Which brand of ball do you like - NBA or international?

[CanadianSteve]

Some questions or points I think are raised by the recent Olympic basketball tournament:

Does the relatively poor performance of the US team devalue the attraction of the NBA? I still think the NBA is the best league, but the style of play can be boring - too much 2 man game, throw it into the post, wait for the double team, and throw it out to a shooter.

The style of the good Olympic teams was more exciting - lots of passing, good fast breaks, and great shooting. The NBA teams seem to have a lot more players who are role players only, there to set picks, rebound and play D, but can't shoot. I noticed whenever the US tried to trap the Argies or Lithuanians, the guy being doubled would find an open man, and 2-3 quick passes later a wide open 3 pointer was taken. Whereas in the NBA that trapping can work because there are bad shooters who can be left open.

I think the NBA style of play was more exciting in the 80s - higher scoring, more running, better shooting and passing. Some teams play a nice free-flowing style now, particularly the Kings, but most don't run much. And there are too many scores in the 80s and lower now.

Will the continued influx of European players change the NBA for the better?

Comments?

 

[El Coconuto]

The NBA is so much more fan-friendly then the tedious rules of international basketball. Modern day European basketabll is the equivalent to old-skool NBA. Basics, fundamentals and execution.

 

[Jonotallica]

Will overseas players still want to play in NBA, and could an increased influx of European players help for the better? I don't know for sure, but I'd say that people would want to play in the NBA just as much as ever. The money is there, the ultimate competition is there, the elite athletes are there. One or two bad tourneys and an inability to mesh well in the national team doesn't really change that.

More European players could have an impact but I hardly think they change much in the grand scheme of things because the European players are soft (fowards and centres especially) when they enter the NBA (less contact more touch fouls in there leagues) as opposed to NBA players who are used to the solid contact and banging night in and night out. To be a C in the NBA you need to be bulky, as opposed to Europe where skill levels and finese are more important then solid strength. If there is a big influx of players in the next 5 or 10 years, it could change things a little, but unless you have 5 Europeans or so in one team, I don't think the style of play would change much.

You make good points Steve about International play but I still prefer the NBA. Don't get me wrong I'm a big fan of team play over individual egos. Memphis used a ten man rotation under Hubie Brown last year and that bothered alot of Grizz fans, but it didn't bother me. 2 units with evenly distrubuted minutes meant the starters were fresh in the forth, and Memphis didn't lose a single game in overtime last year. I didn't care that they didn't have a player averaging 20ppg, because they were winning, and won 50.

I also just like the individual talent levels more in the NBA, from an entertainment standpoint. Your seeing the best players in the world night in and night out for 82+ games. International competition is good, and I always like to watch it in any sport, but I'm more a fan of clubs who have decade long rivalries for example I prefer the League NRL format over the stupid Super 12. If more NBA players cared as much about defense, as they do about flashy moves, like Detroit for example it would be even better.

The one thing I don't like about the NBA (not that it's much better in the Olympics or Worlds) is the refs. I'm sick of All-star players getting nursed by referee's because of their status and who they are. A foul is a foul, it shouldn't matter if it's Tim Duncan, Kwame Brown or Daniel Santiago committing it. I know that the refs in Athens were pathetic, but still I couldn't help but giggle when Duncan said that the tourney sucks and doesn't want to ever go back (probably just emotion talking) after he was in foul trouble virtually every game he played. If NBA refs worry less about a players "street cred" and more about whether or not there is solid contact, I think it would be much more interesting to watch.

In saying all of that I did enjoy the International style of play, and it was a nice change. The defense and intensity was great to see.. Playing for your country is a passion and the highest honor for European countries, it was good to see so much enthusiasm about international basketball.

 

[CanadianSteve]

The NBA is so much more fan-friendly then the tedious rules of international basketball. Modern day European basketabll is the equivalent to old-skool NBA. Basics, fundamentals and execution.

I read something years ago where Wilt Chamberlain, talking about how the US lost in the 88 Olympics (the last team of college players), said the Europeans learned the game from US coaches of the 50s and 60s, and learned to play that style while the NBA evolved into what it is now. Wilt's point was that old school was a better game, and that's why the Euros were catching up.

 

[CanadianSteve]

Good post, Jono. I know what you mean about the NBA refs favouring the stars. But on the other hand, I didn't like seeing Duncan have to sit so much with foul trouble. That's why the NBA refs "protect" the stars, because fans pay to see the best players, and don't want to see them foul out. I'd like to see FIBA go to the 6 fouls like the NBA, so a couple of bad calls don't have as big an effect on the game.

I've seen a couple of American articles saying the US needs a permanent national coach, who would put in a style of play that carries over from year to year. Then they would have a core group of players who would commit to playing for a 4 year cycle. Then those players would re-gather after the NBA season to get ready for the Worlds, or the Olympics, and they would pick up the coach's system quicker because they would be familiar with it.

It sounds like a good idea, but it might be hard to get players to commit to putting in the time in the off-season. That's where it's different from rugby union, where the international play is the pinnacle of the sport.

 

[pug306]

I can't say I prefer either style,
International game with 6 fouls played on an NBA court, would be interesting to see.

A nice mix of making the Euro guys shoot the 3 ball NBA length (might limit there 3's taken), while the NBA stars having to respect the referees and having to face a collapsing (zone) defence (not as easy for the post guys or guards wanting to penetrate). Relying on good passing game to get open shots..............

I would love to see the NBA return the early 90's game, but i don't think it's going to happen. Boy watching NBA ref's call travelling & carrying is amusing :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[CanadianSteve]

I saw the second "Dream Team" play at the Worlds in Toronto in 1994. They were a step down from the originals, but they still dominated. At the time the NBA was using its current 3 point line (they since tried a shorter one similar to FIBA's for a few years and now are back to the longer one.) I remember Joe Dumars, Mark Price, Reggie Miller, Dan Majerle and others shooting those short 3's very easily.

Talking about that team brings up another question: The 92 Olympic, 94 WC, and 96 Olympic "dream teams " all dominated their competition. The 2000, '02, and '04 teams did not dominate, and the latter 2 didn't win. My question is, is this more a case of the more recent US teams not being as good as the first 3, or is it more that the other nations have improved?

 

[pug306]

I think it's a bit of both,
the early "Dream Teams" actually had some structure to their rotations
& therefore could handle any teams thrown at them
also the International players feared the NBA players,
you got to remember in '92 the other teams took camera's to the games so they could get pictures with Jordan, Magic, Larry & co.

Now with more Euro players in the NBA,
that fear is gone (at least one player on each international squad knows he can go toe to toe with the US) & i think that played a big part in the lopsided games before.

Also the last two teams have been slapped together with no structure,
watching highlights of the this Olympics I think Jason Kidd would have helped the US team alot (not just Jefferson)
The current squad really lacked the playmaker Larry Brown was looking for.........

So can my answer be a bit of both :?:

 

[CanadianSteve]

Another factor is that just as the first Dream Team was assembled, the 2 best international teams got much weaker, as the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia broke up. I still think the US would've won in 92, but if the Soviets and Yugos had stayed together their games would have been much closer.

The earlier US teams didn't prepare or practice any more than they do now. I just read a book by Larry Bird, about his time since his retirement from playing, up to when he coached the Pacers in the late 90s. He said the 92 Olympic team rarely had any serious practices. I think those players were so good and smart that they could play as a team even without having spent much time together. Whereas the recent teams could do with a lot more preparation (as well as better team selection, and getting the best players to play.)

Also, I suppose if you put together the very best US team possible right now, with Shaq, KG, T-Mac, Kobe etc., it would stack up much better against the older Dream Teams than the current US olympic team did. A true Dream Team now would arguably have even more physical talent than the 92 team, though I don't think it would be as smart a team.

 

[felix]

I prefer Australian NBL!

No TV timeouts, no commercials during TV coverage. 10 times more exciting than any NBA game

now if people would wake up and go to a few more games, it would have great atmosphere

 

[Choppies]

well if the Kings didnt charge life savings to go to a game maybe more Kings fans would :lol:

 

[El Coconuto]

Yeah, the Sydney Kings admittence fees are pretty ridiculous in comparison to other clubs. And that's alright for me to say because I am a life long Kings fan.

 

[pug306]

Yup & there's no let up next year for Kings fan's

Stupid, Stupid, Stupid Indeed.

I try & get to as many Kings games as possible but the cost is getting ridiculous.
Hopefully this year they do the $12 shopper docket promotion again for Silver section.

Cause once you are in & there's only 3-4,000 in the Ent. Cent. you can sit where ever you want

 

[Goldthorpe]

I prefer Australian NBL!

No TV timeouts, no commercials during TV coverage. 10 times more exciting than any NBA game

now if people would wake up and go to a few more games, it would have great atmosphere

I agree 100%

GO WILDCATS