USA WCQ squad

[deal.with.it]

He missed out on the colonial cup due to injury

 

[Rugbyflorida]

He was out due to injury..

With Luke Barron and Taylor Alley it didn't look like the centers were weakened at all both quality players with loads of experience.

 

[spinnerhowland]

What about Garvey? Is he no longer playing?

He sent an email to the USARL prior to the colonial cups game saying he did not want to be considered due "wanting to let his body heal, and focus on club rugby"

 

[spinnerhowland]

Paulo ....Probably because he wasn't picked? Yes Garvey looks the best local player so odd he isn't there.
It seems most posters are fans of a national teams being picked from the domestic national comp with a limited number of pros playing in foreign comps... a bit like the ARU policy.

Each nation is free to make its own policy but only Australia and England wouldn't be too harmed by that. NZ are picked from NRL and SL so they would be weakened as would the rest of the top 10 nations some of whom have very limited domestic comps.
How does the sit with trying to make Test football the pinnacle again.

And this is where Rugby League needs to determine what it wants for its expansion. Do the powers think expansion into a larger number of countries, and a large domestic development in those countries is the focus? Or are they more concerned with having "pinnacle internationals" on a more frequent basis.

If the later is the case, then we will continue to see all major nations pick their national teams from heritage players, who are nothing more than Aussies, Brits, NZ and Poly Island Citizens playing for to win, and teams will feature little, if any, local talent. This will result in domestic players seeing no way forward in the sport and look at other sporting options.

The bottom line is you cannot rely (expect) on the local talent to promote, volunteer, give countless hours, tons of their own money, etc. for the growth of a sport, and then overlook them when the time comes for the big stage. They will eventually give up and let the sport die.

So, in the next few pivotal years, each nation is going to have to determine what is best for THEM, and the powers of Rugby League are going to have to decide what they want more, GLOBAL Growth, or higher level internationals that feature teams of only heritage players. Most developing nations are 100% run, from top to bottom, with volunteers. League Heads, Coaches, Team Operators, Administrators, Website Guys, Players, etc. are all doing that they do in RL for FREE. 100% for free. So, if you want them to continue to keep doing that they are doing for the "love of the game", shitting on them when it is time for the "big dances" will soon see them "do less demanding" things with they time, and spend more time with family, casual weekends, summers full of days off, not full of pro-bono work, etc.

And as little as I know of the ARU policy, they seemed to do OK in the RWC this time around.

 

[johnny plath]

And this is where Rugby League needs to determine what it wants for its expansion. Do the powers think expansion into a larger number of countries, and a large domestic development in those countries is the focus? Or are they more concerned with having "pinnacle internationals" on a more frequent basis.

If the later is the case, then we will continue to see all major nations pick their national teams from heritage players, who are nothing more than Aussies, Brits, NZ and Poly Island Citizens playing for to win, and teams will feature little, if any, local talent. This will result in domestic players seeing no way forward in the sport and look at other sporting options.

The bottom line is you cannot rely (expect) on the local talent to promote, volunteer, give countless hours, tons of their own money, etc. for the growth of a sport, and then overlook them when the time comes for the big stage. They will eventually give up and let the sport die.

So, in the next few pivotal years, each nation is going to have to determine what is best for THEM, and the powers of Rugby League are going to have to decide what they want more, GLOBAL Growth, or higher level internationals that feature teams of only heritage players. Most developing nations are 100% run, from top to bottom, with volunteers. League Heads, Coaches, Team Operators, Administrators, Website Guys, Players, etc. are all doing that they do in RL for FREE. 100% for free. So, if you want them to continue to keep doing that they are doing for the "love of the game", shitting on them when it is time for the "big dances" will soon see them "do less demanding" things with they time, and spend more time with family, casual weekends, summers full of days off, not full of pro-bono work, etc.

And as little as I know of the ARU policy, they seemed to do OK in the RWC this time around.

Its a difficult balance. Technically if you draw the line that players need to come from within domestic competitions, New Zealand would have no players as they all play in NRL and ESL. Using the ARU example is fine, but the Austrailian domestic scene is full of players up to the standard to compete in international competition, so a policy of picking domestic players is fine and not really a problem in that context. Rugby league in developing nations is a different kettle of fish. I think that if players are eligible, then the best should be picked, especially while domestic competitions are under development. Ultimately selectors need to strike the right balance, but I don't think you can mandate a hard and fast rule

 

[adamkungl]

I personally think their should be a minimum domestic player rule for test matches, WCs and qualifiers. What the exact number should be I'm not sure, but Spinner's close to the mark. Domestic should be defined as having played club football at any level in that country for 2 years.

NZ would have no problems meeting this criteria and it would ensure real growth in emerging competitions around the world. Want to bring in a heap of heritage ring ins? Sure. Get them to come over and raise the standard of your club comp first though.

 

[Evil Homer]

There should never be any official rules on how an international squad should be composed, that defies the point of international sport.

 

[adamkungl]

There should never be any official rules on how an international squad should be composed, that defies the point of international sport.

How exactly does it defy the point of international sport?

 

[expansionist]

Because he's not American?

Seriously - does anyone know why Joseph Paulo wasnt selected?? It seems very odd doesnt it? Or am I just missing something?

 

[Evil Homer]

How exactly does it defy the point of international sport?

Because you're either from a country or not. That's what international sport is. Having a system which differentiates between "real" international players and "ring-ins" is just nonsensical in every way. If a player qualifies to play for a country then they qualify and that's it.

 

[Sinman]

Great to see that across the teams we don't have teams full of ring ins.. Should be fascinating to see who goes through but by approaching it in this way at least it should mean that even for the nations that don't go through to the world cup then there is an actual long term foundations being laid.. Great stuff.. Also good to hear that more teams are planning to join the domestic comp next year.. It would be great if NRL/ESL could spare some pennies and help the Americas region develop some more!!

 

[spinnerhowland]

Because you're either from a country or not. That's what international sport is. Having a system which differentiates between "real" international players and "ring-ins" is just nonsensical in every way. If a player qualifies to play for a country then they qualify and that's it.

So just to be clear, you are totally OK with an entire team being made of of players who qualify via 1 grandparent, have never played a single domestic game in "their country", and never lived or claimed residency in that country?

If this is the case, then RL will never expand more than it already has. You cannot expect locals to do MASSIVE AMOUNTS of domestic development work, 100% totally for free, and then get overlooked when it is time to represent the nation their were BORN IN, LIVE IN, and PLAY IN.

And I can tell you that the domestic fans will not support a team like that either. It is not a viable model for global expansion of the sport.

A balance must be found for all developing RL National teams.

 

[spinnerhowland]

Here is the list of criteria for FULL RLIF MEMBERSHIP, that is required to be met for a nation to play in the WC, as it should be if RL is serious about Global Expansion. The amount of work this takes by volunteers is immense. Everything from setting up official online players registration, to insurance, to venues, to players, to games, to websites, I am sure you see how the list goes on. For groups of dedicated people to spend YEARS making this happen TOTALLY FOR FREE, is a fair argument for some rules that allow some domestic players to be on any national team, not matter the event.:
Have a current approved constitution lodged with the RLIF which shows detailed evidence of governance, membership, elections, meetings and arrangements for dissolution.
Complete and submit to the RLIF annual accounts for at least 12 months prior to application
Publish and lodge with the RLIF annual reports for at least two years prior to approval
Be able to demonstrate the financial stability of the organisation
Operate with a Bank Account in the name of the Federation with at least two signatories on the account. The two signatories must be drawn from the currently elected Board (EG Chair, Treasurer, Vice Chair)
Conduct regular Rugby League Competitions within the country – Competition is defined as a League Competition played under International Laws of Rugby League over a minimum of a 10 week period.
(a) Minimum 8 senior teams
(b) Minimum 4 reserve/U21/Student grade teams
(c) At least 500 registered participants (players, coaches and match officials)
(d) A registered office and admin.
(e) At least a 6 team Junior RL and/or School (Under 18) competition.
(f) Coach Education Scheme approved by the RLIF.
(g) Referees Accreditation Scheme approved by the RLIF
(h) Approved International programme at various levels which must include Full International and may in addition include “A” International, Student International, Junior (Under 18) International. All at Male or Female.

Members may be able to source revenue from the above activity by way of fees. This can be extended to include registration fees, sponsorship, government grants, gate and canteen receipts and RLIF grants where applicable.
An approved Development Plan, correctly resourced with annual reports lodged with the RLIF

 

[Evil Homer]

So just to be clear, you are totally OK with an entire team being made of of players who qualify via 1 grandparent, have never played a single domestic game in "their country", and never lived or claimed residency in that country?

If this is the case, then RL will never expand more than it already has. You cannot expect locals to do MASSIVE AMOUNTS of domestic development work, 100% totally for free, and then get overlooked when it is time to represent the nation their were BORN IN, LIVE IN, and PLAY IN.

And I can tell you that the domestic fans will not support a team like that either. It is not a viable model for global expansion of the sport.

A balance must be found for all developing RL National teams.

No, of course not, I fully support the USA's current policy. But there should never be any official limits imposed on who teams can and can't select. We have to believe that the majority of national selectors will want what is best for the sport in their country above all else and will be responsible in their team selections, as the USA are being. But I have no problem with the selection of any players as long as those players are truly committed and the team is run within the true spirit of international RL (i.e. not just a bunch of Australians masquerading as an international team). The fact that a couple of rogue bodies didn't do this at the last WC is a shame, but in reality that was more of a failing of the RLIF at the time as those people shouldn't have been in that situation to being with.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Here is the list of criteria for FULL RLIF MEMBERSHIP, that is required to be met for a nation to play in the WC, as it should be if RL is serious about Global Expansion. The amount of work this takes by volunteers is immense. Everything from setting up official online players registration, to insurance, to venues, to players, to games, to websites, I am sure you see how the list goes on. For groups of dedicated people to spend YEARS making this happen TOTALLY FOR FREE, is a fair argument for some rules that allow some domestic players to be on any national team, not matter the event.:
Have a current approved constitution lodged with the RLIF which shows detailed evidence of governance, membership, elections, meetings and arrangements for dissolution.
Complete and submit to the RLIF annual accounts for at least 12 months prior to application
Publish and lodge with the RLIF annual reports for at least two years prior to approval
Be able to demonstrate the financial stability of the organisation
Operate with a Bank Account in the name of the Federation with at least two signatories on the account. The two signatories must be drawn from the currently elected Board (EG Chair, Treasurer, Vice Chair)
Conduct regular Rugby League Competitions within the country ? Competition is defined as a League Competition played under International Laws of Rugby League over a minimum of a 10 week period.
(a) Minimum 8 senior teams
(b) Minimum 4 reserve/U21/Student grade teams
(c) At least 500 registered participants (players, coaches and match officials)
(d) A registered office and admin.
(e) At least a 6 team Junior RL and/or School (Under 18) competition.
(f) Coach Education Scheme approved by the RLIF.
(g) Referees Accreditation Scheme approved by the RLIF
(h) Approved International programme at various levels which must include Full International and may in addition include ?A? International, Student International, Junior (Under 18) International. All at Male or Female.

Members may be able to source revenue from the above activity by way of fees. This can be extended to include registration fees, sponsorship, government grants, gate and canteen receipts and RLIF grants where applicable.
An approved Development Plan, correctly resourced with annual reports lodged with the RLIF

There would be several current full members that don't meet those requirements.

 

[gyallop]

No, of course not, I fully support the USA's current policy. But there should never be any official limits imposed on who teams can and can't select. We have to believe that the majority of national selectors will want what is best for the sport in their country above all else and will be responsible in their team selections, as the USA are being. But I have no problem with the selection of any players as long as those players are truly committed and the team is run within the true spirit of international RL (i.e. not just a bunch of Australians masquerading as an international team). The fact that a couple of rogue bodies didn't do this at the last WC is a shame, but in reality that was more of a failing of the RLIF at the time as those people shouldn't have been in that situation to being with.

Well there goes Samoa Tonga the Cooks Italy Scotland and probably Wales.


I have no problem with the actual RLWC being the best eligible players as and I may be wrong the majority of the limited funding the RLIF has that is used to help the emerging nations comes from the RLWC. So there is some catch 22 in all of this.


The NRL isn't interested in funding emerging nations so the RLWC has to interest TV corporates and crowds. Even Samoa v Tonga and PNG v Fiji at $10 a ticket featuring the Aussie NRL stars only drew around 10,000 this year.


The USA is on social media asking the public to fund their campaign. Love or hate the Tomahawks in 13 if the RLIF and the USA couldn't convert that into gov't and corporate support we have a problem. It makes me wonder how much actual effort the RLIF is putting in.

 

[gyallop]

Here is the list of criteria for FULL RLIF MEMBERSHIP, that is required to be met for a nation to play in the WC, as it should be if RL is serious about Global Expansion. The amount of work this takes by volunteers is immense. Everything from setting up official online players registration, to insurance, to venues, to players, to games, to websites, I am sure you see how the list goes on. For groups of dedicated people to spend YEARS making this happen TOTALLY FOR FREE, is a fair argument for some rules that allow some domestic players to be on any national team, not matter the event.:
Have a current approved constitution lodged with the RLIF which shows detailed evidence of governance, membership, elections, meetings and arrangements for dissolution.
Complete and submit to the RLIF annual accounts for at least 12 months prior to application
Publish and lodge with the RLIF annual reports for at least two years prior to approval
Be able to demonstrate the financial stability of the organisation
Operate with a Bank Account in the name of the Federation with at least two signatories on the account. The two signatories must be drawn from the currently elected Board (EG Chair, Treasurer, Vice Chair)
Conduct regular Rugby League Competitions within the country ? Competition is defined as a League Competition played under International Laws of Rugby League over a minimum of a 10 week period.
(a) Minimum 8 senior teams
(b) Minimum 4 reserve/U21/Student grade teams
(c) At least 500 registered participants (players, coaches and match officials)
(d) A registered office and admin.
(e) At least a 6 team Junior RL and/or School (Under 18) competition.
(f) Coach Education Scheme approved by the RLIF.
(g) Referees Accreditation Scheme approved by the RLIF
(h) Approved International programme at various levels which must include Full International and may in addition include ?A? International, Student International, Junior (Under 18) International. All at Male or Female.

Members may be able to source revenue from the above activity by way of fees. This can be extended to include registration fees, sponsorship, government grants, gate and canteen receipts and RLIF grants where applicable.
An approved Development Plan, correctly resourced with annual reports lodged with the RLIF

You say this is a minimum to play at the World Cup so will nations be denied if they are not full members by 2017?


What part of the requirements does the USA have to fulfil?


Scotland Cooks and Tonga must be happy they are already members!!

 

[Evil Homer]

Well there goes Samoa Tonga the Cooks Italy Scotland and probably Wales.

Wales? :lol:

You have NFI. Stick to doing whatever else you're doing.

 

[gyallop]

He's the best local player based on what? Which USARL team does he play for?

No knowledge of a domestic based USA test player :lol:

You have NFI. Stick to doing whatever else you're doing.

 

[spinnerhowland]

Well there goes Samoa Tonga the Cooks Italy Scotland and probably Wales.


I have no problem with the actual RLWC being the best eligible players as and I may be wrong the majority of the limited funding the RLIF has that is used to help the emerging nations comes from the RLWC. So there is some catch 22 in all of this.


The NRL isn't interested in funding emerging nations so the RLWC has to interest TV corporates and crowds. Even Samoa v Tonga and PNG v Fiji at $10 a ticket featuring the Aussie NRL stars only drew around 10,000 this year.


The USA is on social media asking the public to fund their campaign. Love or hate the Tomahawks in 13 if the RLIF and the USA couldn't convert that into gov't and corporate support we have a problem. It makes me wonder how much actual effort the RLIF is putting in.

And you base your expert opinion of the sporting and government landscape on MAINLAND USA on what exactly? Pretty sure it is not the amount of time you have spent here.

You guys enjoy sorting it all out to have all the "grandparent players" you like in your WC of Aussie player based teams.

My time in the sport in the USA will be over as of January 22nd.

Have fun!