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Word counts

Azkatro

Azkatro

First Grade
Messages
6,905
This is an issue I've been wanting to clear up for a little while with regards to word counts in F7's articles. I'm assuming the referees primarily use MS Word to count the number of words. My issue is I don't have or use any version of Word. I usually use OpenOffice's equivalent or even a text editor I have at work. Every single time my word counts are different to the ones the ref says and I want to know what I'm supposed to do - I can't afford to spend hundreds on MS Word!

Antonius kindly let me know in the match thread this week that a whole swag of > symbols in my article counted as words according to MS Word, but not in my word processor. Luckily he overlooked it, but I know there are a few other discrepancies between the way Word counts words and a few other programs. What if next time it's not so obvious and I get deducted points, despite making the usual efforts to keep my article under 750 words?

Cheers!
 
antonius

antonius

Coach
Messages
10,104
The way I understand it works in MS Word is any character will be counted as a word if there are no letters associated with it for example ( ) would count as two words, but if you put (aza) in there then it becomes a word and the ( ) don't count. In your case you had < story. That counts as two words. If you had <story, it would be counted as one word. As soon as you put a space between a symbol and a word then MS word counts the symbol as a word. That is another reason to be carefull when using spacing, one too many and you get into trouble. In your case it was obvious because a you were so far over, and b the < stood out. If you were to post a piece with quotations in it like "tony" one word. but if you accidently put a space in there. "tony " two words and hard for the ref to pick up. So if you said the piece was 750 words and you had an instance such as the last example there is every chance you would cop a deduction. That was my reason for alerting you to it. It's something everyone needs to be aware of, because as far as I know the refs use MS word to check with.
 
Willow

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
110,184
I think that was a year ago half. I'm sure this will be a less dramatic discussion.

No worries antonius. I'm not sure how available MS Word is. It came with my Windows XP bundle.
 
TooheysNew

TooheysNew

Coach
Messages
1,131
The other options is to have a web page hosted on the League Unlimited server that will do an count of the number of words inside a text box by just splitting out the spaces and counting just the words. It may not be as accurate as Microsoft word, but it would definately solve the problems with people not having Microsoft word or getting varying counts.

Just an idea.
 
Azkatro

Azkatro

First Grade
Messages
6,905
Dilmah said:
The other options is to have a web page hosted on the League Unlimited server that will do an count of the number of words inside a text box by just splitting out the spaces and counting just the words. It may not be as accurate as Microsoft word, but it would definately solve the problems with people not having Microsoft word or getting varying counts.

Just an idea.
Click to expand...

Yeah I thought of a similar idea. That way there is no bone of contention. We should consider that this is a web forum and the web is not bound to one particular platform, so chances are there will be people participating on not only Windows but Macs, Linux, and whatever else might be out there. Add to that a few decent alternatives floating around these days with regards to word processors.

A web page which did a simple rudimentary word count would mean perfect consistency and no chance of disagreements.

Office is a very expensive product, Willow. Some would have gotten it with their computer, others are probably just using a "borrowed" copy. To buy it off the shelf costs heaps!
 
Willow

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
110,184
If we have an agreed universal standard, and all the refs use it, then it doesn't matter which system we use.

If you could set up something like that Dilmah, it would be great.

We could include it in the F7s website.

Cheers.
 
bartman

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
I think Word is only standard with Microsoft Office, not free with windows.

The idea of a standard web-based tool, endorsed by referees and linked from F7s homepage would settle any future arguments - great idea guys.

Regardsing the original post, those issues of spacing and sysmbols standing alone are the issues which people who do check their word counts using Word grabble with every week. The standard tool attached to the website will either be less strict on those currently using Word, or (probably?) more strict on those who currently use another means - as long as people know that there will be some change (one way or another) in the style they can express themselves in with symbols, spaces etc, then it should be fine.
 
antonius

antonius

Coach
Messages
10,104
The web site idea sounds great. I know from a refs point of view when I do a word count on articles 50% of them come up differently to the writers count. When it sends them over by one or two then it is a worry for the ref also, I know I've searched around a few times trying to find why a piece is one or two words over, sometimes to no avail, it's hard to pick up an extra space etc. We don't want to be penalising for honest errors like that.
 
Willow

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
110,184
Please note that the new word counter IS NOT retrospective.
I want to avoid anyone throwing it back at us later on when looking for perceived 'double standards'.

The word count standard before was MS Word, although it wasn't compulsory. The Referee's decision on word counts was final before, and that will still be the case in the future.

The word counter is a great innovation for the F7s an will become the new standard after this round.

Well done Dilly. Looks and works great.

I'll make it a link on the F7s website and get RB60 to add to the match threads.

Cheers.
 
Willow

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
110,184
Looks good. :)

How hard would it be to add a 'paste text' button?

Not everyone knows how to do crtl+v
 
Willow

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
110,184
Thanks Dilly.

I have both files backed up.

I added: 'or use your CRTL+V keys' next to the paste button.
 
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