Criticisms of the Arko and Quayle leadership

[Fein]

Hm. As expected it sounds like bitterness from rival clubs.
Rep selections tend to favour teams that make 3 GFs in a row, and whether Manly is scum for poaching is entirely irrelevant given as you said it was pre-cap, so has nothing to do with those in charge of the game.

Judiciary decisions and alleged refs influencing games are no different to claims that are frequently thrown around today in regards to teams that people think the NRL wants in the finals.

Where are the Broncos and Raiders fans that complain about the old dinosaurs of the ARL in every relevant thread?

Adam, people saw this with their own eyes.

By admission, you didn't.

 

[Fein]

LOL. Super League started because of favours to Manly. :lol: Nothing to do with Pay TV or the warfare that existed between the Broncos under Ribot and the ARL was it!

Very true - the rumblings came from News Ltd who actually had the idea of reduced comp, and presented it to the 16 ARL clubs in September 1994. It was not adopted - most say because Packer threatened legal action - but most likely because the ARL had just decided to go to a 20 team national comp, and News wanted them to kill 6 Sydney clubs, the Gold Coast and the yet-to-play-a-game Crushers. Had as much chance of being accepted as Charmayne Pavlivi winning Virgin of the Year.

Where was Packers money back then?

It was with Manly - that's where!!!

 

[big country]

as much as I detested S/L, the only good thing it did was stress Arko and Quayle out so much that they resigned - without a shadow of a doubt they were the most biased administrators the game has ever seen - heck would even make the apartheid system seem fair

 

[Fein]

Yep - Manly seemingly had favours - nothing compared to what Brisbane got in the following years. The juduciary penalties seemed light, some referee decisions seemed soft, plus they had a chequebook mentality. But that was pre SL - and without all the atrocities of later years to pale against, some thought them significant. Mainly the SL journos.

Funnily enough - By 1/1/95 Manly had won one comp (87) in 17 years - some favoritism. Even funnier is that Quayle had a Rooster pedigree - and they had won nothing in 20 years and were strugglers!

Fair call on what happened with Brisbane but that was to be expected given they were the first QLD team in the big time.

The politics at that time was the fiercest in the games history, NSW V QLD, concessions were made.

The fact that Manly couldn't convert their off field dominance into premierships can be summed up by the old adage - "a champion team will always beat a team of champions".

 

[Fein]

as much as I detested S/L, the only good thing it did was stress Arko and Quayle out so much that they resigned - without a shadow of a doubt they were the most biased administrators the game has ever seen - heck would even make the apartheid system seem fair

Correct.

FMD, I can't believe the pelicans who post on this subject without any f**king idea.

They either weren't born or are Manly f**kwits.

 

[Green Machine]

Where are the Broncos and Raiders fans that complain about the old dinosaurs of the ARL in every relevant thread?

Manly did it well in the Arko days. You always got a good laugh how a Manly player or a future Manly player would make the rep teams. In 1994, Ben Elias was the NSW rep player of the year. When they picked the Kangaroo Tour, somehow Jim Serdaris was picked ahead of Elias. It came out later the Jimbo had signed a contract to play for Manly in 1996. Spud Carroll thought he was a shoe in for the 1994 Tour and blew a head gasket when Dean Pay got in the team. Phil Daley was always an interesting selection for NSW and Australia.

 

[Fein]

Manly did it well in the Arko days. You always got a good laugh how a Manly player or a future Manly player would make the rep teams. In 1994, Ben Elias was the NSW rep player of the year. When they picked the Kangaroo Tour, somehow Jim Serdaris was picked ahead of Elias. It came out later the Jimbo had signed a contract to play for Manly in 1996. Spud Carroll thought he was a shoe in for the 1994 Tour and blew a head gasket when Dean Pay got in the team. Phil Daley was always an interesting selection for NSW and Australia.

Great to see the memories of some people haven't faded. ;-)

 

[Green Machine]

Great to see the memories of some people haven't faded. ;-)

They were always good for a laugh. I was always surprised how Manly stayed under the salary cap in 1990. They poached a brand new frontrow with Marty Bella from Norths and Ian Roberts from Souths. They were both Internationals. On top of that, Graham Lowe brought Tony Iro with him from Wigan. They purchase All Black Matthew Ridge. They was an article in the Sun Herald a while back where Matthew Ridge was quoted saying the star players at Manly had bogus jobs with sponsors, where each morning they would walk in one door and out the other in quick time,

 

[skeepe]

Manly did it well in the Arko days. You always got a good laugh how a Manly player or a future Manly player would make the rep teams. In 1994, Ben Elias was the NSW rep player of the year. When they picked the Kangaroo Tour, somehow Jim Serdaris was picked ahead of Elias. It came out later the Jimbo had signed a contract to play for Manly in 1996. Spud Carroll thought he was a shoe in for the 1994 Tour and blew a head gasket when Dean Pay got in the team. Phil Daley was always an interesting selection for NSW and Australia.

Ah yes the 94 Kangaroo tour. I remember the absolute shock when the team was named and David Furner and Jason Croker were omitted on favour of Manly players. I'm not talking shock by Canberra fans, I mean everyone involved in the game. Well, almost everyone.

 

[bartman]

Given they took the game to arguably the highest point in its history, based on public perception and national spread over the country, I am struggling to grasp why they attract such criticism (usually from fans of SL clubs).

So, why is it?

Because supporters of the scum Sydney clubs that ratted on the official competition and chased the money to be pawns in a payTV corporate war have to justify their own actions of the time somehow... :sarcasm:

 

[Perth Red]

probably main critiscm is that they A) expanded in an unsustainable way B) sold out the rights for media coverage at a knock down rate and C) gave the Pay TV rights away at a time when they should have been the treasure chest that RL needed to position itself as undisputed No1 in the country.

 

[adamkungl]

Unfortunately we never got the chance to see whether the expansion was unsustainable. Sure we might have suffered some very mediocre games for a few years, but if the clubs survived - Auckland and Cowboys did, though were lucky to, and Perth looked the goods until the SL war erupted, we would not be in the position we are now, aiming for a comp which was very very similar to the one we had 15 years ago.

 

[bartman]

The ARL expansions certainly seemed sustainable to everyone... until the greed of SL ripped the code apart, and bumped up the cost of operating the code by inflating player salaries to "attract them" to jump ship to join the "wonderful vision".

It'll take us 20 years to catch up the damage, and that's if we can ever get back to where we were in 95 given the ground that other codes made on us, once the dumb SL clubs/players were all used as pawns by SL to start up pay TV in Australia.

 

[Perth Red]

The ARL expansions certainly seemed sustainable to everyone... until the greed of SL ripped the code apart, and bumped up the cost of operating the code by inflating player salaries to "attract them" to jump ship to join the "wonderful vision".

It'll take us 20 years to catch up the damage, and that's if we can ever get back to where we were in 95 given the ground that other codes made on us, once the dumb SL clubs/players were all used as pawns by SL to start up pay TV in Australia.

Having recently talked to an ex member of the WARL and initial Western Reds board it was done on a wing and a prayer! Whilst the model of the club was perfect, strong jnr development, good community linking etc the finances were tough from day one and the weight around the neck of the Reds having to pay their own travel and accomodation costs and all visiting teams as well, at a time when interstate flights to Perth were seriously expensive, meant the club was struggling from day one. The decision to sign with SL was due to the club being near financial death and SL offered 5 times the money that the ARL was offering and they were given a guarantee of survival (ha!). When the peace treaty was signed News ltd saw the value of a Melbourne team for its pay tv audiences and the Reds management (who were mostly News Ltd employees by this stage anyway) were told they were moving to Melbourne and that was that.

It was great evening of RL history from the guy and the first time I've had chance to hear the "inside" story of the Western reds.

 

[bartman]

The decision to sign with SL was due to the club being near financial death and SL offered 5 times the money that the ARL was offering and they were given a guarantee of survival (ha!). When the peace treaty was signed News ltd saw the value of a Melbourne team for its pay tv audiences and the Reds management (who were mostly News Ltd employees by this stage anyway) were told they were moving to Melbourne and that was that.

At the time SL proponents were justifying their divide and conquer apprach by criticising the pace of ARL expansion, saying it was too slow!

This reads pretty much the way it was for the Sydney clubs who sided with $uper League... it was always about the promise of more money, nothing else. Club by club and player by player - what's in it for me...

Expansion is hard at the best of times, but if it wasn't for Murdoch's News Ltd and PayTV lurking in the wings, (noted even prior to 1995) the code might have had more money spare to move forward effectively - rather than being white anted from within and having to pinch every penny to fight back.

 

[Perth Red]

At the time SL proponents were justifying their divide and conquer apprach by criticising the pace of ARL expansion, saying it was too slow!

This reads pretty much the way it was for the Sydney clubs who sided with $uper League... it was always about the promise of more money, nothing else. Club by club and player by player - what's in it for me...

Expansion is hard at the best of times, but if it wasn't for Murdoch's News Ltd and PayTV lurking in the wings, (noted even prior to 1995) the code might have had more money spare to move forward effectively - rather than being white anted from within and having to pinch every penny to fight back.

You'll get no argument from me! It's just a great shame the ARL couldn't have worked with News Ltd and got a massive deal for the Pay Tv rights back then. if they had been able to, one can only imagine where RL would be at now in Australia.

 

[1 Eyed TEZZA]

I dont think that Arko and Quales supposed bias towards certain clubs had anything to do with the SL war, it was entirely about PayTV.

Arko and Quales expansion ideas were good, and I honestly think they thought they would get a great PayTV deal and be able to sustain all 20 clubs, but it never happened. Cant remember if it was because the ARL was threatened by a lawsuit by Packer or not, cant remember.

It was Murdoch, Packers, the clubs and players greed/fear that started the SL war and the old stubborn heads of the NSWRL and the QRL that made it harder.

In the end, the idea and execution of SL was not correct, nor was the ARL's.

With all this talk of an indepentant commission, I cant help but think we basically would of already had one with the ARL if we just disbanded the NSWRL and the QRL

Sstate loyalties did and continue to hold the game back, but it ironically put us on the map with State of Origin. Funny how things work out like that.

 

[Canard]

Having recently talked to an ex member of the WARL and initial Western Reds board it was done on a wing and a prayer! Whilst the model of the club was perfect, strong jnr development, good community linking etc the finances were tough from day one and the weight around the neck of the Reds having to pay their own travel and accomodation costs and all visiting teams as well, at a time when interstate flights to Perth were seriously expensive, meant the club was struggling from day one. The decision to sign with SL was due to the club being near financial death and SL offered 5 times the money that the ARL was offering and they were given a guarantee of survival (ha!). When the peace treaty was signed News ltd saw the value of a Melbourne team for its pay tv audiences and the Reds management (who were mostly News Ltd employees by this stage anyway) were told they were moving to Melbourne and that was that.

It was great evening of RL history from the guy and the first time I've had chance to hear the "inside" story of the Western reds.

Red.

Similiar situation with the Cowboys, they were gone, the ARL provided zero support other than granting initial admittance.

If it wasn't for News Money, the Cowboys wouldn't exist today, they also funded stadium upgrades and provided Townsville with the World 9's comp, ARL cronies would rather crawl naked over broken glass than do something like that.

Looking back, and it pains me to say it, but the Cowboys weren't ready to be admitted in 95, the ARL should have waited another few years. 2 Teams (Auckland obviously and either Perth or the Crushers, should have been the intial expansion.)

 

[hillbillyjazzer1954]

How old are you kid - you have NFI.

you said Manly were the platform, for the launch of super League......i think you are the one with NFI

re rep selections....asi said Manly were one of the premier teams of the70s, 80s and 90s, of course our players were going to be selected
what did you expect the selectors to do.....not pick players from the premier teams

 

[jasonstevenswedgie]

Super League war was started by two guys with way to much money and even bigger egos. Didnt news approach the arl and say this is what we thinking/doing, then big kerrie got his knickers in a knot and cracked. He must have a short memory because it is exactly what he did to cricket some 20 years earlier. Packer didnt want to loose the goose that laid the golden egg