David Gallop: State of the Game address

[CAS]

Sorry to but in fellas, but been a regular viewer of these Forums and been in England, i am interested in the lay out of Sydney in its Areas. What i mean by that is, i here Western Sydney always mentioned as the real Hot bed for League, although it obviously strong all over. Why is that? are these the more traditional or working class suburbs? Was it also True that the Rahs Rahs delibrately avoided staging any of their World Cup Games in the western Suburbs due to this?

It appears from an outsiders view looking in, that the AFL and ARU are strong on Promotion and often Aggresive in the War of words, but League still holds peoples affections more, without David Gallop getting his face in the papers every week exactly banging the Drum for our Game.

I think the overall Article was very Positive, and we shouldnt distract from the fact that the Game is so Strong. Would either the AFL or ARU have recovered from such a beating as our Game took in the Superleague War years? Kinda makes you think what the Game could REALLY acheive if it was more Aggressive in its thinking and Ambitions.

Overall though, its something to celebrate, not be Negative about.

 

[League Freak™]

I personally believe Rugby League is at its strongest between Blacktown and Penrith. These are working class areas.

As you go towards the East Coast your close to EVERYTHING and Rugby League biggest opposition in Sydney isnt other sports, its the fact that there is so much you can do in Sydney.


Ontop of that, the Rugby Union and AFL team does ALOT more promotion then Rugby League and they target people that just want to turn up to an event.

Now to be fair, I believe these "Event" people should be targeted by the NRL as well because they are the ones that turn good crowds into sellouts.

However I think you'd find alot of people that end up at AFL and Union games souldnt be able to name more then five players from the home side.

 

[taipan]

I think we're getting to a point where a lack of facilities will start to hold back crowd figures.

Obviously a few teams play out of MASSIVE stadiums...but places like Shark Park, Penrith, Olympic Park.....even Parramatta Stadium are either getting to capacity or the stadiums are so poor that people are turned off of going to the game.


Once the Storm get their new stadium it will be GREAT for them. I do worry about the Sharks and Panthers though. Having seen the upgrades that are supposed to be happening at Penrith....its not much to write home about.

Dont worry too much about the Sharks,their new develoment plan has been given the OK by the local council,and has to go to the state Govt for zoning approval,after that a public showing for discussion.once this gets the go ahead they wont have to rely on poker machines and will have a better stadium set than they now have.

 

[littleduck]

Ontop of that, the Rugby Union and AFL team does ALOT more promotion then Rugby League and they target people that just want to turn up to an event.

Now to be fair, I believe these "Event" people should be targeted by the NRL as well because they are the ones that turn good crowds into sellouts.

Very hard to attract theatre goers to suburban venues in great numbers.

 

[littleduck]

Littleduck,
Crowds are not a problem for the AFL in Sydney.

A permanent team without a supporter base at Telstra Stadium and crowds might become a problem...

The Swans home ground attendance this season is 31,516. The whole NRL’s average so far this season is 16,486.

Good observation.

Maybe you should write to the AFL and tell them, they have it all wrong.

Where are they going wrong? They are committed to 16 AFL teams and 10 Victorian teams.

 

[Green Machine]

I find it difficult to criticise them because the game is booming, but there are obvious areas for improvement.

I don’t want to be seen as criticising the NRL, but I am offering the point that we have improved considerably, but we are still a long way behind the AFL as far as off field administration goes,

You don't think that's the point?

The AFL have pumped tens of millions into Sydney, for what return?

15,000 spectators per week and poor ratings.

Should we go down the same track in a city that is more hostile to League than Sydney has ever been to AFL?

I applaud that we're giving it a shot, but I'm not confident.

Rugby League in Melbourne defies logic. The Storm somehow have 10,000 dedicated, hardcore supporters to a sport that plays in an antiquated stadium, gets no FTA coverage of their games, next to nothing in print media, scarce radio exposure and is subjected to a hate campaign from the Rugby League self interest group in Sydney. On top of this, they have no salary cap exemptions or allowances for relocation of players. The Swans have both of these plus draft concessions. Even Kerry Packer’s own Melbourne TV station’s executives say that Rugby League won’t rate on Melbourne TV. But what happens when quality Rugby League like Grand Final’s or State of Origins are force on these executives to be shown either “live” or at reasonable time, they rate and someone win the timeslot.

From what I have been told from the cross code- cross dresser’s, that go to the Swans, they tell me Australian Rules is better to watch at the ground. That might explain why Rugby League does rate on Melbourne TV when quality games are screened. From the people I encounter through business in Sydney that follow either Union or Rules, most of them seem to follow both. That may explain why they have a home ground average this season of 31,516.

Should Rugby League go down the same track as being in the same Australia markets as the AFL and ARU? With the exception of Tasmania, I say yes. It is a lot better that 5 years ago of being criticised as being a provincial sport in NSW and Queensland and not have legitimate international competition, which lead to Australian players defecting to Union.

I think the expectations for Sydney were fairly low to being with. The hops may have been high, but not the expectations.

That they've since dived again doesn't seem to phase anyone probably because the money has already been coughed up.


The problem for the AFL is the next round of TV contract action. If it's 7 and 10 only, AFL will take a bath.

It will be quite interesting what the AFL get next time around. When they sold VFL/AFL Park, they gave a lot of cash to their clubs. Part of selling that ground was moving to the Telstra Dome. I’m sure the Dome which Channel 7 controls will somehow to mentioned in their talks. One thing that is strange is Channel 9 are still talking to the AFL. I hope they are not making Channel 7 pay the full amount. If they get $150m, it will be business as usual for the AFL and we will be $50m behind them. Maybe less money and eventual ownership of the Telstra Dome will be a better deal for them.

That's the point, the AFL have been coming and coming hard for 25 years for not much. They'll keep coming but Sydney has been saturated with the stuff for decades and it isn't working. If anything it's started a negative reaction.


I've heard figures larger than 100k for Super Saturday games, but I don't have them for Foxtel.


100,000 people is nothing. Fact is that 100k probably wouldn't even cover Victorian expats for the past 10 years.

The thing I don’t like is 100k Sydneysiders are given an opportunity of watching AFL with no opposition on FTA from Rugby League. The end result is if 120k is watching Rugby League on Pay, 100k are watching AFL on FTA. A mate of mine lives in North West NSW in a Rugby League town. The same saturated coverage of the AFL we get I Sydney, he gets in his Rugby League town. The problem with PAY TV is that minority of Australians have it. A majority of Australians in NSW and Queensland are being given an opportunity to watch the Swans and the Wallabies on a Saturday night. When you ask people at work on Monday (who don’t have Pay TV) what did you do on Saturday night, the last thing as Rugby League fan is to hear them say is, I watched the Swans or the Wallabies, and I have heard people say it, not a lot, but a few,

2BL's AFL and Johnny Gibbs' Union audiences could fit comfortably in my shed.

When the radio rights are opened up again, they'll call League.

It is an interesting point, that 2UE has called Super 12’s matches this season, using a former Rugby League International. I wonder if their audience is so poor, why do they keep doing it. The official League Station says NRL does not rate at 7.30pm on a Saturday night. This same station has abused its exclusive rights and told Rugby League fans what rates and what does not rate. From a game that had multiple station coverage in the 70’s, 80’s and early 90’s, we now have a situation where the game coverage has been out rated by two old blokes doing an impersonation of two old Sheila’s that go by the name of the two Murray’s. I wonder if all the fans will come back.

Two years ago I wrote a letter abusing the NRL over the exclusive radio deal with the lack of Rugby League coverage. John Brady got in touch with me and told me in so many words that Ray Hadley knows better and was winning the ratings with vaudeville show instead of Rugby League show. John defended 2GB like the old days like when John Quayle endorsed Channel 9 reducing the Sunday Night highly rating replay to 47 minutes, which ended up going down the ratings gurgler. Now the actual Rugby League product has been beaten by the two Murray’s!

I am a hardcore Rugby League fan and I don’t watch the Thursday night Footy show all the time, anymore. When I do watch it now, I find it quite good. We went through this phase where Channel 9 told us what we should watch in a Footy Show and Talking Football was something they thought didn’t rate. So, a few months ago they run out of ideas and ratings are going down the gurgler, so they come up with a new idea? Let’s talk more Football!

Once you take something away from people they do as a religion like Sunday Night 6.30pm Replay’s or Saturday Afternoon Rugby League, some people will find something else to do with their lives and not all of them will return when it is given back to them. My neighbour likes Rugby League and listens to Grandstand on the ABC of weekend. I said to him, how could he listen to the AFL coverage and says it’s better than listening to Hadley.

Another thing that disturbs me is the Sydney media is full of embedded AFL and ARU fans. I see the Rebecca Wilson is on Drive Radio show now. It says on the Vega website. “Rebecca describes herself as an amateur boxer, a very amateur runner and a football Mum who spends her weekends watching her young sons play for the Paddo Tigers”. I thought the Footy team in Paddo was called the Colts. Rebecca Wilson has the lead page on Australia’s highest selling paper. Her column is often used to leak information from News Ltd or the NRL. It seems strange that the paper that uses Rugby League as one of its major strategies to sell its paper would put a person in a leading position who is more dedicated to other football codes over Rugby League. But it gets worse. Russell Barwick is a Swans man through and through. He also likes the Wallabies. His Saturday morning sports show wins that rating timeslot on the back of Rugby League and Ray Warren appearing on the show. They seem to spend a lot of time cross promoting their Swans coverage. But probably the strangest thing the NRL have done is to go with Russell Barwick as the host of NRL Deluxe.

Well, I agree with most of that but I don't believe they're as aggressive as you seem to think or they would have made the move to the Gold Coast before now. They have to move soon or they'll be presiding over the death of a couple of Melbourne Clubs.

And they should be absolutely petrified of Western Sydney. The money they've sunk into the Swans fjust to get a foot in the door will seem like a pittance compared to what they'll have to outlay to get even slight interest from Western Sydney.

The funny thing is I have a feeling that Western Sydney and the Gold Coast may both get AFL teams at the same time. My bet is the Western Bulldogs to Western Sydney and one of the other ailing teams to the Gold Coast.

Please don’t take it as I am totally unhappy with NRL administration. Things are a lot better than they were 5 years ago, but we are still a long way behind the AFL in off field activities, even in our heartland