4th Test: India v England at Mumbai on Dec 8-12, 2016

[AlwaysGreen]

Derek Underwood.

I had deadly in mind. Fortunately for him some wickets were wet when he played, otherwise he'd be just another england mediocre.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Underwood averaged 24 at home and 27 away.

In total, 297 wickets @ 25 with 17 5-wicket hauls and 6-10 wicket hauls. A true great of the game by every measure.

Is all of that down to uncovered wickets?

If so, by your logic I assume that every spin bowler during the era of uncovered wickets is mediocre?

And i'm assuming that theory applies to Tiger O'Reilly, too.

 

[AlwaysGreen]

From cricinfo:

• No nickname was better earned that the "Deadly" which Derek Underwood's Kent team-mates conferred on him for the havoc he caused on rain-affected pitches. Such was his accuracy and, for a left-arm spinner, pace - either side of medium when the ball was really biting - that when conditions favoured him an avalanche of wickets was almost guaranteed.

 

[AlwaysGreen]

So youve got a bowler who thrived in wet conditions and gareth batty. England churning out the greats.

 

[JJ]

Underwood was a great bowler, WTF would you suggest otherwise. Bradman thrived in good conditions too, and sent others to bat when wickets were damp...

England in this, I see Reiffel was assisted from the field as a throw hit him in the back of the head

 

[AlwaysGreen]

Underwood was a great bowler, WTF would you suggest otherwise.

Because I can.

And because statistics don't always tell the whole story. A great bowler? Yes, on wet tracks. Otherwise a good bowler who made the best of his resources. A good bloke too by all accounts.
The best England spinner since Laker. Which considering the rest the great english production line has plodded out isnt much of an achievement or feat. Too bad Zimbabwe or south Africa don't produce decent spinners.

 

[Tommy Smith]

A bit harsh on Bill O'Reilly and Clarrie Grimmett to suggest that they were only great wet wicket bowlers.

Because your theory applies to everyone in the era of uncovered wickets.

Underwood is an all-time great. At home or away.

As for the others, Hedley Verity was a very good bowler. Graeme Swann averaged under 30 with 17 5-wicket hauls and was the best spin bowler in thr world for a time.

Not a massive production line. But then take out the Warne and MacGill era and Australia haven't had a good spinner since Benaud.

 

[AlwaysGreen]

Underwood is an all time great to English fans because you set the bar a lot lower than Australia. In Australia he would be a fine bowler. We reserve all time great status for the likes of Warne, Lillee, Mcgrath. Deadly is not in that category.

Stick your head out the window some time during summer Tommy and you'll see that in Australia it doesn't piss down rain every second day so the chances of bowlers in Australia bowling on wet tracks is far less than frigid England, thus making it harder to take wickets on a sticky ala Underwood . Plus our covers don't mysteriously blow off in the night to suit our all time great bowlers.

The thing is Tommy even if our production line isn't great in the spin bowling department we make up for it in the fast bowler and batsmen departments.

 

[Bazal]

Lol. Who has the better spin production line. Of all the silly discussions.....

Here's a challenge. Name 25 all time great spinners that deserve to be talked about in the same kind of discussions as McGrath, Lillee, Hadlee, the Windies quicks, Donald, Waqar, Wasim etc. Ever, worldwide. The simple fact is that spin bowling (especially wrist spin) is a ludicrously difficult art to perfect and no country in the world rattles high quality spinners off a production line.

A truly great spinner is a once in a generation or two bowler.

 

[Mr Bean]

I see Jennings is a product of England's South African colony.

Then he should be set in the test team for awhile. Lately a good pommy player is born & raised elsewhere.

 

[Iafeta]

Underwood is an all time great to English fans because you set the bar a lot lower than Australia. In Australia he would be a fine bowler. We reserve all time great status for the likes of Warne, Lillee, Mcgrath. Deadly is not in that category.

Stick your head out the window some time during summer Tommy and you'll see that in Australia it doesn't piss down rain every second day so the chances of bowlers in Australia bowling on wet tracks is far less than frigid England, thus making it harder to take wickets on a sticky ala Underwood . Plus our covers don't mysteriously blow off in the night to suit our all time great bowlers.

The thing is Tommy even if our production line isn't great in the spin bowling department we make up for it in the fast bowler and batsmen departments.

I know Derek Underwood is no Bob Holland, Trevor Hohns, Beau Casson or Peter Sleep, but to suggest he's a wet wicket bowler and not much else is garbage. Underwood was world class. No ifs no buts.

 

[AlwaysGreen]

I know Derek Underwood is no Bob Holland, Trevor Hohns, Beau Casson or Peter Sleep, but to suggest he's a wet wicket bowler and not much else is garbage. Underwood was world class. No ifs no buts.

I didnt suggest he was a wet wicket bowler i suggested his record is inflated by bowling on wet wickets where he got the nickname deadly. No ifs or buts.

And as a finger spinner he was certainly none of those wrist spinners you mentioned.

 

[JJ]

LOL

 

[Bazal]

And as a finger spinner he was certainly none of those wrist spinners you mentioned.

Heh. I see what you did there.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Underwood is an all time great to English fans because you set the bar a lot lower than Australia. In Australia he would be a fine bowler. We reserve all time great status for the likes of Warne, Lillee, Mcgrath. Deadly is not in that category.

Stick your head out the window some time during summer Tommy and you'll see that in Australia it doesn't piss down rain every second day so the chances of bowlers in Australia bowling on wet tracks is far less than frigid England, thus making it harder to take wickets on a sticky ala Underwood . Plus our covers don't mysteriously blow off in the night to suit our all time great bowlers.

The thing is Tommy even if our production line isn't great in the spin bowling department we make up for it in the fast bowler and batsmen departments.

Your production line of batsmen is pretty great, though no better than ours. Your openers are pathetic though

 

[TheParraboy]

Kholi 100*

one of the best bats of the modern era

 

[Tommy Smith]

He still has a way to go to cement his legacy in the only format that counts - test cricket.

But he's well on his way. A phenomenal talent.

 

[Bazal]

200 to Kohli. He's in some sort of form.

England have really f**ked this

 

[Hutty1986]

The indian no. 9 just tonned up to rub yet more salt into the wounds for the poms

 

[vvvrulz]

Mixed feelings as always, hats of to Kohli who is obviously class but it says a lot when their #9, with a first class average of 29, cracks an international ton.

But hey it's all fair game, India didn't miss a trick by scheduling this glut of home games.