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Cameron Smith Watch

Messages
736
Sir Cameron Smith was going to be criticized no matter what announcement he made and how he made it. It wasn't they way "they thought he should do". The Sydney media are saying he did it the day before the season started so everyone would be talking about him and not the season. I think he did it then and so low key, so there would be something else to talk about really quickly. By mid afternoon today, they will be talking about nothing else but tonight's game. Today's Sydney media: Storm win- Storm prove they can move on without Smith
 
Messages
15,436
A lot of people are saying Cameron Smith is the greatest sportsman in Australian history.

The numbers show that Cameron Smith is better in his sport than Bradman and Laver and Boy Charlton.

........

Walter Lindrum says hi. Lindrum held the World Professional Billiards Championship from 1933 until he retired in 1950. Lindrum was that good that the Billiards Control Council changed the rules because of him after he set a world record break of 4,137 in January 1932, which eclipsed his own previous world record of 3,262 which he set in December 1929. In fact in his early years, they used to refer to Don Bradman as the "Lindrum of cricket".

Cam Smith isn't fit to lick Lindrums shoes by comparison.
 
Messages
8,480
Wally
Beetson
Johns
Meninga
Sterling
Kenny

I’d even have Lazarus in the discussion and before you go off, look at his record and what he brought to every team he played for

And that just players who played from 1981!

he’s the best hooker I’ve ever seen but best player? No way

That’s your opinion.

All those players were / are greats of the game. But my opinion is Smith is superior than all of them.. admittedly I didn’t see Big Artie play much, only highlights.

Reasoning?

There’s plenty but the key things, comparing to others etc..
  • Longevity. No one played near as long as him. Kenny’s knees were shot in his later years. Sterling and Johns were forced into retirement.
  • He played in the forwards, Hooker. He’d handle the ball more than anyone, far more physical than the backs. Artie was a forward but not at hooker. Arguably Smith did the most work on the field than everyone else...
  • His teams just “won”. All had great players around them, absolutely. But his teams won more titles than any others by a country mile.
  • Game management. He dictated terms. People hate it, I think it’s insidiously brilliant. Only Wally would come close to him here. The rest are lightyears behind.
  • Smith was a goal kicker. Kenny, Sterling didn’t kick goals. Wally occasionally did.
Smith played more rep games than all those players. He played more origins (42) than Sterling n Johns combined (39). Kenny played 17... so he could be a combo with Johns or Sterling as well and still not get Smith..
  • Johns was even pushed into Hooker in SOO. Smith was never pushed out of position, and dominated the 9 jersey in all levels from when he first made it to when he retired from reps.
  • Sterling was superceded by Steve Mortimer in reps on many occasions. He “only” played 13 origins from 81-88.

Sterling n Kenny were outstanding players. But I’d have them at the bottom of your list (with Smith included in it)

Johns could do anything with a football, absolutely mind boggling. The most dangerous halfback I’ve ever seen by miles. But he only played “great” Origin football near the end of his career... his comeback etc. look at his earlier games n he was simply “ok”. He was in the team beaten 3-0 by Fattys nobodies... and also was shifted to Hooker.. not even the prime halfback at times.

Meninga was devastating, the most devastating player I’ve ever seen. He won titles, captained at all levels. The only thing that goes against him in comparing greats for mine is that, out at centre, he wasn’t nearly involved throughout games as the others.

Wally was brilliant in all facets of the game. Game management, Attack, defence (he was a brutal tackler), leadership, winning. He only came to the NSWRL when the Broncos turned up which was in the back end of his career so we didn’t see the best of him at club level.

The players above were all more “spectacular” than Cameron Smith. You could add another 50, 100, maybe 1000 players who were more spectacular than Smith. But Smith in my opinion is far and away the best...

His involvement, leadership, nous, game management, winning record... combining these he is absolutely second to none.

He made teams better, and far better than they otherwise could be. The Storm has had some other superstars through his time there but they would make the semis close to every season under his captaincy, with many unheralded players, journeyman and the like. Bellamy coach n Smith captain - guiding them around the park. I don’t think any of the other players mentioned could come close to getting as much out of the players he’s had at the Storm.

Anyway it’s my opinion. Doesn’t make my thought he’s the best player of all time a fact. But there are a few facts as to why I think he is.

My best in order

1 - Smith
2 - Wally
3 - Johns
4 - Meninga
5 - Lockyer
6 - Stuart
7 - Langer
8 - Daley
9 - Slater
10 - Inglis

Smith is nowhere near my favourite player (thats a tie between Blacklock n Thommo, with Cliff Lyons my favourite “non-dragon”). But he’s easily the best IMO.
 
Last edited:

taxidriver

Coach
Messages
14,593
That’s your opinion.

All those players were / are greats of the game. But my opinion is Smith is superior than all of them.. admittedly I didn’t see Big Artie play much, only highlights.

Reasoning?

There’s plenty but the key things, comparing to others etc..
  • Longevity. No one played near as long as him. Kenny’s knees were shot in his later years. Sterling and Johns were forced into retirement.
  • He played in the forwards, Hooker. He’d handle the ball more than anyone, far more physical than the backs. Artie was a forward but not at hooker. Arguably Smith did the most work on the field than everyone else...
  • His teams just “won”. All had great players around them, absolutely. But his teams won more titles than any others by a country mile.
  • Game management. He dictated terms. People hate it, I think it’s insidiously brilliant. Only Wally would come close to him here. The rest are lightyears behind.
  • Smith was a goal kicker. Kenny, Sterling didn’t kick goals. Wally occasionally did.
Smith played more rep games than all those players. He played more origins (42) than Sterling n Johns combined (39). Kenny played 17... so he could be a combo with Johns or Sterling as well and still not get Smith..
  • Johns was even pushed into Hooker in SOO. Smith was never pushed out of position, and dominated the 9 jersey in all levels from when he first made it to when he retired from reps.
  • Sterling was superceded by Steve Mortimer in reps on many occasions. He “only” played 13 origins from 81-88.

Sterling n Kenny were outstanding players. But I’d have them at the bottom of your list (with Smith included in it)

Johns could do anything with a football, absolutely mind boggling. The most dangerous halfback I’ve ever seen by miles. But he only played “great” Origin football near the end of his career... his comeback etc. look at his earlier games n he was simply “ok”. He was in the team beaten 3-0 by Fattys nobodies... and also was shifted to Hooker.. not even the prime halfback at times.

Meninga was devastating, the most devastating player I’ve ever seen. He won titles, captained at all levels. The only thing that goes against him in comparing greats for mine is that, out at centre, he wasn’t nearly involved throughout games as the others.

Wally was brilliant in all facets of the game. Game management, Attack, defence (he was a brutal tackler), leadership, winning. He only came to the NSWRL when the Broncos turned up which was in the back end of his career so we didn’t see the best of him at club level.

The players above were all more “spectacular” than Cameron Smith. You could add another 50, 100, maybe 1000 players who were more spectacular than Smith. But Smith in my opinion is far and away the best...

His involvement, leadership, nous, game management, winning record... combining these he is absolutely second to none.

He made teams better, and far better than they otherwise could be. The Storm has had some other superstars through his time there but they would make the semis close to every season under his captaincy, with many unheralded players, journeyman and the like. Bellamy coach n Smith captain - guiding them around the park. I don’t think any of the other players mentioned could come close to getting as much out of the players he’s had at the Storm.

Anyway it’s my opinion. Doesn’t make my thought he’s the best player of all time a fact. But there are a few facts as to why I think he is.

My best in order

1 - Smith
2 - Wally
3 - Johns
4 - Meninga
5 - Lockyer
6 - Stuart
7 - Langer
8 - Daley
9 - Slater
10 - Inglis

Smith is nowhere near my favourite player (thats a tie between Blacklock n Thommo, with Cliff Lyons my favourite “non-dragon”). But he’s easily the best IMO.
Undeniably he has a will to win that’s unparalleled

You also won’t get any pushback from me in regards to smith having the greatest career and I think that’s largely what you’ve described

Bradman played a fraction of the cricket of the modern guys , does that take from his claims?

look at what laver did in an interrupted career, should he then not be in conversations?

I could go on

longevity isn’t the only factor in greatness

The ability to enthrall your audience, capture their hearts, make them come to a contest just to watch you play. Smith is the bottom of the list on this criteria, I’ve never met a single person who has said they would go to a game just to watch smith play

with the will to win comes a will to bend the rules, is smith a cheat? I think he gets away with more than most and I also think he blurs the lines regularly when it comes to what’s best described as grubby behaviour

he’s in my top ten for sure, but he lacks the class and X factor to be number one for me
 
Messages
15,436
That’s your opinion.

All those players were / are greats of the game. But my opinion is Smith is superior than all of them.. admittedly I didn’t see Big Artie play much, only highlights.

Reasoning?

There’s plenty but the key things, comparing to others etc..
  • Longevity. No one played near as long as him. Kenny’s knees were shot in his later years. Sterling and Johns were forced into retirement.
  • He played in the forwards, Hooker. He’d handle the ball more than anyone, far more physical than the backs. Artie was a forward but not at hooker. Arguably Smith did the most work on the field than everyone else...
  • His teams just “won”. All had great players around them, absolutely. But his teams won more titles than any others by a country mile.
  • Game management. He dictated terms. People hate it, I think it’s insidiously brilliant. Only Wally would come close to him here. The rest are lightyears behind.
  • Smith was a goal kicker. Kenny, Sterling didn’t kick goals. Wally occasionally did.
Smith played more rep games than all those players. He played more origins (42) than Sterling n Johns combined (39). Kenny played 17... so he could be a combo with Johns or Sterling as well and still not get Smith..
  • Johns was even pushed into Hooker in SOO. Smith was never pushed out of position, and dominated the 9 jersey in all levels from when he first made it to when he retired from reps.
  • Sterling was superceded by Steve Mortimer in reps on many occasions. He “only” played 13 origins from 81-88.

Sterling n Kenny were outstanding players. But I’d have them at the bottom of your list (with Smith included in it)

Johns could do anything with a football, absolutely mind boggling. The most dangerous halfback I’ve ever seen by miles. But he only played “great” Origin football near the end of his career... his comeback etc. look at his earlier games n he was simply “ok”. He was in the team beaten 3-0 by Fattys nobodies... and also was shifted to Hooker.. not even the prime halfback at times.

Meninga was devastating, the most devastating player I’ve ever seen. He won titles, captained at all levels. The only thing that goes against him in comparing greats for mine is that, out at centre, he wasn’t nearly involved throughout games as the others.

Wally was brilliant in all facets of the game. Game management, Attack, defence (he was a brutal tackler), leadership, winning. He only came to the NSWRL when the Broncos turned up which was in the back end of his career so we didn’t see the best of him at club level.

The players above were all more “spectacular” than Cameron Smith. You could add another 50, 100, maybe 1000 players who were more spectacular than Smith. But Smith in my opinion is far and away the best...

His involvement, leadership, nous, game management, winning record... combining these he is absolutely second to none.

He made teams better, and far better than they otherwise could be. The Storm has had some other superstars through his time there but they would make the semis close to every season under his captaincy, with many unheralded players, journeyman and the like. Bellamy coach n Smith captain - guiding them around the park. I don’t think any of the other players mentioned could come close to getting as much out of the players he’s had at the Storm.

Anyway it’s my opinion. Doesn’t make my thought he’s the best player of all time a fact. But there are a few facts as to why I think he is.

My best in order

1 - Smith
2 - Wally
3 - Johns
4 - Meninga
5 - Lockyer
6 - Stuart
7 - Langer
8 - Daley
9 - Slater
10 - Inglis

Smith is nowhere near my favourite player (thats a tie between Blacklock n Thommo, with Cliff Lyons my favourite “non-dragon”). But he’s easily the best IMO.

Beetson was, in my opinion, head and shoulders above Cam. He played prop and second row in the days of contested scrums, and when there was no video review for foul play. Further he started his grade career in the Brisbane comp when it was a tough comp in 1964 before moving to Sydney in 1966 with the Balmain Tigers, then to the Roosters in 1972, then to the Eels in 1978, before returning to Redcliffe in 1981 for his final year.

Beetson had better passing skills than Cam, be it long or short, and for a big man had explosive acceleration over 20 metres. He could run the ball.

Smith is a very good player, but I'd take Artie any day over him.
 
Messages
8,480
Undeniably he has a will to win that’s unparalleled

You also won’t get any pushback from me in regards to smith having the greatest career and I think that’s largely what you’ve described

Bradman played a fraction of the cricket of the modern guys , does that take from his claims?

look at what laver did in an interrupted career, should he then not be in conversations?

I could go on

longevity isn’t the only factor in greatness

The ability to enthrall your audience, capture their hearts, make them come to a contest just to watch you play. Smith is the bottom of the list on this criteria, I’ve never met a single person who has said they would go to a game just to watch smith play

with the will to win comes a will to bend the rules, is smith a cheat? I think he gets away with more than most and I also think he blurs the lines regularly when it comes to what’s best described as grubby behaviour

he’s in my top ten for sure, but he lacks the class and X factor to be number one for me

It’s the beauty of topics like this, “who’s the best etc” - there’s many differing opinions but no “correct” answer.

Great pub chat, and reasons for forums like this. Same @Captain Apollo for above post.

If I could have one player who would have been a dragon for life, it’d have been Smith...

I remember detesting the Penguin when he played at Penrith. He was the king of niggle...

But when the Penguin signed with us, I absolutely loved him. He still was the niggle king, but he was in my jumper... That changes things.

So maybe Smith just wore the wrong clothes.
 
Messages
14,822
Smith is the most successful, but a lot of that success was down to circumstance. He played for a team that was propped up by Murdoch's money because it needed to be successful to make a dent in AwFuL heartland. His teammates were a once in a generation superstars who just so happened to play alongside him at club, state and national level. He was coached by the greatest coach of all time.

Would he have been as successful playing for the Warriors?
 
Messages
736
If Sir Cameron Smith had played for the Warriors, After 20 years, Rugby League would now be the No 1 sport in New Zealand and no one would be watching Rugby Union in that country ever again.

Thats how good he would have been

Little boys and girls in NZ would now all want to play Rugby League because of Sir Cameron.
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
69,551
Smith is the most successful, but a lot of that success was down to circumstance. He played for a team that was propped up by Murdoch's money because it needed to be successful to make a dent in AwFuL heartland. His teammates were a once in a generation superstars who just so happened to play alongside him at club, state and national level. He was coached by the greatest coach of all time.

Would he have been as successful playing for the Warriors?

you sound like all the F1 whingers who say Hamilton is only so good as he drives for Mercedes lol. Genuine legends create history,
 

taxidriver

Coach
Messages
14,593
That’s your opinion.

All those players were / are greats of the game. But my opinion is Smith is superior than all of them.. admittedly I didn’t see Big Artie play much, only highlights.

Reasoning?

There’s plenty but the key things, comparing to others etc..
  • Longevity. No one played near as long as him. Kenny’s knees were shot in his later years. Sterling and Johns were forced into retirement.
  • He played in the forwards, Hooker. He’d handle the ball more than anyone, far more physical than the backs. Artie was a forward but not at hooker. Arguably Smith did the most work on the field than everyone else...
  • His teams just “won”. All had great players around them, absolutely. But his teams won more titles than any others by a country mile.
  • Game management. He dictated terms. People hate it, I think it’s insidiously brilliant. Only Wally would come close to him here. The rest are lightyears behind.
  • Smith was a goal kicker. Kenny, Sterling didn’t kick goals. Wally occasionally did.
Smith played more rep games than all those players. He played more origins (42) than Sterling n Johns combined (39). Kenny played 17... so he could be a combo with Johns or Sterling as well and still not get Smith..
  • Johns was even pushed into Hooker in SOO. Smith was never pushed out of position, and dominated the 9 jersey in all levels from when he first made it to when he retired from reps.
  • Sterling was superceded by Steve Mortimer in reps on many occasions. He “only” played 13 origins from 81-88.

Sterling n Kenny were outstanding players. But I’d have them at the bottom of your list (with Smith included in it)

Johns could do anything with a football, absolutely mind boggling. The most dangerous halfback I’ve ever seen by miles. But he only played “great” Origin football near the end of his career... his comeback etc. look at his earlier games n he was simply “ok”. He was in the team beaten 3-0 by Fattys nobodies... and also was shifted to Hooker.. not even the prime halfback at times.

Meninga was devastating, the most devastating player I’ve ever seen. He won titles, captained at all levels. The only thing that goes against him in comparing greats for mine is that, out at centre, he wasn’t nearly involved throughout games as the others.

Wally was brilliant in all facets of the game. Game management, Attack, defence (he was a brutal tackler), leadership, winning. He only came to the NSWRL when the Broncos turned up which was in the back end of his career so we didn’t see the best of him at club level.

The players above were all more “spectacular” than Cameron Smith. You could add another 50, 100, maybe 1000 players who were more spectacular than Smith. But Smith in my opinion is far and away the best...

His involvement, leadership, nous, game management, winning record... combining these he is absolutely second to none.

He made teams better, and far better than they otherwise could be. The Storm has had some other superstars through his time there but they would make the semis close to every season under his captaincy, with many unheralded players, journeyman and the like. Bellamy coach n Smith captain - guiding them around the park. I don’t think any of the other players mentioned could come close to getting as much out of the players he’s had at the Storm.

Anyway it’s my opinion. Doesn’t make my thought he’s the best player of all time a fact. But there are a few facts as to why I think he is.

My best in order

1 - Smith
2 - Wally
3 - Johns
4 - Meninga
5 - Lockyer
6 - Stuart
7 - Langer
8 - Daley
9 - Slater
10 - Inglis

Smith is nowhere near my favourite player (thats a tie between Blacklock n Thommo, with Cliff Lyons my favourite “non-dragon”). But he’s easily the best IMO.

your list got me thinking about a side of the best I've seen


Slater

Grothe

Meninga

Rogers

Morris

Lewis

Johns

Lazarus

Smith

Beetson

Tallis

Price

Clyde

Bench

Fittler
Young
Webcke
Reddy
 

stryker

First Grade
Messages
5,277
Poor Cameron. Out of the whole incident, we should've felt sorry for the Storm, Qld and Australian captain. Imagine having to be him and have people hate on you for your actions on a football field when clearly, based on the entirety of your career to date, acting like a wanker or behaving in a manner contrary to the spirit of the game is totally not your go. He's definitely the one our hearts should go out to in that incident, not the guy who was injured in the tackle and would never play the game he loved again, let alone walk.

#riseforcameron
Lol your salt stinks
 

stryker

First Grade
Messages
5,277
That’s your opinion.

All those players were / are greats of the game. But my opinion is Smith is superior than all of them.. admittedly I didn’t see Big Artie play much, only highlights.

Reasoning?

There’s plenty but the key things, comparing to others etc..
  • Longevity. No one played near as long as him. Kenny’s knees were shot in his later years. Sterling and Johns were forced into retirement.
  • He played in the forwards, Hooker. He’d handle the ball more than anyone, far more physical than the backs. Artie was a forward but not at hooker. Arguably Smith did the most work on the field than everyone else...
  • His teams just “won”. All had great players around them, absolutely. But his teams won more titles than any others by a country mile.
  • Game management. He dictated terms. People hate it, I think it’s insidiously brilliant. Only Wally would come close to him here. The rest are lightyears behind.
  • Smith was a goal kicker. Kenny, Sterling didn’t kick goals. Wally occasionally did.
Smith played more rep games than all those players. He played more origins (42) than Sterling n Johns combined (39). Kenny played 17... so he could be a combo with Johns or Sterling as well and still not get Smith..
  • Johns was even pushed into Hooker in SOO. Smith was never pushed out of position, and dominated the 9 jersey in all levels from when he first made it to when he retired from reps.
  • Sterling was superceded by Steve Mortimer in reps on many occasions. He “only” played 13 origins from 81-88.

Sterling n Kenny were outstanding players. But I’d have them at the bottom of your list (with Smith included in it)

Johns could do anything with a football, absolutely mind boggling. The most dangerous halfback I’ve ever seen by miles. But he only played “great” Origin football near the end of his career... his comeback etc. look at his earlier games n he was simply “ok”. He was in the team beaten 3-0 by Fattys nobodies... and also was shifted to Hooker.. not even the prime halfback at times.

Meninga was devastating, the most devastating player I’ve ever seen. He won titles, captained at all levels. The only thing that goes against him in comparing greats for mine is that, out at centre, he wasn’t nearly involved throughout games as the others.

Wally was brilliant in all facets of the game. Game management, Attack, defence (he was a brutal tackler), leadership, winning. He only came to the NSWRL when the Broncos turned up which was in the back end of his career so we didn’t see the best of him at club level.

The players above were all more “spectacular” than Cameron Smith. You could add another 50, 100, maybe 1000 players who were more spectacular than Smith. But Smith in my opinion is far and away the best...

His involvement, leadership, nous, game management, winning record... combining these he is absolutely second to none.

He made teams better, and far better than they otherwise could be. The Storm has had some other superstars through his time there but they would make the semis close to every season under his captaincy, with many unheralded players, journeyman and the like. Bellamy coach n Smith captain - guiding them around the park. I don’t think any of the other players mentioned could come close to getting as much out of the players he’s had at the Storm.

Anyway it’s my opinion. Doesn’t make my thought he’s the best player of all time a fact. But there are a few facts as to why I think he is.

My best in order

1 - Smith
2 - Wally
3 - Johns
4 - Meninga
5 - Lockyer
6 - Stuart
7 - Langer
8 - Daley
9 - Slater
10 - Inglis

Smith is nowhere near my favourite player (thats a tie between Blacklock n Thommo, with Cliff Lyons my favourite “non-dragon”). But he’s easily the best IMO.
This is a terrific post, well reasoned and in my opinion accurate.
You may have too many New South Welshmen in your top 10 but those who made it are legends.
 

Reflector

Bench
Messages
2,538
you sound like all the F1 whingers who say Hamilton is only so good as he drives for Mercedes lol. Genuine legends create history,

Hamilton (like Smith) has only ever been part of good teams. Other players/ drivers of equal ability were part of average or even rubbish teams and still could show something special. That's why there's so many of those "whingers" you talk of in both F1 fan circles and here...
 

taste2taste

Juniors
Messages
2,472
I've got my life savings on both Cam and SBW making a shock come back mid season.

Neither have the bones to play a full season but both could go hard for 10 games....SBW is already on the Roosters pay roll as a 'coach' :D
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
69,551
In a very vanilla nrl now we have lost smith and Gallen who are going to be the heroes and villains? Be great to see more characters, love or hate them, come to the fore this year. The cheese and Munster are two obvious ones if they are allowed some freedom to express themselves. Anyone else looking likely to take up the “character” mantle?
 

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