Union Scrums

bender · Mar 24, 2004

Last time i watched union (world cup) I was extremely surprised by the fact that very few union scrums seemed to go against the feed. This was in spite of the fact that they are widely said to be competive. In the scrums i saw, none were won against the feed. At a guess, I would say that one or two at the most seem to be won against the feed per game. The lineouts actually seemed to be a better method of possession changing.

ONe of the main reasons why it is said that League forwards cant convert to union is that they could nto handle the scrum. Given that it is never really won against the head, is scrummaging ability something which is grossly overated by union players or were the games i saw out of the ordinary and more scrums winnable against the feed?

Poida_Raider · Mar 24, 2004

winning scrums against the feed doesnt mean anything, it rarely happens in any form of the game. scrums in rugby union are more a test of forward strength and toughness. theres still plenty of scrummaging going on, i'm pretty sure rugby union front rowers are bigger than league ones, on the main anyways.

Auckland4ever · Mar 25, 2004

I dont know why some people are under the impression competitive scrummaging is all about winning the ball against the feed.
Just engaging into the scrum is competitive. Better timing & quicker, more powerful driving into the scrum can gain an advantage by getting over the center line of the scrum before the other team, negating a portion of their weight & strength. Positioning & varying resistance by the tight & loose can screw a scrum or prevent turning from happening.
Poor scrummaging = poor first phase attack, which often = mistakes.

bayrep · Mar 25, 2004

If you saw the 'Canes and Bulls S12 match you would have seen the importance of having a competitive scrum. Its not always about winning tight heads its about being able to defend and attack within the scrum. When ever the 'Canes had a put in to the scrum the Bulls pushed them backwards which meant that the scrum half never got the ball out cleanly which pushed the backline backwards and meant that they where no longer attacking from the front foot they werent able to run onto the ball. Just from the scrum the Bulls were able to change from a defensive set piece into an attacking set piece. In the world cup you would have seen a similar thing especially with the minows playing the big boys. Teams that are very similar in technique, strength and mobility will often resort to trying to disrupt the backline.

Winning a tight head is not always the goal as the opposing hooker has to be set to try and steal the ball in the feed. Most opposing scrums will use their hooker to push against the feed to have the above result.

Thomas · Mar 25, 2004

Many RL fans don't see the points above. Scrums determine how much quality ball the backs get. Sure there aren't many won against the feed, but as a former halfback, I can honestly say that passing the ball from a stationary scrum is a hell of a lot easier than one that is going backwards.

I've even had a scrum collapse on me as I was reaching in to get the ball...bloody soft front row!!

Hazy · Mar 25, 2004

Bloody slow halfback Id say... \\

/

Thomas · Mar 28, 2004

Oooh..handbags at noon...

I see your point, but in this case my pack was inexperienced and when I went in to retrieve the ball, the opposition did their secondary shove and my pack wilted. Actually the only thing I had going for me when I played halfback was quick service and a yappy mouth...I certainly didn't have a deceptive step, great tackling skills or a booming kick.

Anonymous · Mar 29, 2004

Union scrums are more than 'lean in and stand still'. It can be bloody painful at times (as an ex-tight head prop I speak from experience).

Also the defence efforts of a flanker are often highlighted from scrums.

Hazy · Mar 30, 2004

Handbags at noon?

Your on, but I get to choose the colour...

I remember packing into the second row for a scrum right on our tryline, their feed...

For some reason I decided to psyche the boys up by saying "Pack it tight, dont let this bunch of girls get over us"

After the ensuing shove, as I was assisted to my feet from about five feet under the in goal, my second row partner advised me to leave my mouth for breathing in the future.... :?

Sydney Carton · Apr 1, 2004

Hazy said:
I remember packing into the second row for a scrum right on our tryline, their feed...

For some reason I decided to psyche the boys up by saying "Pack it tight, dont let this bunch of girls get over us"

After the ensuing shove, as I was assisted to my feet from about five feet under the in goal, my second row partner advised me to leave my mouth for breathing in the future.... :?

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Since going over to the dark side I am in awe of Rugby as a sport.

The scrums are beastial.

ozbash · Apr 2, 2004

i was a lock and loved scrums, you could get a short one into the opposition prop and he didnt have a clue where it came from..
the brawls were beauts :lol:

ruggabugga · May 15, 2004

Amazing! Our good League friend 'Bender" makes a post asking about scrums and nearly two months later he has not thanked any of those that have attempted to deliver him from his IGNORANCE. Do you think he is just a Troll. :shock:

Te Kaha · May 16, 2004

ruggabugga said:
Amazing! Our good League friend 'Bender" makes a post asking about scrums and nearly two months later he has not thanked any of those that have attempted to deliver him from his IGNORANCE. Do you think he is just a Troll. :shock:

Don't be a dickhead.

Anonymous · May 20, 2004

Yeah. RU scrums are awesome for causing neck injuries and f*cking up your ears to the extent that you are a deformed freak for the rest of your life. They also happen to be bloody boring and, on the balance of things, a total waste of time. Give me lean in and stand still any day.

bayrep · May 21, 2004

A very balanced argument you make Thierry. From now on all union games will no longer have scrums.

Tighthead · May 21, 2004

Yeah. RU scrums are awesome for causing neck injuries and f*cking up your ears to the extent that you are a deformed freak for the rest of your life. They also happen to be bloody boring and, on the balance of things, a total waste of time. Give me lean in and stand still any day.

More injuries occur in through tackling - should we get rid of that?

Explain to me how they are a waste of time again?

Tighthead · May 21, 2004

They also happen to be bloody boring.

Just because they fail to keep slack jawed half wits, who require fireworks and rock music to stay aware, interested, doesn't mean they should be outlawed.

Sydney Carton · May 22, 2004

They are not bloody boring when you're in one of them I can tell you.

CouldaBeenAnything · Jun 17, 2004

I've played a lot of Union over the years, but this year is my first when the move to the front row finally came...it has been a progression from fullback/centre to first 5, to number 8/flanker, most of last year as a lock, now tight head...its taking some getting use to, but it is good so far.

Scrums are a massive art of union as a game, like was explained earlier, so much impetus can be taken from them and it can set the tone for a whole match if a pack is smashed at first scrum...

League is a great game, but scrums aren't part of what makes them great anymore, I would like to see some competition back in them

dimitri · Jun 17, 2004

scrums are extremely overrated

give me my league scrums anyday

THE TEAM WHO IS FEEDING THE SCRUM DESERVES TO GET THE BALL, THAS WHY THEY ARE FEEDING IT IN THE FIRST PLACE

LEAGUE SCRUMS are
quick
fast
efficient
tidy
normally only set once
and theres even the occasional biff

kills any boring old union scrum

Union Scrums

Juniors

Bench

Juniors

Juniors

First Grade

Juniors

First Grade

Juniors

Juniors

Juniors

Referee

Juniors

First Grade

Juniors

Juniors

Guest

Guest

Juniors

Juniors

First Grade