee
Messages
22,093
Nathan B said:
Astoasi? Thurston? Myles? You're not including a lot of players considering your first post didn't care to mention any names whatsoever.

We're losing players now that had nothing to do with the salary cap drama. There's no need to bring it up.

Oh, and Price did remain in a cap-cheating system. It just wasn't ours!

never said other clubs don't cheat
never said the dogs aren't losing players that were not part of the cap cheating but thats not the point are you really that thick.

clubs that haven't cheated the cap have been forced to make the decisions that the dogs are now making with the likes of Asotasi, O'Meley etc back in 1998, the Dogs have only been forced to start making those decisons since about 2003-2004 when the players that were kept via the dogs cheating came off contract.

Now that things are even the Dogs are finding out what other clubs have known for the last decade that you can't keep every player you want.
 

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