Who do we play before England?

[gregstar]

My firm opinion is that this Australian side is coming to the end of the road

they're still winning!

There are no obvious replacements

just like there were no obvious replacements for Healy?

They sacked Lehmann out of panic, purely on the basis that he looked older than anyone else!

no they sacked him because his numbers were crap - he'd still march into your team!

Katich is just a good first-class player, nothing more

he averages 41 in tests - how are you lot in the averages? :lol: he's averaging 24 from nine digs in ODI's

And the other two are - well I dunno, what are they, an attempt at humour?

was that an attempt at humour yourself? is anytime someone makes their debut an attempt at humour? it was really funny when each one of our current established players made their debut wasn't it?

 

[JJ]

My firm opinion is that this Australian side is coming to the end of the road

they're still winning!

There are no obvious replacements

just like there were no obvious replacements for Healy?

They sacked Lehmann out of panic, purely on the basis that he looked older than anyone else!

no they sacked him because his numbers were crap - he'd still march into your team!

Katich is just a good first-class player, nothing more

he averages 41 in tests - how are you lot in the averages? :lol: he's averaging 24 from nine digs in ODI's

And the other two are - well I dunno, what are they, an attempt at humour?

was that an attempt at humour yourself? is anytime someone makes their debut an attempt at humour? it was really funny when each one of our current established players made their debut wasn't it?

Lehmann's numbers weren't crap - a slight slump.

Katich therefore has a similar average to MacMillan, Fleming and Astle. But Fleming's average is climbing, and Astle is an established test player with some extraordinary innings to his credit. But more to the point, there's nothing in Katich's first class career, test career, or his technique to suggest he'll be an oustanding test cricketer. i may be wrong, but I doubt it.

Hussey's not making his debut, nor is he young and promising...

 

[gregstar]

Lehmann's numbers weren't crap - a slight slump.

last 7 tests - avg of 24
last 12 ODI's - avg 24

time to go - he's holding back other players & better fielders

Katich therefore has a similar average to MacMillan, Fleming and Astle

all good first class players ;-)

But Fleming's average is climbing

who's to say katich's won't?

and Astle is an established test player with some extraordinary innings to his credit

again same quesion regarding katich

But more to the point, there's nothing in Katich's first class career, test career, or his technique to suggest he'll be an oustanding test cricketer. i may be wrong, but I doubt it.

but katich's average is the same! weird ;-)

 

[gregstar]

test averages
Katich - 41
Flemming - 39
Astle - 37

 

[JJ]

Fleming (one m) is a far far better player than Katich, only your Australian bias prevents you from acknowedging that. Different sample sizes there obviously

Astle- the two innings I recall are a very slow and dedicated 100 to save a test against England. And of course the 222 at Lancaster Park - if you've seen it you'll know what I mean, it was quite simply unbelievable.

I'm not saying Katich is a poor player - just that Lehmann is quite obviously a far superior one. He was not much older than most of your Dad's army team, yet because he's gat and bald he has to go to be replaced by Katich - I don't think many sane people would argue that Katich is the better player - Lehmann was in a slump - but he's class.

 

[JJ]

just like there were no obvious replacements for Healy?

As I recall, the replacement was obvious - that's why Healy was dumped, or "retired"

 

[gregstar]

Fleming (one m) is a far far better player than Katich, only your Australian bias prevents you from acknowedging that. Different sample sizes there obviously

where do i dispute that? - you said katich was a good first class player & that's all - i posted his figures - no bias

Astle- the two innings I recall are a very slow and dedicated 100 to save a test against England. And of course the 222 at Lancaster Park

again i don't dispute astle's qualities - i just pointed out the figures - you don't seem happy with it! i watched his 200 unfold on th internet - very impressive!
i don't dispute either players value - just thoroughly disagree with your assessment of katich as a good first class player given his figures i provided.
furthermore i would certainly not call myself a katich fan!!

I'm not saying Katich is a poor player

you said he's a good first class player nothing more - certainly not a ringing endorsement is it?

As I recall, the replacement was obvious - that's why Healy was dumped, or "retired"

gilly was indeed next in line but no one had any idea what would happen at the time - or how his career would unfold - did you? the point is any replacement can become a star - i thought mcgrath was sh*t when he started - how many people saw a future in warne? - so who's to say what will happen with the replacements of these two?

 

[JJ]

I'm not saying Katich is a poor player

you said he's a good first class player nothing more - certainly not a ringing endorsement is it?

Dunno - wish I was a good first-class player!

 

[gregstar]

Katich is just a good first-class player, nothing more. And the other two are - well I dunno, what are they, an attempt at humour?

hussey appears to be pretty good for a humourous selection - what do you think champ?

 

[lolesi]

Katich seemed to go ok to!

Nice work there JJ :lol: :lol:

 

[The Colonel]

Well done Katich, well done Hussey.....

 

[JJ]

oh yup - they both scored 30 - I was wrong :roll: McCullum got 30 too - yet I haven't heard any of you lot rating him

The only batsman who came out of the game with credit were Ponting (who was superb) and Styris.

On the bowling side it was just Kasper and Cairns.

But weren't Marshall, Cairns, Vettorri and McMillan just superb!! Adams and Kasper were good with the headbands, and I did enjoy Kasper's Lillee-like appeal. The ball was 3 feet down leg-side, but I guess he's used to getting those at home :lol:

 

[gregstar]

oh yup - they both scored 30 - I was wrong McCullum got 30 too - yet I haven't heard any of you lot rating him

what are you on about? - who criticized the selection of hussey, hopes & katich?
what has mccullum got to do with it? i see you are familiar with the sanejane misdirect tactic!

But weren't Marshall, Cairns, Vettorri and McMillan just superb!! Adams and Kasper were good with the headbands, and I did enjoy Kasper's Lillee-like appeal.

true! :lol:

 

[JJ]

oh yup - they both scored 30 - I was wrong McCullum got 30 too - yet I haven't heard any of you lot rating him

what are you on about? - who criticized the selection of hussey, hopes & katich?
what has mccullum got to do with it? i see you are familiar with the sanejane misdirect tactic!

But weren't Marshall, Cairns, Vettorri and McMillan just superb!! Adams and Kasper were good with the headbands, and I did enjoy Kasper's Lillee-like appeal.

true! :lol:

I criticized their selections on the basis that Lehmann is twice the player either of them is. Nothing last night changed my mind on that - neither are wonderfully talented, neither are paticularly young. My reference to McCullum was simply pointing out that he scored 30 too, and if that's your criteria for rating players these days then you should think he's pretty flash too.

On Hopes, I am so glad to see that your selectors have seen the light. We've been advocating dibbly dobbly bowling for years. He looks like just the man to continue the find tradition established in NZ by the likes of Harris, Astle, Latham etc!! :lol:

Fun night last night - shame that the Australians (Kasper apart) didn't get the point, or get into the spirit. While we were keen to win, the beige theme was the real entertainment value - Marshall was a huge surprise and hopefully will win the beige brigade prize - but Cairns, Vettorri and McMillan were superb.

I becoming a big fan of Kasprowizc though - at the moment I'll go out on a limb and say he's the best fast-bowler in the world. You lot should stop being blinded by Lee's pace and smile, and accept that Kasper is a dead cert in the test team.

 

[gregstar]

I becoming a big fan of Kasprowizc though - at the moment I'll go out on a limb and say he's the best fast-bowler in the world. You lot should stop being blinded by Lee's pace and smile, and accept that Kasper is a dead cert in the test team.

i won't argue with that! i've been a fan of kaspers since his tour of india in 98

My reference to McCullum was simply pointing out that he scored 30 too, and if that's your criteria for rating players these days then you should think he's pretty flash too.

please point out where i said scoring 30 was my criteria - i said they batted well for humorous selections ;-)

Fun night last night - shame that the Australians (Kasper apart) didn't get the point, or get into the spirit

i think you'll find that they were let in on the joke too late

 

[JJ]

I becoming a big fan of Kasprowizc though - at the moment I'll go out on a limb and say he's the best fast-bowler in the world. You lot should stop being blinded by Lee's pace and smile, and accept that Kasper is a dead cert in the test team.

i won't argue with that! i've been a fan of kaspers since his tour of india in 98

My reference to McCullum was simply pointing out that he scored 30 too, and if that's your criteria for rating players these days then you should think he's pretty flash too.

please point out where i said scoring 30 was my criteria - i said they batted well for humorous selections ;-)

Fun night last night - shame that the Australians (Kasper apart) didn't get the point, or get into the spirit

i think you'll find that they were let in on the joke too late

2 Feb the joke was made public - perhaps the amount of moisturiser most of them use precluded sufficient growth in time.

Yes - you are right, the three of them played pretty well for humourous selections.

 

[gregstar]

2 Feb the joke was made public

wasn't aware - perhaps the question should be asked of the team

perhaps the amount of moisturiser most of them use precluded sufficient growth in time.

true - or & some are struggling to get bum fluff

 

[Manu Vatuvei]

Lehmann dumped because of bad numbers? lmao. What's Hayden's average over his last 12 ODIs? Has Gilchrist never averaged 24 or less over a 12 ODI period?

 

[JJ]

ODIs (given Lehmann hasn't "yet" been dropped from the test team)

season 2004
6 155 44 31.00 0 0 - - - - 4 0
8 173 67 34.60 0 1 8 4/7 17.87 0 4 0
8 314 87 39.25 0 3 - - - - 5 0

2004/05
8 269 68 33.62 0 2 - - - - 10 1
9 191 52 38.20 0 2 7 3/44 37.42 0 2 0
7 100 43 14.28 0 0 - - - - 3 0


Judging by the way Aussies are carrying on, these three lines of stats should read Hayden, Gilchrist and Lehmann.... Whereas, the top lines are Gilchrist, the middle Lehmann, and the bottom Hayden...

Go figure, I still reckon he was dropped because he wasn't slim and pretty enough for the Aussie team! Because he's not much older than the rest, and he was playing as well as them

 

[gregstar]

i'd say lehmann paid the price for his age, his lack of athleticism & his poor form which was not helped by that reverse sweep first ball!
i'm sure hayden knows what the deal is - he was actually dropped & i would think that gives a message don't you? i have faith in the selectors