Rumoured and Confirmed signings - Part 4

[Abacus]

He's not the only one who'd be eligible. If it's 6 years with any 3 grades there are a few who'd qualify.

According to http://www.nospam47.com/au/league/n...2018-nrl-salary-cap/lt1bov2pvyst17q54zbc4zes1:
The $200,000 veteran/development player sum can be spent on either a veteran who has spent eight or more seasons at the club or a development player contracted to his current club for two or more continuous years before they are handed their first NRL contract. The development player is only eligible for the payout up to the age of 22.

This 8 year requirement would have Yeo and Whare eligible at the same time (I think) with Mansour, DWZ and Cartwright eligible a year earlier? I don't know how the development player concession will work.

From the NRL's CBA announcement:
- The average wage of a top 30 player will rise to $330,000 a year while the minimum wage will be increased to $100,000 next year and $120,000 in 2022

- The salary cap will rise to $9.4 million next year and more than $10 million in 2022

- A new Injury Hardship Fund will be set up to support players facing early retirement due to serious injury, replacing the Career Ending Injury Insurance scheme

Injury Hardship Fund may be a get-out-of-jail-free card if Whare does re-injure and can't make it back.

If Whare is on around $300k per year, its an absolute steal. Great value as either 1st choice or back-up centre. If his performances lead to him being considered underpaid in a couple of years, then the club will have got at least 1 year of paying him unders. The club can then decide to upgrade or release.

 

[mxlegend99]

Whether you have 10 players or 1 player eligible... you're not really saving anymore. Its still only $200k extra on the cap to split between one or more players.

That doesnt make Whare better value the second one other player is eligible. The cap split evenly might work out to be an average of $330k. But that's not accurate when clubs have a few elite players, a bunch of above average players and tend to round their roster out with minimum wage players.

The money left over per player drops extremely quick once you have guys on big contracts. We have atleast 3 guys on them.

Maloney - $850k
Tamou - $750k
Merrin - $700k

If the media figures are accurate theres $2.3m per season in 3 players . Even if we drop it to $2.2m to increase the chance of it being accurate.

$9.4m - $2.2m = $7.2m.
$7.2m divided by remaining 27 players is $266k

Cleary if he re-signs will be earning around $800k per season too. Thats minimum what we will need to spend to keep him. Cartwright is $500k+. RCG will be looking at a payrise. Blake. Peachey. All these guys would be worth considerably more than the average. The more above average players you need to keep. The more minimum wage players you need to make it work.

We could be at a point where we need say 10 minimum wage players to keep our elite and above average players. The top 25 expanded to a top 30. Those 5 extra players will automatically be minimum wage. Most clubs already had probably 5 or so players on minimum wage in their top 25. Its not unrealistic that teams will need a quarter to a third of their cap on minimum wage players.

But for 5 years Whare is guaranteed to earn triple that. If hes shit he gets the good deal. If he gets another injury he gets the good deal. But if he recaptures form and is actually worth say $500k a season he will likely want us to increase his pay. He will become unhappy and want out.

A 5 year contract has very little upside for a club. Theres scenarios where it can be good. But theres a hell of a lot more ways it can go wrong. Especially on a player who has recently missed 2 seasons with knee injuries.

I hope it works out well for us... but how often have these contracts worked for a club? Players are safe for 5 years no matter what. So ofcourse they will jump at them. They know they can get more later if they're worth it.

I think 2 seasons would have been best. With a third in our favour. See how he is and what our options are in 2 years. Not put all the power in his hands.

That said he doesnt strike me as a greedy player who will demand more if he's worth it. But he will have family and friends. His manager etc. Who could pressure him into that. At the end of the day his family comes first. I wouldnt blame any player choosing an extra $100k+ per year. Thats a lot for a short career.

 

[franklin2323]

Whether you have 10 players or 1 player eligible... you're not really saving anymore. Its still only $200k extra on the cap to split between one or more players.

That doesnt make Whare better value the second one other player is eligible. The cap split evenly might work out to be an average of $330k. But that's not accurate when clubs have a few elite players, a bunch of above average players and tend to round their roster out with minimum wage players.

The money left over per player drops extremely quick once you have guys on big contracts. We have atleast 3 guys on them.

Maloney - $850k
Tamou - $750k
Merrin - $700k

If the media figures are accurate theres $2.3m per season in 3 players . Even if we drop it to $2.2m to increase the chance of it being accurate.

$9.4m - $2.2m = $7.2m.
$7.2m divided by remaining 27 players is $266k

Cleary if he re-signs will be earning around $800k per season too. Thats minimum what we will need to spend to keep him. Cartwright is $500k+. RCG will be looking at a payrise. Blake. Peachey. All these guys would be worth considerably more than the average. The more above average players you need to keep. The more minimum wage players you need to make it work.

We could be at a point where we need say 10 minimum wage players to keep our elite and above average players. The top 25 expanded to a top 30. Those 5 extra players will automatically be minimum wage. Most clubs already had probably 5 or so players on minimum wage in their top 25. Its not unrealistic that teams will need a quarter to a third of their cap on minimum wage players.

But for 5 years Whare is guaranteed to earn triple that. If hes shit he gets the good deal. If he gets another injury he gets the good deal. But if he recaptures form and is actually worth say $500k a season he will likely want us to increase his pay. He will become unhappy and want out.

A 5 year contract has very little upside for a club. Theres scenarios where it can be good. But theres a hell of a lot more ways it can go wrong. Especially on a player who has recently missed 2 seasons with knee injuries.

I hope it works out well for us... but how often have these contracts worked for a club? Players are safe for 5 years no matter what. So ofcourse they will jump at them. They know they can get more later if they're worth it.

I think 2 seasons would have been best. With a third in our favour. See how he is and what our options are in 2 years. Not put all the power in his hands.

That said he doesnt strike me as a greedy player who will demand more if he's worth it. But he will have family and friends. His manager etc. Who could pressure him into that. At the end of the day his family comes first. I wouldnt blame any player choosing an extra $100k+ per year. Thats a lot for a short career.

In a 30 man squad. lets use a $10m cap.

$300k TPA
$200k Long serving player

Gives $10.5m. Assuming teams will run 5-10 minimum wage players in their squad. Lets use 5 players at the $100k.

$10m/25 players ave at $450k. How many of our starters are on that? So no reason signing Whare or DWZ should stop us from keeping players

 

[franklin2323]

Whare's playing left centre for NZ, Blake's played his best on the right (even if it doesn't suit his fend).
Still prefer Peachey over Whare. Wouldn't even consider moving Mansour.

We've screwed up the start of the last two seasons, before both times settling on the successful combinations of DWZ / Blake and Mansour / Peachey. We don't need to do this a third time do we?

Isn't Rapana a right winger? He was outside Whare in ANZAC test another thing that idiot Kidwell did wrong was break up club combinations.

You don't think not having Moylan early and Seg breaking his arm in round 1 didn't affect the way we started?

Also last season we had plenty under done that did the most harm then any position moves

 

[mxlegend99]

In a 30 man squad. lets use a $10m cap.

$300k TPA
$200k Long serving player

Gives $10.5m. Assuming teams will run 5-10 minimum wage players in their squad. Lets use 5 players at the $100k.

$10m/25 players ave at $450k. How many of our starters are on that? So no reason signing Whare or DWZ should stop us from keeping players

You increased the salary cap. Its not $10m. You then slanted the cap to be higher per average by removing 5 players on mimimum wage.

Thats ridiculous. The clubs are built around the higher paid players. The amount of minimum wage players you need changes depending on how many guys are earning huge money.

$300k is potentially 3 players wages that Whare is guaranteed. The risk is all with the club in this contract.

Edit
The $9.4m figure includes the $200k veteran player allowance and a $100k car allowance. The base figure is $9.1m

 

[franklin2323]

You increased the salary cap. Its not $10m. You then slanted the cap to be higher per average by removing 5 players on mimimum wage.

Thats ridiculous. The clubs are built around the higher paid players. The amount of minimum wage players you need changes depending on how many guys are earning huge money.

$300k is potentially 3 players wages that Whare is guaranteed. The risk is all with the club in this contract.

Edit
The $9.4m figure includes the $200k veteran player allowance and a $100k car allowance. The base figure is $9.1m

in 2019 it is going to be $10m though.

Point me to a club that won't have atleast 5 rookies in their squad?

For example

St George Illawarra Dragons 2018 squad: Leeson Ah Mau, Euan Aitken, Mitchell Allgood, Jack de Belin, Matt Dufty, Jai Field, Tyson Frizell, Reuben Garrick, James Graham, Patrick Herbert, Ben Hunt, Jacob Host, Josh Kerr, Tim Lafai, Jeremy Latimore, Blake Lawrie, Luciano Leilua, Zac Lomax, Nene Macdonald, Kurt Mann, Cameron McInnes, Darren Nicholls, Jason Nightingale, Jordan Pereira, Reece Robson, Hame Sele, Tariq Sims, Joel Thompson, Paul Vaughan, Gareth Widdop.

Parra annouced 3 NYC guys into FT squad yesterday all will be minimum wage.

 

[BxTom]

Long wait for an official announcement about Maloney/Moylan swap from Penrith. I wonder what is holding it up? Anything to do with Maloney leaving the training camp for 'personal reasons' I wonder?

Tom.

 

[mxlegend99]

Long wait for an official announcement about Maloney/Moylan swap from Penrith. I wonder what is holding it up? Anything to do with Maloney leaving the training camp for 'personal reasons' I wonder?

Tom.

I took that as being to sign a contract with us. The timing of it and the rumours were perfect.

I think its just the 10 day cooling period.

 

[mxlegend99]

in 2019 it is going to be $10m though.

Point me to a club that won't have atleast 5 rookies in their squad?

For example

St George Illawarra Dragons 2018 squad: Leeson Ah Mau, Euan Aitken, Mitchell Allgood, Jack de Belin, Matt Dufty, Jai Field, Tyson Frizell, Reuben Garrick, James Graham, Patrick Herbert, Ben Hunt, Jacob Host, Josh Kerr, Tim Lafai, Jeremy Latimore, Blake Lawrie, Luciano Leilua, Zac Lomax, Nene Macdonald, Kurt Mann, Cameron McInnes, Darren Nicholls, Jason Nightingale, Jordan Pereira, Reece Robson, Hame Sele, Tariq Sims, Joel Thompson, Paul Vaughan, Gareth Widdop.

Parra annouced 3 NYC guys into FT squad yesterday all will be minimum wage.

Every club will have a bunch of $750k+ players they build around. However many $100k players they have will depend on their stars in the team. Clubs arent going to assign 5 minimum wage spots and then work from there.

5 year contracts are a huge risk. Theres pretty limited scenarios where it pays off for the club. But theres no shortage of scenarios where the club loses out.

Injuries. Poor form. Players getting comfortable with their futures settled. Players improving and deciding they deserve more etc.

Pretty much takes a perfect set of circumstances for us to be the winners.

Ie. Whare stays fit. Whare finds his 2014 form again. Whare increases his worth as a player. Whare remains happy playing for less than his market value. Whare doesnt get comfortable knowing his future is settled. We dont lose any promising yoing centres because they know they went get an NRL spot with us for 5+ years.

 

[umina panther]

I took that as being to sign a contract with us. The timing of it and the rumours were perfect.

I think its just the 10 day cooling period.

No way anyone misses a game for Australia to sign a contract

 

[Bob]

Long wait for an official announcement about Maloney/Moylan swap from Penrith. I wonder what is holding it up? Anything to do with Maloney leaving the training camp for 'personal reasons' I wonder?

Tom.

Nrl is the hold up I believe
Contract was lodged late last week I believe
Read yesterday we are waiting on the nrl to sign off

 

[Tronald Crump]

Nrl is the hold up I believe
Contract was lodged late last week I believe
Read yesterday we are waiting on the nrl to sign off

If the NRL is the hold up it might take another week.

 

[Luke Bowden]

Maloney left the Aussie squad to attend a Medical with the Panthers staff.

 

[OldPanther]

Maloney left the Aussie squad to attend a Medical with the Panthers staff.

How'd you find out? Is that normal procedure?

 

[Luke Bowden]

How'd you find out? Is that normal procedure?

They were talking about it on the Radio.

It's normal for a player to have a medical before signing a contract.

 

[Whino]

They were talking about it on the Radio.

It's normal for a player to have a medical before signing a contract.

As long as you don't have the same Doctor that cleared Anthony Watmong for Parramatta.

 

[Luke Bowden]

As long as you don't have the same Doctor that cleared Anthony Watmong for Parramatta.

True! Or Glen Stewart.

 

[franklin2323]

Every club will have a bunch of $750k+ players they build around. However many $100k players they have will depend on their stars in the team. Clubs arent going to assign 5 minimum wage spots and then work from there.

5 year contracts are a huge risk. Theres pretty limited scenarios where it pays off for the club. But theres no shortage of scenarios where the club loses out.

Injuries. Poor form. Players getting comfortable with their futures settled. Players improving and deciding they deserve more etc.

Pretty much takes a perfect set of circumstances for us to be the winners.

Ie. Whare stays fit. Whare finds his 2014 form again. Whare increases his worth as a player. Whare remains happy playing for less than his market value. Whare doesnt get comfortable knowing his future is settled. We dont lose any promising yoing centres because they know they went get an NRL spot with us for 5+ years.

Those bigger contracts should be in addition to TPA so maybe half on the actual cap. Teams will keep them where possible it is the mid range players that get swapped from club to club replaced by cheaper as they progress. It is that step longer contracts try to stop happening

 

[hindy111]

I hope they do train hard, I just don’t think 5 year deals should be dished our for doing so.

Didnt eels give watmough a 4? We come out of that ok and people say him and Beau Scott where signed due to being proffessional. Your clubs needs that. Moylan had to go if my info is correct.

 

[OldPanther]

They were talking about it on the Radio.

It's normal for a player to have a medical before signing a contract.

Cheers. Maybe they should check for the extra supplements while they're at it.