News Josh Dugan flicked by the Sharks (COVID breach)

[hrundi99]

"Colombian"

 

[Chimp]

I’m far from a Dugan fan, but I have to say, the grief he gets, and his reputation is far worse than his actual sins.
What has Dugan really done wrong over the years? Went AWOL for a few hours on the drink, gave the bird to his club at the time, some silly comments to both fans and influential journos over the years and a couple of relatively minor Covid breaches (which given he wasn’t in the bubble are questionable for being offences anyway)…. his biggest crime is having a manager good enough to get him monster contracts that he’s not delivered on.
By all accounts, does lots of good stuff in the community and for charity, but is pretty much universally disliked by fans (including his own team). Guess it’s the tatts and general hogan ‘don’t give F’ck what anyone else thinks’ attitude, but he’s not even a 1 on the Richter scale of atrocities compared to others we still have playing the game.

 

[Sphagnum]

Didn’t he have that shit haircut for a few years because some make-a-wish kid asked him to when he visited him in hospital.

was a very good player who seems to get a pretty shit go from league fans nationwide. Still remember him in that dominant raiders Toyota cup team making fensom, BYC and co look like decent players.

they all owe their first grade careers to that carry.

 

[gordsy]

Ahhh the selective moral outrage from the Sharks. A well used bullshit tactic used when clubs want to get rid of a player because they don't like them or they player isn't providing value for cap money.
The Sharks didn't want him and were looking for an excuse to get rid of him, if he had of been smarter he could have played out another year and gotten paid top money for it. Oh well

 

[Chimp]

Ahhh the selective moral outrage from the Sharks. A well used bullshit tactic used when clubs want to get rid of a player because they don't like them or they player isn't providing value for cap money.
The Sharks didn't want him and were looking for an excuse to get rid of him, if he had of been smarter he could have played out another year and gotten paid top money for it. Oh well

No he couldn’t, he was in the last year of his contract so had less than 2 months left - Sharks have absolutely used this situation to their advantage to snag a little extra cap space for 2022 with the 2 months of saved salary from 2021.
People talking about him having a potential ‘claim’ for things like annual leave have missed the bit where it states ‘mutually agreed’ with his management.
If you look at the detail, if he’s not sacked, he has to pay the NRL and Sharks fines - which would have worked out at roughly the same amount he’d have been paid for last 2 months. By being sacked, he doesn’t have to pay those fines, so in effect, all that’s happened is the Sharks have gained the money saved as a cap extension for in 2022 for underspend in 2021 - very smart business move by the Sharks, the sort of move we’d only usually see pulled off by Roosters/Souths/Storm. Hopefully a sign of more shrewd times at Sharks HQ.

 

[gordsy]

Thanks for the info mate. Smart play by the Sharkies. Hopefully it's a sign of better times to come.

 

[shear_joy9]

By being sacked, he doesn’t have to pay those fines, so in effect, all that’s happened is the Sharks have gained the money saved as a cap extension for in 2022 for underspend in 2021 - very smart business move by the Sharks, the sort of move we’d only usually see pulled off by Roosters/Souths/Storm. Hopefully a sign of more shrewd times at Sharks HQ.

you can't just bank a cap underspend and use it in the next season

 

[Chimp]

you can't just bank a cap underspend and use it in the next season

Oh yes you can… essentially, with the money saved on 2021 cap, you forward pay someone the money they’re due in 2022 now, creating that equivalent extra space in 2022…. Bit of a rort, but all teams do it where they can.

 

[Tiger Shark]

Oh yes you can… essentially, with the money saved on 2021 cap, you forward pay someone the money they’re due in 2022 now, creating that equivalent extra space in 2022…. Bit of a rort, but all teams do it where they can.

Exactly well said. And really thought this was common knowledge but seems it’s not.

 

[shear_joy9]

Oh yes you can… essentially, with the money saved on 2021 cap, you forward pay someone the money they’re due in 2022 now, creating that equivalent extra space in 2022…. Bit of a rort, but all teams do it where they can.

show me evidence of this.
You can front load or back load players multi-year contracts but you can't just suddenly decide to pay a chunk of a players salary in a different season.

 

[Mark B]

Jesus H f**king Christ thank goodness you're not our Attorney-General?! Convicting a bloke of an offence before he even commits it?! And not only that, you're sentencing him to some jail time for enjoying some nose beers?!

Not that type of offending GFK. If someone wants to snort it, jail is not gunna happen. I’m thinking more of Scott Miller type scenario.

 

[Chimp]

Wouldn’t know where to begin with finding the rule book, let alone the bit that covers it, but I can assure you it’s a thing, and has been for a while.

 

[Captain Apollo]

I think the issues with Dugan is that they reflect poorly on him as irresponsible and ill disciplined. Combine that with him being injury prone, it calls into question his professionalism. Dugan for example had a great running game, but never really developed a passing game, thus he would often "go himself' rather than doing a simple draw and pass to a support player.

Add that up, for mine, you have an ill disciplined player who did not work on expanding his skill set. That is a big knock for anyone who's profession is being a professional sports person.

 

[Tiger Shark]

show me evidence of this.
You can front load or back load players multi-year contracts but you can't just suddenly decide to pay a chunk of a players salary in a different season.

Why not ?

If a club is paying player X a certain figure each year and cap space becomes available then if both parties agree player X can receive some of next years amount this year. His overall contract amount doesn't change but he gets using Dugan's money as an example 120k extra this year.

Time value of money means player X is obviously better off getting this money now than in future years.

So player X wins and the club wins. Both parties have to agree but it's very common.

 

[Tiger Shark]

I think the issues with Dugan is that they reflect poorly on him as irresponsible and ill disciplined. Combine that with him being injury prone, it calls into question his professionalism. Dugan for example had a great running game, but never really developed a passing game, thus he would often "go himself' rather than doing a simple draw and pass to a support player.

Add that up, for mine, you have an ill disciplined player who did not work on expanding his skill set. That is a big knock for anyone who's profession is being a professional sports person.

hahahaha .....So every player who doesn't have a complete game is ill disciplined based on that idiotic theory ?

 

[Tiger Shark]

Dugan was a good player, especially in the early days. Very physical and put his body on the line plenty of times. No surprises he copped so many injuries in his career.

His off field record is revolting. The NRL won't miss him.

What is his off field record ?

- So we have the two Covid breaches. You could argue against those considering he wasn't in the NRL bubble but let's not.

- Then we have drinking Cruizers on a roof with Fergo whilst injured. Missed a few training sessions apparently. Hardly revolting.

- What else has he done that is considered revolting ?
He hasn't been convicted of any crimes, tested positive to drugs, assaulted anyone, whipped his willy out in front of anyone, tried to sell a speaker.

I'm not Dugan's biggest fan but mostly because of the value for money the Sharks were getting from his contract but that's on the Sharks. Good on Dugan and his manger for getting that money.

As far as off field behaviour he's well down the list and seems to cop a bad wrap from people for no reason.

 

[Fangs]

What is his off field record ?

- So we have the two Covid breaches. You could argue against those considering he wasn't in the NRL bubble but let's not.

- Then we have drinking Cruizers on a roof with Fergo whilst injured. Missed a few training sessions apparently. Hardly revolting.

- What else has he done that is considered revolting ?
He hasn't been convicted of any crimes, tested positive to drugs, assaulted anyone, whipped his willy out in front of anyone, tried to sell a speaker.

I'm not Dugan's biggest fan but mostly because of the value for money the Sharks were getting from his contract but that's on the Sharks. Good on Dugan and his manger for getting that money.

As far as off field behaviour he's well down the list and seems to cop a bad wrap from people for no reason.

I'll take it back, he is just a repeat offender and a moron of the highest order. I guess that isn't so bad.

 

[AJB1102]

I know a person who wouldn't know footy from ping pong let alone individual players but after a couple years at the children's hospital with a very crook kid this person couldn't give a bigger wrap on Dugan.

I think that stuff holds more weight than us having watched him play footy for a decade or so.

 

[shear_joy9]

Why not ?

If a club is paying player X a certain figure each year and cap space becomes available then if both parties agree player X can receive some of next years amount this year. His overall contract amount doesn't change but he gets using Dugan's money as an example 120k extra this year.

Time value of money means player X is obviously better off getting this money now than in future years.

So player X wins and the club wins. Both parties have to agree but it's very common.

very common? Again, prove it. You're making a lot of assumptions based on ramblings at the urinal.

If this was allowed don't you think every club would sacrifice a season, pay their stars entire next year salary in the current year then hit the market with an extra $5mill to spend?

 

[Chimp]

very common? Again, prove it. You're making a lot of assumptions based on ramblings at the urinal.

If this was allowed don't you think every club would sacrifice a season, pay their stars entire next year salary in the current year then hit the market with an extra $5mill to spend?

There’s a salary cap floor, a salary cap ceiling and a required squad size (with minimum wages) that stops it being rorted to that extent. But any space in this years cap can be used to forward pay and create space for the following year - I can’t be bothered trying to find exactly where it’s explained, but I assure you it’s the case. You can choose not believe it, that’s fine, but you’d be wrong.