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What to do with Level 3 - Parramatta Leagues Club

parra pete

Referee
Messages
20,699
thanks for the ammunition



he is the devil we know, thats why some people want him gone

who has bitched about the piokie tax and smokng rules more than Denis the menace ?

in fact, has anyone made more excuses than Denis ?

who said we would be broke in 5 years ?

No one is disputing that it belongs to the members but is this the type of comment you would want from the CEO of your local club ?

What do you know about the Pokie Tax and smoking rules that he (DF) doesn't?
Who says the Club WON'T be broke in 5 years?
Who thought the Bank of Scotland would be broke, and the big Yank Banks?
What excuses has Denis made..except for the poor performance of players..
It amazes me that the CEO is the one to cop the blame for poor on field performances.
It's like saying "Gees Frank Facer must have been shocking as a CEO if Jack Gibson couldn't win a title with St George"
I prefer my people (ie - those in the know) to tell it like it is..cut the bullsh*t and get to the chase.
 

parra pete

Referee
Messages
20,699
Love the passion in this thread...Keep it rolling. Little bit of views from the other side never hurt anyone.
 

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
As such, any new CEO candidate should be looked at purely on what experience they have and what potential they display and not automatically cast aside because they do not have 30 years experience.
Bottom line is that any CEO candidate would be a candidate for a job vacancy (if/when it exists) that should be properly advertised, and they should need to be judged on merit through a robust recruitment process. We did it for our FG coach just recently, surely it would work that way for teh CEO?

I would be very surprised if that was not the way it worked - in fact surprised wouldn't be the word... I would be shocked and consider cancelling my Leagues Club membership.

I agree HJ..Fitzy is coming to retirement age anyway. He should go out on his terms..
I have no doubt Fitzy WILL go out on his own terms, regardless of the structure of the LC Board after these elections. Fitzy by reports is on a two year annual review and contract structure, which came around in November 2008. It will be November 2010 before anything in his current contract/review can be changed, and then some time after that (min 3-6 months?) before he might trigger and three-strikes-and-out style of performance review dismissal action.

Sure, he might negotiate a pay out sooner than 2011, but you can bet that will be on his own terms....

- - - -

All this focus on potential CEOs is hugely irrelevent. The most that could happen (quickly) imo is the restructure of the CEO postition into two distinct splits of duties (LC & FC, in line with NRL moving back to FC), but Denis would still hold both - until he himself chooses to vacate either (or accepts a payout for "losing" either from his duties), only then creating the vacancy.

An earlier question was could someone be an LC Director and an FC CEO (if they were split)... I believe it would be difficult/a conflict to do both at the same time. But also I believe that an LC Director could resign and apply for the FC CEO position - which, let's face it probably won't be able to be created during the next 2 year term of the LC Board anyway...

So why not run for and get on the LC Board, Terry ;-)
 

parra pete

Referee
Messages
20,699
Maybe Denis was spot on with his prediction...I cannot guarantee the Club will exist in 5 years time....reading Rebecca Wilson's column in today's Tele he may have a had a vision into the future.
If the money is not there, it is not there. Have a look how much super funds have dwindled in the past 12 months...
Players may have to take massive pay cuts, and find supporting jobs (Oh No!!!!) if the code is to survive in Sydney..
Or is it easier to adopt the Three Monkeys ideals ---hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil.
I have posted this article for no reason except to agree with Bec Wilson view of where sport is heading in these days of tough economic climate...
When it comes to people feeding THEIR families - or FEEDING footballers, guess which one they will choose.

Gloom and doom are knocking for Australian sport

By Rebecca Wilson
January 31, 2009 12:00am
THE front pages are screaming at us. Doom and gloom have arrived and even the happiest souls among us reckon we are stuffed. Business sections in every newspaper around the globe are full of gloomy headlines that strongly indicate the world is heading straight for hell in a hand basket.

Yet when you turn to the back of the paper, life is apparently good. You could almost feel refreshed and optimistic after reading a few pages of sports news.

Nothing seems to have changed. Tennis players are still very, very rich. Geoff Ogilvy has a new Mercedes and a million dollars for spending four days on a Hawaiian golf course.

Our millionaire cricketers want a pay rise. And our footballers seem to think they should be immune from the global economic crunch because, well, they play footy.

Only our rugby union stars have succumbed so far to the crisis. The Wallabies have copped a small pay cut per Test match in return for their administrators also becoming a little more austere. Union bosses say they will do some belt-tightening by giving up their first-class air travel and slicing a few dollars from their almost seven-figure salaries.


What is not yet obvious to football administrators in this country is that the other three codes - soccer, AFL and rugby league - are in for some nasty shocks in coming months that will change the face of their sports forever.

What we have seen so far is nothing in the scheme of things. Some leading rugby league clubs will be forced to cut salaries, merge, move or close down. The AFL's pretentious and precocious expansion policy will be nullified while AFL chiefs try to shore up broke Melbourne clubs.

Soccer is already haemorrhaging money and will only survive if the generosity of billionaire Frank Lowy continues. Crowds for the A-League have been terrible. It is only a matter of time before sponsors start withdrawing in their droves from the sport.

Rugby union has lost two huge benefactors in recent weeks. The withdrawal of Ford and Vodafone has hit union hard, with the sport's administration slashing costs, staff levels and board members' fees. More big-name companies like the iconic Canterbury brand are set to follow.

The AFL has toned down its bleating about expansion in recent weeks. The Sydney Swans recorded an $800,000 loss last year. Corporate sales were well down on previous years and even if the Swans succeed on the field in 2009, insiders say the likelihood of turning a profit in the next few years is next to none.

A team in the west of Sydney simply cannot happen while the world sinks into recession, because there will be no money to build it.
Rugby league will be the hardest hit. A sport that relies so heavily on small businesses for support of its clubs will struggle as local plumbers, mechanics and signwriters start having to sack staff. They most certainly won't be able to afford a sleeve sponsorship of their local league team.

These are the people who buy boxes and signage at their suburban footy grounds. Even the giants of the sport - Harvey Norman, Wizard Home Loans and Telstra - are looking long and hard at their heavy commitment to rugby league. Harvey Norman has shut stores in recent weeks. Something has to give.

The Cronulla Sharks, Wests Tigers, South Sydney and Penrith are in diabolical financial shape. The Sharks have already said they are in grave danger of sinking into irretrievable debt. The closing of clubs is no longer if, but when.

Critics of the salary cap continue to maintain it should be increased. 2009 should see them off. The cap must be lowered if teams want to survive. This is no longer about greedy players - it is about whether they will have a team to play in.

Rugby league board members travel around Australia and New Zealand at the pointy end of the plane every weekend. They can pick and choose which matches they attend (with partners) and the NRL puts them up in five-star accommodation.

This obscenely greedy practice has gone on for years and should cease immediately. Board members must set an example. Rugby union is doing it. League and AFL will be forced to follow for the sake of financial survival.

Make no mistake. Sport will change forever this year. Football might just return to the days of its stars actually earning normal money and their bosses will have to cease the relentless pursuit of luxury at their code's expense.

The back pages will change soon. Bad news will be there when the winter descends. Gloom and doom are knocking. It's just that only a few have heard them coming.


http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,24984595-5001023,00.html
 
Last edited:

Hellsy

Immortal
Messages
30,754
I feel the doom and gloom of 2009.... it has made me cry several times in the last 2 weeks
 

Stagger eel

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
66,189
another day os spirited and passionate discussion from both sides of the fence, on behalf of all fans I wouls like to than Alan Overton, Terry Leabeater, Bob Gare, Colin Green and John chidiac for giving us their time.

We hope to have another on of these days very soon, possibly even at the trials match in Ringrose on the 15th.

stay tuned.
 

spiderdan

Bench
Messages
3,743
good to meet a few more of you today.

from what alan said the pokie tax increases are pretty much killing the clubs' profits. from memory the club's loss last year is about the same as the football grants which is about the same as the club has paid in increased pokie tax.

the habit of over-reliance on pokie revenue developed by our club over the last 15 years needs to be changed. in my view part of the club's future business plans should be to make the football club close to or non reliant on leagues club grants. the leagues club still needs to be improved to make a good revenue stream and profits like we did not all that long ago, while the fc is transformed into a solid business venture in its own right. i know the lc was set up to fund the football team but the landsccape is vastly different to when it was set up 60 years ago.

the football club i think needs to be given some control over the nrl team. ovo gave a reason for why the fc don't have total control (which seemed like a reasonable explanation i just can't remember what it was) but i think it will help improve the fc membership base if the fc does have some control.

on the membership i think some problems lie in that many people don't know that there is a difference between the fc and lc. up until hellsy's membership drive a few years ago i thought lc and fc were the same thing. the other thing is that the club needs to be pro-active in attracting members. i sent col the link to collingwood's site. they push membership heavily and i think we should be the same. like i said today, we increase membership we can increase the premium we demand from sponsors. at present we have around 600 members. i honestly think with the right marketing drive and supporter push that could be 6k+.

anyway those are just a couple of my thoughts.

thanks for organising and i was happy to see that 3p and alan were able to engage in healthy discussion and debate for the betterment of the clubs. kudos to all of you.

for anyone that's bagged ovo or questioned his motives before i can honestly say i think he has the absolute best interests of parra at heart and operates without ego.
 

eelz47

Coach
Messages
12,423
the football club i think needs to be given some control over the nrl team. ovo gave a reason for why the fc don't have total control (which seemed like a reasonable explanation i just can't remember what it was) but i think it will help improve the fc membership base if the fc does have some control.


wasnt there today, but its something like guarenting the players wages
 

parra pete

Referee
Messages
20,699
I feel the doom and gloom of 2009.... it has made me cry several times in the last 2 weeks


That makes me feel sad....Believe it not Helen, I feel for you your predicament also..But, you are so positive in your outlook on life you will pick up something for sure and certain.
 

Parra Future

Juniors
Messages
890
good to meet a few more of you today.

from what alan said the pokie tax increases are pretty much killing the clubs' profits. from memory the club's loss last year is about the same as the football grants which is about the same as the club has paid in increased pokie tax.

the habit of over-reliance on pokie revenue developed by our club over the last 15 years needs to be changed. in my view part of the club's future business plans should be to make the football club close to or non reliant on leagues club grants. the leagues club still needs to be improved to make a good revenue stream and profits like we did not all that long ago, while the fc is transformed into a solid business venture in its own right. i know the lc was set up to fund the football team but the landsccape is vastly different to when it was set up 60 years ago.

the football club i think needs to be given some control over the nrl team. ovo gave a reason for why the fc don't have total control (which seemed like a reasonable explanation i just can't remember what it was) but i think it will help improve the fc membership base if the fc does have some control.

on the membership i think some problems lie in that many people don't know that there is a difference between the fc and lc. up until hellsy's membership drive a few years ago i thought lc and fc were the same thing. the other thing is that the club needs to be pro-active in attracting members. i sent col the link to collingwood's site. they push membership heavily and i think we should be the same. like i said today, we increase membership we can increase the premium we demand from sponsors. at present we have around 600 members. i honestly think with the right marketing drive and supporter push that could be 6k+.

anyway those are just a couple of my thoughts.

thanks for organising and i was happy to see that 3p and alan were able to engage in healthy discussion and debate for the betterment of the clubs. kudos to all of you.

for anyone that's bagged ovo or questioned his motives before i can honestly say i think he has the absolute best interests of parra at heart and operates without ego.

Good to meet you today Spiderdan. And thanks for the link.
 

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
If the money is not there, it is not there. Have a look how much super funds have dwindled in the past 12 months...
Players may have to take massive pay cuts, and find supporting jobs (Oh No!!!!) if the code is to survive in Sydney..
Players (and their greedy managers pushing up the deals) have been overpaid for years now.

The whole code - not just Parra/Denis - has to have a rethink about what it can afford clubs to dole out in player contracts, in other words the cost of the game.

In the past few years some players, fans and media commentators have been whinging for the salary cap to go up and up and up... but we should resist those self-interested calls, and yes as Bec says it might even need to go down.

SOme players - with an expectation of what they would earn through league - may use that as a reason to switch codes, or switch to play in Europe. So what? If they want to chase money above all else, let them go, and let's not compare to what the game here hasn't got.

But even with a lowered cap, we will still be left with guys who can make a decent living out of footy, and who actually want to play it in Australia, in Sydney and in Parramatta first and foremost, rather than a bunch of big-heads who's ambition is simply to chase more and more coin whenever it is on offer.

I'd be happy watching an even playing field of guys happy to play and not earn the maximum possible worldwide wage for doing so. It's like the 85/100 years of the comp before Superleague and overpaid players didn't through up champions and good footy by the truckload.

So what if a few guys with dollar signs in their eyes give our code the skip? There will be plenty of others who will entertain us, and put blood sweat and tears in for us, just like they have in Syndey rugby league since 1908, and Parra since 1947.
 

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
It's probably the best thing she's written in her whole career Junior... mostly valid points imo.
 

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