usarl - amnrl split

[MR KNIGHT]

Gee

Isn't everyone getting a little heated! I hear the words "childish" and "immature" bandied about, I think you could apply this to a number of posts here!

Just to justify my statements re the AMNRL competition.

The standard of the teams in the USARL are Jacksonville and then New haven and then its absolute daylight! The other teams are not near that standard.

I know that the Bulls and the Knights will be as strong as ever and I know Connecticut are seriously rebuilding.

Its seriously disturbing how David Niu has become such a devil to some on this forum. He is one of the most inclusive people in Rugby League. For those who don;t know, thats how EVERYONE over here got a start. His and the AMNRL inclusiveness. No fees for participating, just help, encouragement and endless access to all his numerous contacts. The main minimum standard to be upheld was to play right and encourage locals. Connecticut, Northern Raiders and New Haven can be traced to the Knights and were all started with inclusiveness and encouragement.

If the USARL lasts six months they could hope to be 1/2 as good as David Niu is at getting so many selfish and egotistical people to play together.

BTW - I cant believe bitchiness about Matt Elliot coaching. I would say an NRL coach coaching the Tomahawks is a positive thing. Just like when Brian Smith has been an assistant during tours in Australia or John Cartwright coached when they played Australia. The AMNRL must have been doing something right.

 

[deluded pom?]

Mr K, no-one is denying what David Niu has done for RL in the USA but more than fifty per cent of the AMNRL weren't happy about how things were being run. Obviously 99.9% of posters on here don't know the real story behind the split as we've only seen one side of the story but unfortunately whether you like it or not that's ALL we have to base our opinion on. Again we only have your word on the strength of the 2011 AMNRL comp. Connecticut may well be "seriously" rebuilding but let's face facts, they needed to just to get back to being half as good as they once were. That doesn't mean they will be competitive with the Bulls and the Knights. The Sharks and Raiders maybe. David Niu isn't being perceived as the "devil" but the man who a large chunk of the AMNRL had a problem with and who refuses to communicate his version of events choosing instead to catcall on social networking sites. Can I ask a serious question? Who is David Niu's employer?

 

[joshreading]

Here is a good principle in life to follow - 'ANYTHING LEFT IN THE DARK LOOKS SUSPICIOUS'

The reality is the AMNRL has left everything in the dark, and yes it looks very suspicious and we have NO reason to believe otherwise.

Please answer my earlier questions as well.

Answer some key questions

1. Who is the board of the AMNRL and HOW are they appointed? Can David Nui (or any board member for that matter) be voted out if it is the will of the majority of Clubs involved? Why is there no democratic process involved?
2. What recourse does a Club have against decisions made by those in power in the AMNRL?
3. What democratic input do the individual Clubs have in the board?
4. Why does StarGroup have so much power and control over what is going on and WHO gave it to them? Who is Howard Wilensky and why does HE have power?
5. Why, when a Club like Seattle Force (or Denver) decide to stay independent of either AMNRL or USARL does David Nui cut all ties? (of course such just pushed them to the USARL who have been happy to help those clubs that have decided to stay independant)

 

[SeattleForce]

Here is a good principle in life to follow - 'ANYTHING LEFT IN THE DARK LOOKS SUSPICIOUS'

The reality is the AMNRL has left everything in the dark, and yes it looks very suspicious and we have NO reason to believe otherwise.

Please answer my earlier questions as well.

Agreed. I think the situation could have been handled much more professionally, with a heck of a lot more communication.

Earlier, someone commented on how unfair it was to use words like 'immature' and 'childish' ... Well, if there are other words to use, please enlighten us! :roll:

Don't get me wrong; I can understand what lengths Niu, and others, have gone to to promote and build the game of Rugby League in the USA. In fact, when I RESPECTFULLY declined the offer to go onboard with the AMNRL this season, I almost felt like a child myself. One who did not invite his classmate to his 7th b'day and since, got the cold shoulder.

It's sad, really.

USARL has had more input, encouragement, advice and support in the last 3 weeks than the AMNRL did in the past ~6months. :lol:

Now, if only I could get that blasted logo off my banner on my site, things would be hunky-dory!

 

[joshreading]

Why can't you change it?

I do some graphic design and if you sent through the banner as is - I could probably change it - are you wanting USARL or just nothing at all?

Do you have access to change the basic elements of the site?

 

[Choo Choo]

Gee

Isn't everyone getting a little heated! I hear the words "childish" and "immature" bandied about, I think you could apply this to a number of posts here!

Just to justify my statements re the AMNRL competition.

The standard of the teams in the USARL are Jacksonville and then New haven and then its absolute daylight! The other teams are not near that standard.

I know that the Bulls and the Knights will be as strong as ever and I know Connecticut are seriously rebuilding.

Its seriously disturbing how David Niu has become such a devil to some on this forum. He is one of the most inclusive people in Rugby League. For those who don;t know, thats how EVERYONE over here got a start. His and the AMNRL inclusiveness. No fees for participating, just help, encouragement and endless access to all his numerous contacts. The main minimum standard to be upheld was to play right and encourage locals. Connecticut, Northern Raiders and New Haven can be traced to the Knights and were all started with inclusiveness and encouragement.

If the USARL lasts six months they could hope to be 1/2 as good as David Niu is at getting so many selfish and egotistical people to play together.

BTW - I cant believe bitchiness about Matt Elliot coaching. I would say an NRL coach coaching the Tomahawks is a positive thing. Just like when Brian Smith has been an assistant during tours in Australia or John Cartwright coached when they played Australia. The AMNRL must have been doing something right.

As always, no one is saying Niu didn't get it all started in the US and no one here has the entire story on both sides. For me, I'm definitely with the USARL and with the Fairfax Eagles folding for 2011, I've accepted the head coaching job for the DC Slayers; so this is where my loyalties lie.

I'm not going to speculate that one team or league is better than another. Both have their merits, but I have to say that the USARL has been more open in the past three months than the AMNRL has been since my involvement with them dating back to 2005. I want to put it to the forum to wait and see how the 2011 seasons progress and determine at the end of the year which league out performs the other regarding openness and communication.

We in DC wish the Tomahawks all the best, but are dissapointed that very talented players have been systematically removed from selections.

 

[Play some footy]

Gee


The standard of the teams in the USARL are Jacksonville and then New haven and then its absolute daylight! The other teams are not near that standard.

Philly and DC have very respectable clubs....both took the bulls and Knights to the wire in the playoffs last year

 

[Play some footy]

Good guess with Rugger1213 (who if you wanna be really analytical is prob an inside/outside center for 15s or maybe a second row/lock for RL) but you are way off the mark with me...

.

i think he is more of a prop - guys that put their heads in scrums and get to the breakdowns usually like 15's. plus you don't have to be as fit as you would in 13's. i'd say he is a comic book guy as well.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

USARL has added Houston and Dallas as developmental clubs. How many is that now linked with them?

There seems to be, or have been, talk or proof of these new clubs in Seattle, Denver, Phoenix, Utah, LA, Las Vegas, Portland, Dallas, Houston and Chicago. Any others? And which are aligned with which organisation. I assume Chicago is remaining with the AMNRL. But we know Seattle, Utah, LA (OC) and these two Texas sides at least are with the USARL. That's not including the Eagles and Pittsburg.

 

[Goddo]

The AmNRL was run as a benevelant dictatorship by Niu, but as soon as his plans started deviating from those of the clubs, the organisations days were numbered, as there is no feedback loop to de-throne Niu, or at least exert pressure on him to change his ways.

The USARL clubs were right to do what they did given how inflexable Niu has been.

 

[Chicago Saints]

USARL has added Houston and Dallas as developmental clubs. How many is that now linked with them?

There seems to be, or have been, talk or proof of these new clubs in Seattle, Denver, Phoenix, Utah, LA, Las Vegas, Portland, Dallas, Houston and Chicago. Any others? And which are aligned with which organisation. I assume Chicago is remaining with the AMNRL. But we know Seattle, Utah, LA (OC) and these two Texas sides at least are with the USARL. That's not including the Eagles and Pittsburg.

We are developing plans with the AMNRL to build on our successful outings in 2010. You can stay up to date with the latest Stockyarders news at www.chicagostockyarders.com or follow us on facebook "Chicago Stockyarders Rugby League Football Club" or twitter "StockyardersRL". We will shortly release details of a 2011 exhibition season including War at the Shore.

 

[MR KNIGHT]

Thank you for the principles in life to follow.

I don't have all your answers, I am sorry, but I know a couple of things.

As far I know the AMNRL has not been sold, there is no dark figure in a long black coat pulling strings and taking peoples money! I don't think the Star Group had or have any power over the teams.

Maybe a more pertinent question is this - who is funding the USARL and when do they expect their ROI? There are a bunch of people there that are not Rugby league people, so they are not doing it for the love.

I am only perihperal, but the AMNRL has always been as fair as any sporting organization. Teams have always had a say. I think you would be pretty naive to think the USARL will be fairer.

 

[Evil Homer]

Thank you for the principles in life to follow.

I don't have all your answers, I am sorry, but I know a couple of things.

As far I know the AMNRL has not been sold, there is no dark figure in a long black coat pulling strings and taking peoples money! I don't think the Star Group had or have any power over the teams.

Maybe a more pertinent question is this - who is funding the USARL and when do they expect their ROI? There are a bunch of people there that are not Rugby league people, so they are not doing it for the love.

I am only perihperal, but the AMNRL has always been as fair as any sporting organization. Teams have always had a say. I think you would be pretty naive to think the USARL will be fairer.

How can you possibly say that an organization based on principles of democracy with an elected president and board would be less fair than an organization run solely by one man with no way of challenging his opinions or questioning his actions? How can you possibly argue that?

 

[Rampart66]

Thank you for the principles in life to follow.

I don't have all your answers, I am sorry, but I know a couple of things.

As far I know the AMNRL has not been sold, there is no dark figure in a long black coat pulling strings and taking peoples money! I don't think the Star Group had or have any power over the teams.

Maybe a more pertinent question is this - who is funding the USARL and when do they expect their ROI? There are a bunch of people there that are not Rugby league people, so they are not doing it for the love.

I am only perihperal, but the AMNRL has always been as fair as any sporting organization. Teams have always had a say. I think you would be pretty naive to think the USARL will be fairer.

Remember, part of reason that the teams broke away from the AMNRL were because the teams were not getting information regarding Star Group's involvement. When teams in your own league have to speculate as to what's going on because the people that run the league are not forthcoming with information that directly affects them and their team, then there is a problem.

If the AMNRL didn't get sold to Star Group, that's good to know. It would have been nice to know that in December when teams started asking questions. The teams were kept in the dark concerning the amount of involvement that Star Group has.

I know that one item that Star Group was supposed to deal with was the AMNRL website. It was a complete embarrassment last season and when I asked David Niu about the status of the site to find out when it would be updated, he gave me a link to Star Group's website and told me to contact them. I tried contacting Star Group on a few occasions through their website and got no response. If Star Group put up a great website and updated it on a regular basis, then I would trust David's judgement and his association with Star Group. As it is, that was not a good impression and made me question the direction of the AMNRL.

Yes, David Niu works very hard promoting the sport. Yes, he probably needs help, but I know many people from the member clubs offered to help in different ways and were turned away. If you trust a marketing firm to help, rather than the people involved with the teams (where they have more to gain/lose), then that marketing firm had better knock my socks off with marketing, promotion, and media materials. Sadly, they did not.

The only "take home" from the Grand Final was a 2-sided color copy with (low resolution) teams logos, schedule of events and rosters. This was a great opportunity to have a game day program. It was an opportunity to provide another advertising avenue to sponsors. It would have given people something to take home. (Rule of thumb: make sure your spectators leave with something. programs, game guides, stickers, autographed material, etc. Give them something to look at when they're not at a game)

The only thing that I have seen from Star Group are new logos that were created without input from the clubs. Those same logos (owned by Star Group) on t-shirts and rugby balls mock ups. The "We Are Rugby" website still has a link for the Atlantic Cup at the top of the page, but not the Donnybrooke Cup next week.

I don't know who you're referring to in the USARL as not rugby league people (maybe because some of them are union people). But I know everyone in the USARL and there is no secret funding. Some clubs have better resources or work harder to ensure success, but everyone does it on their own dime.

Finally, the AMNRL has been fair. If you don't care about having a say in the direction of the league and just want sit back and just play while others make your decisions for you, then the AMNRL is for you.

If you'd rather be involved, have your voice heard and do things that will make a difference, the it's the USARL. Yep, there's a lot more work, but there is more than one person doing it.

 

[danmiles73]

Just went to look at the AMNRL website. Got an error 404.

Hmmmm.....

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Interesting info on the Dallas website.

http://dallasrlfc.com/Summer.html

Hard to know what to believe and what is just speculation and myth.

 

[Play some footy]

doesn't seem to be an issue with getting the donnybrookcup.com site up and running....why is there an issue with amnrl.com?

 

[deluded pom?]

doesn't seem to be an issue with getting the donnybrookcup.com site up and running....why is there an issue with amnrl.com?

Because the Donnybrook site is an outlet to sell match tickets?

 

[SeattleForce]

How can you possibly say that an organization based on principles of democracy with an elected president and board would be less fair than an organization run solely by one man with no way of challenging his opinions or questioning his actions? How can you possibly argue that?

This should be good..

 

[MR KNIGHT]

All the clubs were invited to a meeting to explain Star Groups role and an update on the speculation of a pro league. This took place a year ago. Everybody got invited.

Logos - clubs were encouraged to work with Star to make their logos. Becasue some clubs started pushing in other directions David decided the clubs could do their own thing.
,
Also, questions were not asked in December - a letter demanding David Nius resignation was sent in Decemeber. Prior to that there was no asking.

Its comical. Its like a poor kid saying "Who is this rich uncle and why is he helping us. How dare he!" I honestly could not see a problem. If you wanted their help it was there, if not fine.

PS if you really think Pittsburgh or DC will have the same say as Jacksonville or New Haven then you really are naive.