2nd Test: Australia v South Africa at Hobart on Nov 12-16, 2016

[undertaker]

The problem for Australia is that the 'next generation' are overrated flogs.

I typed Nic Maddinson into google and the second option that came up was "Nic Maddinson Instagram".

Maybe that's why he avgs. 38 over 58 first class matches against the like of Joe Mennie. Maybe he's full of himself and already thinks he's great.

Or maybe he's a nice guy but he's just shit. Either way he's probably got an awesome Instagram account though with loads of followers.

Would never have happened in Border's day.

Well, ISPs (Internet Service Providers) were only just entering the mainstream at the end of Border's captaincy (and even then, less than 30-40% of households had the internet during the dial-up modem era, most of them in the cities), and it would still be nearly another decade before ADSL/broadband and social media pages such as MySpace/MSN Spaces - the precursors to Facebook/Twitter/Instagram - appeared on the scene. Mobile phones weren't as widespread as now due to their big and bulky size, and didn't have the capacity to take photos or use the internet on the phone. No one back then could've ever envisaged the possibility of taking a picture on your phone, and then use the internet on your phone to upload it to your public social media profile for the entire world to see.

So, back in Border's day, due to the smaller wages players got back then (most players had jobs outside of cricket), the lack of major third-party endorsements and the lack of technology, there wasn't all that free time to bum around like a dropkick off the cricket field and show off to the world photos of all the exotic places you travelled to, all the fancy possessions you had in your home, how cute and cuddly you could look in a romantic pose next to your girlfriend/wife/partner, how drunk you could look in a public setting on a Friday or Saturday night etc.

 

[JJ]

ROFL! Are you kidding me?

Only in the sense that Trimble mentally just wasn't up to it - that international experience wasn't representative of his ability as a cricketer - and we were a handy side then - he choked spectacularly, it was tragic

MMarsh just isn't there at the moment, the Australian obsession with all-rounders is weird - funny because they grow on trees here, perhaps that's why we so seldom have world class batsmen in particular

 

[undertaker]

Look at the lack of talent the rest of the nation is producing. NSW would beat the rest of Australia by an innings and 500 runs.

This, this, THIS!

The gulf in the quality of players produced in NSW compared to the other Australian states/territories is very large compared to when I first started watching cricket back in the mid '90s.

NSW won the Matador Cup this year quite comfortably without the tournament's leading run-scorer and wicket-taker from last year: Steve Smith and Mitchell Starc. Had both of them played, the tournament would've been a foregone conclusion from the start. Also, this new Cricket Australia XI side has only won one game (out of 12) in the two years they've been in the comp. Might as well give their spot to the ACT, to give the ACT/Canberra region an opportunity to develop their own players (Michael Bevan and Brad Haddin were both ACT juniors) and play more games at Manuka Oval.

 

[jargan83]

MMarsh just isn't there at the moment, the Australian obsession with all-rounders is weird

I bet Andrew Flintoff still get's a chuckle over the Australian obsession with an all-rounder.

 

[T-Boon]

This, this, THIS!

The gulf in the quality of players produced in NSW compared to the other Australian states/territories is very large compared to when I first started watching cricket back in the mid '90s.

The worst offending state is Victoria.

They are a small version of what has happened in the West Indies.
The quality of players they have produced in the last 30 years (with the obvious exception of Warne) compared to the previous 30 years is truely alarming. It is on a par with the West Indies decline.

I can tell you it is AFL's fault. Look through the ranks of the AFL and you will see huge amounts of players who were also Victorian under aged cricket players. The bottom line in that regard is that because the quality of skills in Victorian Football are so low there is a lot of cross over in talent. The main thing you need to be good at AFL is commitment and determination (the skills themselves are easy to pick up and the standard is low). That ingredient (commitment, dedication, work ethic) is something kids who are good at cricket tend to have in abundance - together with their cricket skills.

 

[Hutty1986]

The problem for Australia is that the 'next generation' are overrated flogs.

I typed Nic Maddinson into google and the second option that came up was "Nic Maddinson Instagram".

Maybe that's why he avgs. 38 over 58 first class matches against the like of Joe Mennie. Maybe he's full of himself and already thinks he's great.

Or maybe he's a nice guy but he's just shit. Either way he's probably got an awesome Instagram account though with loads of followers.

The other hope, Cameron Bancroft, avgs. 37 after 44 matches.

Both are 24 and 23 respectively so they're hardly kids anymore.

Where are the 18 and 19 year olds with the talent?

I'm almost starting to feel sorry for the selectors. There is f**k all talent out there.

Even Jake Lehmann. He's 24 but has only played 18 first class matches. How is that possible?

Turn it up Tommy. The only thing you google is 'shirtless Boyd Cordner.'

 

[Tommy Smith]

The worst offending state is Victoria.

They are a small version of what has happened in the West Indies.
The quality of players they have produced in the last 30 years (with the obvious exception of Warne) compared to the previous 30 years is truely alarming. It is on a par with the West Indies decline.

I can tell you it is AFL's fault. Look through the ranks of the AFL and you will see huge amounts of players who were also Victorian under aged cricket players. The bottom line in that regard is that because the quality of skills in Victorian Football are so low there is a lot of cross over in talent. The main thing you need to be good at AFL is commitment and determination (the skills themselves are easy to pick up and the standard is low). That ingredient (commitment, dedication, work ethic) is something kids who are good at cricket tend to have in abundance - together with their cricket skills.

Nailed it. The talent requirement to play AFL is perhaps the lowest of any professional sport in the world.

You could take the 100 best young athletes in the country who have never played AFL and after 1-2 years of skill development they'd be good to go.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Turn it up Tommy. The only thing you google is 'shirtless Boyd Cordner.'

That and 'George Burgess naked selfie'.

 

[T-Boon]

Nailed it. The talent requirement to play AFL is perhaps the lowest of any professional sport in the world.

You could take the 100 best young athletes in the country who have never played AFL and after 1-2 years of skill development they'd be good to go.

Exactly, the AFL admit as much when they took Israel and Karmichael Hunt. And even more so when they put a team of 18 year olds on the Gold Coast knowing that they would be OK. Try doing that in any other sport and you would be on manslaughter charges.

 

[Raiders_Premiers]

Get rid of Pat f**king Howard
Cut down Lehmann's influence on the team

The worst offending state is Victoria.

They are a small version of what has happened in the West Indies.
The quality of players they have produced in the last 30 years (with the obvious exception of Warne) compared to the previous 30 years is truely alarming. It is on a par with the West Indies decline.

I can tell you it is AFL's fault. Look through the ranks of the AFL and you will see huge amounts of players who were also Victorian under aged cricket players. The bottom line in that regard is that because the quality of skills in Victorian Football are so low there is a lot of cross over in talent. The main thing you need to be good at AFL is commitment and determination (the skills themselves are easy to pick up and the standard is low). That ingredient (commitment, dedication, work ethic) is something kids who are good at cricket tend to have in abundance - together with their cricket skills.

Even Warne probably would've played AFL if he could've made it to first grade.

 

[Bazal]

The state of cricket in QLD is pretty abysmal, really. For a state that's produced some of our greatest cricketers ever, they look absolutely awful at the moment.

Victoria are producing decent Shield players, they just can't seem to take the step up. But at the moment that seems to be a nation wide issue. Joe Burns scored a hundred at the Gabba against the Aussie attack (well, the two good ones) and looked hopeless against equal quality quicks in Hobart

 

[undertaker]

Yeah, that's an abomination - shows you how these Australian wickets have created a fraudulent bunch of averages - not just his, but he's the most obvious - no way is Warner a 49 average opening bat, 58 is too high for Smith TBH, Khawaja, and even the Marsh brothers at 40 and 24 are ridiculously high

f**k, Ross Taylor scored the highest test score by a touring batsmen last year, hasn't been able to buy a run since

Flat tracks have been a problem in Australia for many years. But don't solely blame Cricket Australia; the AFL has had the biggest influence on this. Because of the AFL, the MCG (since the early-mid '90s) and Adelaide (since 2013/14) pitches are both drop-ins, the pitch at the new Burswood Stadium in Perth will also be a drop-in, and the AFL have been pressuring Brisbane and Sydney to use drop-in pitches to accommodate their players so they don't have to be tackled on the 'hard surface in the centre of the ground'. It will be a very sad day in Australia cricket when the Gabba/SCG Trust managements cave into the AFL's demand:

http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/tur...r-world-cup-snub/story-e6frf3e3-1226688361569

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket...cket-pitch-to-appease-afl-20131203-2yolp.html

With occasional AFL matches now also being played at Manuka Oval (Canberra) and at Blundstone Arena (Hobart), it will be a matter of time before I can see the AFL putting pressure on the groundstaff of those two venues to produce drop-in pitches.

The BCCI have also definitely had a big say in the types of pitches used the last time India toured here in 2014/15. In 2014/15, Adelaide did nothing until day 5, and the MCG and SCG were both high-scoring roads. Only the Gabba provided 'mild' assistance to the bowlers. Smith and Kohli scored runs with consummate ease during that series.

In 2011/12, the MCG was a bit under-prepared due to the weather and offered a bit for the bowlers (hence 333 was the highest team score in that match), India got rissoled at the WACA within 3 days, SCG and Adelaide offered assistance to the bowlers as well. India obviously avoided the WACA in 2014/15 and the BCCI will be more than happy to play at the new Burswood Stadium as it will be a drop-in pitch and the traditional/hard WACA pitch will be thrown into the thrash-heap of cricket history.

Since the renovation of the WACA in 2002, that 2012 pitch vs India was one of 3 test WACA pitches - along with the 2010 and 2013 Ashes tests - that was one of the better pitches, offering lots of pace, carry and bounce for the fast bowlers, and unlike the BCCI's incessant whinging about it being a green-top, it was nowhere near a green-top like the 2011 test vs NZ in Hobart. The pitch the BCCI dished up in the 1st test of the 2013 India vs Australia series in Chennai was a massive dummy-spit, not even ICC standard and looked more like Roland Garros in Paris. And then there was the 'selective watering' on certain parts of pitch before and after the days play to suit the Indian off-spin bowlers:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/india-v-australia-2013/content/story/622766.html

But despite this gross example of 'bending the rules' (as the politically-correct folk would rather put it), the ICC remained mute on the issue as the BCCI contribute more money to them than all the other international cricket boards combined. The pitch in Nagpur vs South Africa last year was a shocker as well. Absolute power corrupts absolutely

 

[RockWheel]

Staring down the barrel of Australia losing all matches in home series for the first time since 1887 (lost both Tests to England). f**k sake.

 

[Iafeta]

Perhaps the NSW great all rounder A Johns is next cab off the rank??

 

[TheParraboy]

I don't think wholesale changes are the answer, but we do need to move on Voges and Lyon for mine

Pattison looks a real talent, but grooming him in now would be way to soon

SOK has to be in there, as well as Jackson Bird as the 3rd seamer

 

[Mr Spock!]

Ffs get Border in there....

 

[hineyrulz]

Ffs get Border in there....

I'd love to see them sign him up on an advisement sort of role, listening to the likes of Warne and Clarke won't help them. They came into strong sides and wouldn't have a clue how to help dig a young side out of this mess. AB or Steve Waugh are the two men they should be talking too.

 

[Meth]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/australia-v-south-africa-2016-17/content/story/1066358.html

Yeah ok, but no direct mention of players being held accountable?

I would say Voges and Mitchell Marsh must be under immediate pressure, at least.

 

[TIGER14]

People seem to have forgotten the absolute shite that was Scott Boland last summer. At least Mennie hasn't been as bad as him.

 

[Meapro Ham]

Pattison looks a real talent, but grooming him in now would be way to soon

Yeah. Let's wait until he's about 36 then give him a year or two before he retires. That's the Aussie way now.