2019 RM Cup & Sydney Shield

[IMO]

He had no money at Blacktown and when he got there they were getting beaten by over 50 points in both grades. Had never made the finals. He took them to the semis. When he left they were an ISP club.

Went to Asquith and they had no Ron Massey Cup team at all. Made the semis last year in both grades (Asquiths shield would barely win a game previously when they fielded a Ron Massey Cup team) and are top 4 this year.

I would say that is successful. Has never been at a big club in Ron Massey Cup and started from scratch both times.

He is too good to coach that level. Ask 99% of players who have had him and they will say the same thing.

Be good to see him at one of the big clubs where he just had to concentrate on coaching. Maybe a return to Cabra. He was brains behind their only title

 

[Pantherman72]

Be good to see him at one of the big clubs where he just had to concentrate on coaching. Maybe a return to Cabra. He was brains behind their only title

He was and that's the only year he has been involved in Ron Massey there. They finished last the year before. Starting at the bottom is common. Rumour is that Brothers, Cabra, Wentworthville and Wests will all have new coaches next season. Who'd be a coach!

 

[Footy Tragic]

He was and that's the only year he has been involved in Ron Massey there. They finished last the year before. Starting at the bottom is common. Rumour is that Brothers, Cabra, Wentworthville and Wests will all have new coaches next season. Who'd be a coach!

Pat and Chris Yates were both assistant coaches of that Cabra side but from I'm what I saw the coach had total control of the team. We finished second or third last the year before because we lost 80% of the previous years grand final side as the club thought we were going into partnership with Cronulla. As a result a lot of kids were blooded that year.

 

[Sharkie Army Gorilla]

Officially announced Windsor back in both comps for 2020

 

[Waverunner29]

He had no money at Blacktown and when he got there they were getting beaten by over 50 points in both grades. Had never made the finals. He took them to the semis. When he left they were an ISP club.

Went to Asquith and they had no Ron Massey Cup team at all. Made the semis last year in both grades (Asquiths shield would barely win a game previously when they fielded a Ron Massey Cup team) and are top 4 this year.

I would say that is successful. Has never been at a big club in Ron Massey Cup and started from scratch both times.

He is too good to coach that level. Ask 99% of players who have had him and they will say the same thing.

I've spoken to a few players who have been coached under him and the fed back was mixed but it was clear he could coach. in a competition where it's possible to make the semis losing more games then you win I'd say making the grand finale would be successful but each to their own. Would you have any insight into why he hasn't landed a head coaching job at one of the bigger clubs?

 

[Footy Tragic]

I've spoken to a few players who have been coached under him and the fed back was mixed but it was clear he could coach. in a competition where it's possible to make the semis losing more games then you win I'd say making the grand finale would be successful but each to their own. Would you have any insight into why he hasn't landed a head coaching job at one of the bigger clubs?

He's to smart for people running the bigger clubs, they like to think they know more than they really do.

 

[Sharkie Army Gorilla]

I've spoken to a few players who have been coached under him and the fed back was mixed but it was clear he could coach. in a competition where it's possible to make the semis losing more games then you win I'd say making the grand finale would be successful but each to their own. Would you have any insight into why he hasn't landed a head coaching job at one of the bigger clubs?

Pat is the fairest coach I have worked with. I guarantee the players who talk ill of him have had a poor attitude or poor work ethic and he has moved them on for those reasons. Of cause they are going to blame the coach and not themselves. If they take it personally so be it but its semi professional Rugby League where players are paid to perform. I invite any one to come down to Storey Park and speak with Pat and make up your own mind on the bloke. You will not find a more switched on coach at that level of Rugby League. The respect he has from his players, the board at Asquith and his staff is 2nd to none and the culture he has created is infectious. Good things coming for Asquith while he is in charge. Players are turning down big offers from rival Massey clubs to stay at Asquith for the coming seasons. Its shows something.

 

[Sharkie Army Gorilla]

He's to smart for people running the bigger clubs, they like to think they know more than they really do.

Hit the nail on the head there.

 

[Broncos93]

Officially announced Windsor back in both comps for 2020

So provided no clubs drop out, that will take it to a 13 team competition with a Fijian side joining as well?

Hopefully that's the case.

 

[Oldschool]

Hit the nail on the head there.

Pat is the fairest coach I have worked with. I guarantee the players who talk ill of him have had a poor attitude or poor work ethic and he has moved them on for those reasons. Of cause they are going to blame the coach and not themselves. If they take it personally so be it but its semi professional Rugby League where players are paid to perform. I invite any one to come down to Storey Park and speak with Pat and make up your own mind on the bloke. You will not find a more switched on coach at that level of Rugby League. The respect he has from his players, the board at Asquith and his staff is 2nd to none and the culture he has created is infectious. Good things coming for Asquith while he is in charge. Players are turning down big offers from rival Massey clubs to stay at Asquith for the coming seasons. Its shows something.

Asquith don't pay overs and stick to the salary cap and yet Pat can still get players to go there when other clubs are throwing big money around. There is a reason for that. Firstly he has created a great culture and players enjoy playing at Asquith. Secondly players that play under Pat improve. Asquith had 4 selected in the RMC rep team which is more than any other club. A number of Asquith contracted players have spent most of the season playing for Norths in the Canterbury Cup. Asquith is running equal 3rd and if not for an off day would be equal 2nd in RMC. These results are due to good recruitment and good coaching. In addition to being a top class man manager Pat has great knowledge of players at the RMC/ISP level. His predecessor Clarke was also a good coach technically but had nowhere near the ability to attract players and nowhere near the knowledge of the player market. Makes a big difference at that level.

 

[Waverunner29]

I

He's to smart for people running the bigger clubs, they like to think they know more than they really do.

bold statement I think the guys running the top clubs would have some sort of idea or they wouldn't be continuously at the top.

Seems like pat has to do both if he only he had to focus on coaching he might have a better chance of winning a comp

 

[Pantherman72]

I've spoken to a few players who have been coached under him and the fed back was mixed but it was clear he could coach. in a competition where it's possible to make the semis losing more games then you win I'd say making the grand finale would be successful but each to their own. Would you have any insight into why he hasn't landed a head coaching job at one of the bigger clubs?

Your statement contradicts itself. As you say, you can make it to the finals losing more then you win, so why would you then say making a Grand Final is the guage for success. You can lose more then you win and string 3 wins together and make the final. Does that make you more successful then a team who wins 15 games but loses a semi final?

Success for each club is different. Clubs with their own Cup teams have a huge advantage in recruitment. They should all be aiming for top 4 minimum, like Wenty, Mounties and Wests all are and Blacktown have no excuse not to be. Clubs like Brothers and Guildford have no feeders and different budgets to say a Mounties, St.Marys, Cabra and Wenty so success for them is different again. Teams with strong ISP clubs and u20s clubs such as Penrith will always do well as well as they get quality players handed to them. Would you rather get players from Norths who have not won a game yet or Penrith u20s where some end up NRL players eventually. Logistics also play a major part. 80% or more of the competition are from out west so teams there have a huge advantage. Teams who have strong ISP affiliations will always have an advantage. Look at Glebe/Burwood last year who had lots of Newtown and were one minute from a Grand Final. This year they have had less help and are struggling. Different things play a part and all clubs are in different situations and judge success differently. Coaches should be judged the same way and are all in different situations. Asquith really have no right to be where they are on the table when you consider logistics, budget, feeder arrangement with Norths who take their best players and give back worse or none at all. They are in their 2nd year back in Ron Massey and are punching above their weight. People always want to cut a club or coach down when they start doing ok.

As for why he hasn't been at a big club. Youd have to ask them but generally most jobs go to people who know someone at the club already. Footy will always be a jobs for the boys industry.

 

[Pantherman72]

I

bold statement I think the guys running the top clubs would have some sort of idea or they wouldn't be continuously at the top.

Seems like pat has to do both if he only he had to focus on coaching he might have a better chance of winning a comp

Pat has told me that at Blacktown he had to do a lot more then coach but didn't want to get into it all. He also said that at Asquith it is completely different and that the club is run extremely well by a great board and that he just coaches and recruits.
Only one team can win a comp each year (usually Wenty), it's not the be all and end all mate and it's usually the team with the best players.

 

[Waverunner29]

Your statement contradicts itself. As you say, you can make it to the finals losing more then you win, so why would you then say making a Grand Final is the guage for success. You can lose more then you win and string 3 wins together and make the final. Does that make you more successful then a team who wins 15 games but loses a semi final?

Success for each club is different. Clubs with their own Cup teams have a huge advantage in recruitment. They should all be aiming for top 4 minimum, like Wenty, Mounties and Wests all are and Blacktown have no excuse not to be. Clubs like Brothers and Guildford have no feeders and different budgets to say a Mounties, St.Marys, Cabra and Wenty so success for them is different again. Teams with strong ISP clubs and u20s clubs such as Penrith will always do well as well as they get quality players handed to them. Would you rather get players from Norths who have not won a game yet or Penrith u20s where some end up NRL players eventually. Logistics also play a major part. 80% or more of the competition are from out west so teams there have a huge advantage. Teams who have strong ISP affiliations will always have an advantage. Look at Glebe/Burwood last year who had lots of Newtown and were one minute from a Grand Final. This year they have had less help and are struggling. Different things play a part and all clubs are in different situations and judge success differently. Coaches should be judged the same way and are all in different situations. Asquith really have no right to be where they are on the table when you consider logistics, budget, feeder arrangement with Norths who take their best players and give back worse or none at all. They are in their 2nd year back in Ron Massey and are punching above their weight. People always want to cut a club or coach down when they start doing ok.

As for why he hasn't been at a big club. Youd have to ask them but generally most jobs go to people who know someone at the club already. Footy will always be a jobs for the boys industry.

The odd occasion when that does happen it requires a fair bit of luck and more often then not a team that strings together a couple of wins gets found out. Example a few years back Auburn made a run late in the season but were flogged in a game that was over before half time. Same principle on the weekend with Blacktown and Asquith if these two teams play each other ten times Asquith win eight so there's still a chance Blacktown can win

Fair points about logistics and teams affiliated with NRL clubs but I do think it has its pros and cons.I was never trying to cut the club or the coach down I actually think the way Asquith have been playing has really opened up the competiton instead of the same teams pulling away from everyone else.

I agree with footy being a job for boys industry but some of the bigger clubs do advertise coaching jobs the opportunity may be minimal but it is there.

 

[Waverunner29]

Your statement contradicts itself. As you say, you can make it to the finals losing more then you win, so why would you then say making a Grand Final is the guage for success. You can lose more then you win and string 3 wins together and make the final. Does that make you more successful then a team who wins 15 games but loses a semi final?

Success for each club is different. Clubs with their own Cup teams have a huge advantage in recruitment. They should all be aiming for top 4 minimum, like Wenty, Mounties and Wests all are and Blacktown have no excuse not to be. Clubs like Brothers and Guildford have no feeders and different budgets to say a Mounties, St.Marys, Cabra and Wenty so success for them is different again. Teams with strong ISP clubs and u20s clubs such as Penrith will always do well as well as they get quality players handed to them. Would you rather get players from Norths who have not won a game yet or Penrith u20s where some end up NRL players eventually. Logistics also play a major part. 80% or more of the competition are from out west so teams there have a huge advantage. Teams who have strong ISP affiliations will always have an advantage. Look at Glebe/Burwood last year who had lots of Newtown and were one minute from a Grand Final. This year they have had less help and are struggling. Different things play a part and all clubs are in different situations and judge success differently. Coaches should be judged the same way and are all in different situations. Asquith really have no right to be where they are on the table when you consider logistics, budget, feeder arrangement with Norths who take their best players and give back worse or none at all. They are in their 2nd year back in Ron Massey and are punching above their weight. People always want to cut a club or coach down when they start doing ok.

As for why he hasn't been at a big club. Youd have to ask them but generally most jobs go to people who know someone at the club already. Footy will always be a jobs for the boys industry.

Rugby league is a results driven sport your judged by how much you win. I was simply trying to find out how a guy with so much prise hasn't really won anything.

 

[Pantherman72]

Rugby league is a results driven sport your judged by how much you win. I was simply trying to find out how a guy with so much prise hasn't really won anything.

It's not results driven at this level. Asquith have had 6 of their own players play Canterbury Cup this season and one play u20s. 3 have been regulars in Cup all season. Developing players and getting them to a higher level is as important as winning.

 

[Waverunner29]

It's not results driven at this level. Asquith have had 6 of their own players play Canterbury Cup this season and one play u20s. 3 have been regulars in Cup all season. Developing players and getting them to a higher level is as important as winning.

You'd like to think being semi professional results would be at the top of the agenda fellowed by Developing players.The aged representative teams would be better suited for developing players

 

[Pantherman72]

You'd like to think being semi professional results would be at the top of the agenda fellowed by Developing players.The aged representative teams would be better suited for developing players

It doesn't develop them to play against and with men though which is very important for Props and Halves.

 

[True Blue]

Asquith don't pay overs and stick to the salary cap and yet Pat can still get players to go there when other clubs are throwing big money around. There is a reason for that. Firstly he has created a great culture and players enjoy playing at Asquith. Secondly players that play under Pat improve. Asquith had 4 selected in the RMC rep team which is more than any other club. A number of Asquith contracted players have spent most of the season playing for Norths in the Canterbury Cup. Asquith is running equal 3rd and if not for an off day would be equal 2nd in RMC. These results are due to good recruitment and good coaching. In addition to being a top class man manager Pat has great knowledge of players at the RMC/ISP level. His predecessor Clarke was also a good coach technically but had nowhere near the ability to attract players and nowhere near the knowledge of the player market. Makes a big difference at that level.

Depends who you speak to at asquith about Clarke. Some rate him for his technical knowledge but others not. 2015 asquith played the gf but clarke nearly got the sack mid season when a player manager made a complaint. Brad Horder resigned as shield coach because he couldn't work with clarke but they had some quality players plus a few good ones from norths so hard to tell whether it was the quality of the team or clarke's influence.

 

[Footy Tragic]

Depends who you speak to at asquith about Clarke. Some rate him for his technical knowledge but others not. 2015 asquith played the gf but clarke nearly got the sack mid season when a player manager made a complaint. Brad Horder resigned as shield coach because he couldn't work with clarke but they had some quality players plus a few good ones from norths so hard to tell whether it was the quality of the team or clarke's influence.

I've spoken to him a couple of times this year at Cabra, he seems quite knowledgeable but I'm not seeing his daily interaction with the boys. Could he be a chance of taking over from Yatesy?