2025 Ashes Tour

[Last Week]

Moses has played one great rep game.

Game 2 last year.

He's been ordinary to anonymous in every other big game of his career.

Game 3 last year it was Luai who broke it open.

Terrible bait

 

[Munky]

Terrible bait

Bait?

He's been straight setted twice in the finals.

With a 33% win rate all up.

That even accounts for him choking in the 2022 prelim but being saved by the Cowboys being worse.

It's hilarious that the mystique around him has grown despite not being able to add to his losses since then.

 

[Chins]

Bait?

He's been straight setted twice in the finals.

With a 33% win rate all up.

That even accounts for him choking in the 2022 prelim but being saved by the Cowboys being worse.

It's hilarious that the mystique around him has grown despite not being able to add to his losses since then.

Yuuuup massive choker

 

[mozza91]

Bait?

He's been straight setted twice in the finals.

With a 33% win rate all up.

That even accounts for him choking in the 2022 prelim but being saved by the Cowboys being worse.

It's hilarious that the mystique around him has grown despite not being able to add to his losses since then.

Moses played well for NSW when it mattered. Something Cleary has proven he’s incapable of time and time again.
Cleary is great within the Penrith system but very limited outside of it. Yeo is the same unless he just plays as a traditional front rower.

 

[The Axe of Druss]

Moses has done something only Joey and Sticky have ever achieved before him: Win a SOO decider at Suncorp


Until Cleary can manage that I'm afraid he will always be a rung below Mitch

 

[Chins]

Moses has done something only Joey and Sticky have ever achieved before him: Win a SOO decider at Suncorp


Until Cleary can manage that I'm afraid he will always be a rung below Mitch

Keep your trolling to the group chat honey

 

[Valheru]

We can't sugarcoat this just because we want international footy to be successful. It is men against boys and England do not have a single position on the field where they have an advantage, not one. The closest is Farnworth over Staggs.

The crowds and the conditions up north might keep them in the next two games but ultimately they will fail because Australia has far better players.

 

[The Axe of Druss]

Keep your trolling to the group chat honey

Truth will always be defined as trolling in the eyes of the jealous mate

 

[undertaker]

Never underestimate the ability for England RL to fu#k up a golden opportunity .

2017 World Cup semifinal.

2021 World Cup semifinal.

2025 1st ashes test.

2021 RLWC was their best chance of making the final.

The draw was doctored in such a way so that England wouldn't play Australia or New Zealand before the final...and somehow England lost the semi-final to a team they hammered by 54 points just 4 weeks earlier!

However, regarding 2017...I think you meant the 2013 RLWC semi-final, which is still one of the best RL test matches I've ever seen (that doesn't involve Australia). It was worth staying up until nearly 2am in the morning to watch that. You can blame Burgess for that careless high tackle in the final minute, giving the Kiwis another set of six which directly led to the match-winning try.

 

[taste2taste]

The problem with this English team is the selections.

Leaving out Thompson, Smith, AJ, Smithies and Nicholson is mental.

Any player that's proven themselves in the NRL should be an automatic selection for the game day 17. That would be the equivalent of the Socceroos selecting players from the A League ahead of players in the EPL

Smith is a lockdown defender and a gun on offence and Wane selected a SL scrub ahead of him ? Why ? Because Smith has an Australian accent ? FMD

 

[RedVee]

The problem with this English team is the selections.

Leaving out Thompson, Smith, AJ, Smithies and Nicholson is mental.

Any player that's proven themselves in the NRL should be an automatic selection for the game day 17. That would be the equivalent of the Socceroos selecting players from the A League ahead of players in the EPL

Smith is a lockdown defender and a gun on offence and Wane selected a SL scrub ahead of him ? Why ? Because Smith has an Australian accent ? FMD

What’s the chances of selection changes for the second Test?
I presume England is also only allowed to pick from a squad?

 

[Mother Nature's Son]

The problem with this English team is the selections.

Leaving out Thompson, Smith, AJ, Smithies and Nicholson is mental.

Any player that's proven themselves in the NRL

Thompson couldn`t even get a run in first-grade.
Nicholson player of the future, but missed most of the year and was only back for a couple of weeks.
Smithies, maybe, but let`s not kid ourselves he`s a game-changer.
Smith, yes his kicking game could be crucial.

 

[Chimp]

Today’s result is an indication of where the game is in England at the moment - Australia were far from near their best, but were still head and shoulders above anything England could offer.

I could do a really long post on the state of the game over here, but I’ll maybe save that for another day. But here’s just a few of the massive issues;

1 - Fundementally, there’s no money in the game. The vast majority of clubs are run on the scent of an oily rag. And that leads to all the problems below.

2 - The game is run (and held back) by the clubs, with self interest being the number 1 priority. A great example of this is that Toulouse and Catalans are only allowed in Superleague if they pay for the travel and accommodation of teams visiting them, and take less central funding than the other teams. The owners of the same clubs that don’t have a pot to piss in are making decisions on what is supposed to be ‘best for the game’, when in reality, the best thing for the game would be for their shitty little ex-mining town clubs with a population of 125 inbreds to be playing in the lower leagues.

3 - Junior development is the worst it has ever been, when arguably in the Southern Hemisphere it’s the best it has ever been. There’s no money to do it properly, clubs no longer run proper development programmes, they’re all ‘scholarships’ with local colleges that have zero rugby league interest, and where basically they just chuck 30 kids into the scholarship programme, coached by pretty much anyone who’s willing to do it as a job for what is basically the minimum wage in the U.K, and hope that 1 or 2 make it.

4 - Salary Cap - was £1.8m when introduced in 2002, it’s now only £2.1m. That’s an average of £84k ($171k). There are plenty of players playing in superleague who earn less than the national UK minimum wage - particularly juniors just making their way in the game.

5 - Coaching/Facilites - more minimum wage and lack of funding for decent facilites

6 - Community game - Absolutely on its arse. Clubs dying, paroticipation dying. Talent pipeline dying.

Just a bit more on the Super League salary cap. It was £1.8m in 2002, based on compound inflation alone, that figure should be £3.4m today. Meaning the actual cap of £2.1m is effectively a real life 62% reduction in the salary cap.
When you then look at what’s happened to the salary cap in Australia, it’s clear to see why the gap is widening.
In 2002, the NRL salary cap was $3.45m - based on exchange rates from the time, the Superleague 2002 cap of £1.8m was worth ~$5m, meaning Superleague effectively had a salary cap that was 45% bigger than the NRL cap.
In 2026, the NRL cap is $11.55m, with the Superleague cap of £2.1m being worth $4.28m on today’s exchange rates. That means the NRL cap is now 270% bigger than Super League.

 

[Stotty]

This is Jack Welsby before his knee injury, when he could still run and tackle and, you know, play fullback. How Wane picked him, when his form and fitness mean he's not even the best English fullback in the St.Helens squad at the moment, never mind Super League, I'll never know.

 

[Taking The Two]

Welsby is comfortably the best fullback at Saints, so that is one weird claim. Don’t buy the Tristan Sailor nonsense, he’s garbage and his numbers are heavily padded out by appearing against the crap of Super League. Sailor scored 14 of his 15 tries against teams who finished outside of the play-offs, made one clean break all season against sides that finished above Saints, made 16 of his 26 errors against the sides that finished above Saints and 6 of his 25 try assists against those same sides. He’s superb against dross like Salford and Cas, he’s next to useless against the decent sides.

Welsby is ten times the player Sailor is and ever will be. Welsby had a shocker on Saturday, though. Most did for England. Sailor would be first out of the door if I was Head Coach at Saints, when everyone is fit, he doesn’t get a game and has got lucky in 2025 that Feldt, Murphy and Dagnall have been injured, so he’s been shunted out wide to the wing.

 

[Stotty]

Welsby is comfortably the best fullback at Saints, so that is one weird claim.

On current form and fitness, Harry Robertson would be the better fullback. I didn't mention Sailor. I was talking about English fullbacks, albeit in this case a stand off who's been playing at centre all year and has only ever played a handful of games at fullback, but would still be the better option. Welsby, at the moment anyway, is far too slow to play fullback.

 

[Taking The Two]

A man who has barely played fullback all year. I’m not so sure on that. Robertson is a 6, that’s where he needs to be moving forwards. The Ashes has come far too early for Robertson, even at centre.

Sailor deputised for Welsby when injured.

 

[Chimp]

Welsby at his best is class - unfortunately though, he’s a long way off his best at the moment. I would still have probably picked him, a gamble worth taking and certainly not the biggest issue with Wanes squad selection.
He was terrible though - I couldn’t believe what I was seeing for that Crichton try.
I’m not a fan of Wane at all, very one dimensional, and way too much Wigan/ex-Wigan bias. But that being said, I don’t think it really matters what squad he picks, it’s shuffling deckchairs on the Titanic - there are fundamental issues with rugby league in the UK that need addressing.

 

[Taking The Two]

Ultimately, that’s it. The problems aren’t Wane, they’re not the players that he picked on Saturday and they’re not the players he didn’t select in his 24-man squad. I thought we would lose 3-0 before a game was played, I’m certain now and I’m just going to watch and enjoy the games left. The problems run far deeper and won’t necessarily be solved by sacking Wane after this series. It’s issues that require a root and branch review but I’m not sure we’ll do that.

 

[adamkungl]

The problem with this English team is the selections.

Leaving out Thompson, Smith, AJ, Smithies and Nicholson is mental.

Any player that's proven themselves in the NRL should be an automatic selection for the game day 17. That would be the equivalent of the Socceroos selecting players from the A League ahead of players in the EPL

Smith is a lockdown defender and a gun on offence and Wane selected a SL scrub ahead of him ? Why ? Because Smith has an Australian accent ? FMD

Nonsense, we saw what this policy gets you when Bennett was coach and had nuffs like Chris Heighington, Blake Austin, and Jackson Hastings out there.

Shuffling deckchairs isn't going to save them and nor is picking 3rd rate Aussies.

The state of the sport in England obviously means there are gonna be less superstars and less intense preparation via club footy. If there is one thing I would have changed before this series it would be the mad decision not to play a warm up test. Doesn't matter against who, just knock the cobwebs out before the series. Hell play 2 even. Aus will always do the bare minimum so the one place England can get an advantage is cohesion by playing more games.

If England can beat NZ and Tonga, and NZ and Tonga can (sometimes) beat Australia it stands to reason that England should be able to sneak the occasional win. But 50 years of failure runs deep in their psyche and they can't stop self sabotaging.