Early predictions for season 2017!

[umina panther]

We need a few hard runners and less playmakers. Just let Moylan and Cleary run the show with Bryce chipping in with something freakish here and there

 

[maple_69]

I know everyone says that last spot would be wasted on a forward given the minutes Cartwright, Yeo and Merrin (and JFH, Peachey etc) play. I'm not sure i agree though. Certainly it's wasted if they get 10 mins. Those guys are great, justify big minutes, can handle it and will keep rolling down the field. I do think there is an argument for using that position as a gear change. That could definitely take the form of a Luke, Katoa, Rein or May, but I think Taumalolo at the Cowboys has shown the value of having a guy that can come on and just turn the tides of the forward battle with huge runs. Aku could maybe do that. Kikau i really hope can fulfill potential. Leota maybe. Either way hopefully the spot is used as needed week by week to match up our opponents. Rather than play a guy for 0-10 mins.

 

[soc123_au]

I know everyone says that last spot would be wasted on a forward given the minutes Cartwright, Yeo and Merrin (and JFH, Peachey etc) play. I'm not sure i agree though. Certainly it's wasted if they get 10 mins. Those guys are great, justify big minutes, can handle it and will keep rolling down the field. I do think there is an argument for using that position as a gear change. That could definitely take the form of a Luke, Katoa, Rein or May, but I think Taumalolo at the Cowboys has shown the value of having a guy that can come on and just turn the tides of the forward battle with huge runs. Aku could maybe do that. Kikau i really hope can fulfill potential. Leota maybe. Either way hopefully the spot is used as needed week by week to match up our opponents. Rather than play a guy for 0-10 mins.

So much this. A momentum changer on the bench is my preferred option.

 

[franklin2323]

I know everyone says that last spot would be wasted on a forward given the minutes Cartwright, Yeo and Merrin (and JFH, Peachey etc) play. I'm not sure i agree though. Certainly it's wasted if they get 10 mins. Those guys are great, justify big minutes, can handle it and will keep rolling down the field. I do think there is an argument for using that position as a gear change. That could definitely take the form of a Luke, Katoa, Rein or May, but I think Taumalolo at the Cowboys has shown the value of having a guy that can come on and just turn the tides of the forward battle with huge runs. Aku could maybe do that. Kikau i really hope can fulfill potential. Leota maybe. Either way hopefully the spot is used as needed week by week to match up our opponents. Rather than play a guy for 0-10 mins.

Coaches have their own style. I remember John Lang would change both props after 20mins regardless of the game situation. Griffin on the other hand usually only changes the props and a backrower by halftime.

I agree with you I would love an interchange hooker or someone for the back end of each half. That isn't the coaches style so hence I plicked the setup to suit that

 

[betcats]

Bryce was doing a lot of the leg work of a running forward while playing 5/8th our last few games, it was like having an extra forward on the field which took pressure off the rest of the pack. TMM or whoever plays 5/8th is not going to average 100+ running metres a game and without Mansour for most of the season there is a bunch of metres we need to find so there is that to consider also. Im expecting a rise in production in terms of metres from DWZ, he was already becoming a bit of a Mansour-lite last year with some of his powerful runs.

I think it will mostly come down to the form of the players pushing for those bench spots as well as who we are going against, we are going to want more muscle going against teams like Canberra and Melbourne.

 

[Panther_Daz]

How many minutes does everyone see our starting pack playing?

Tamou - 50 minutes
Latu - 40 minutes
Yeo - 80 minutes
Cartwright - 80 minutes
Merrin - 70 minutes

That is my guess at least for the colder part of the season. March may be a different story.

Wallace will play 80 minutes if Rein isn't on the bench.

RCG to rotate with Latu and play the other 40 minutes approximately (give or take a few minutes)

That leaves 40 minutes between 3 other bench forwards.

Our most recent match was last years Semi Final against the Raiders. Our backs all played 80 minutes so the 480 minutes for our forwards was split like this

Latu - 56
Wallace - 80
Matagi - 25
Yeo - 63
Fisher-Harris - 80
Merrin - 73

Akauola - 28
Latimore - 19
Grevsmuhl - 56
Leota - 0

 

[Pomoz]

We need a few hard runners and less playmakers. Just let Moylan and Cleary run the show with Bryce chipping in with something freakish here and there

In 2003 we had Girdler, Gower and Campbell as our playmakers. But we also had players who could use the ball when required, Priddis and Sattler spring to mind. The 2003 forward pack was brutal too with Clinton, Lang and Ross just driving forward all game long. Our current team hasn't shown the forward grunt of 2003 yet, but has more skill across the park.

We also lack a genuine speedster like Wesser. Pace is our one area of genuine weakness with both our wingers strong, but slow (for wingers anyway). I still can't make my mind up if Blake is fast yet. He scores by busting tackles and the defence is usually turning around to chase him. I haven't seem him in the the clear in a foot race. Like most big guys he also needs a few metres to wind up and doesn't have the blistering acceleration of a Wesser.

Can Tamou spur our props to a new level and give us proper grunt?
Can TMM be a genuine first class 5/8th?

As for Mansour making tough metres every game, maybe we just have to get the forwards to do more and change our tactics. I can't see who else in our backs is going to give us anything like the go forward that Mansour did. Hiku, maybe? He is big enough, but does he have the engine and toughness? MWZ looks chunky and robust but is unproven. Edwards is built like a tax accountant and will get smashed doing a Mansour type role.

Who would be a coach eh?

 

[maple_69]

Interesting thinking about the min

How many minutes does everyone see our starting pack playing?

Tamou - 50 minutes
Latu - 40 minutes
Yeo - 80 minutes
Cartwright - 80 minutes
Merrin - 70 minutes

That is my guess at least for the colder part of the season. March may be a different story.

Wallace will play 80 minutes if Rein isn't on the bench.

RCG to rotate with Latu and play the other 40 minutes approximately (give or take a few minutes)

That leaves 40 minutes between 3 other bench forwards.

Our most recent match was last years Semi Final against the Raiders. Our backs all played 80 minutes so the 480 minutes for our forwards was split like this

Latu - 56
Wallace - 80
Matagi - 25
Yeo - 63
Fisher-Harris - 80
Merrin - 73

Akauola - 28
Latimore - 19
Grevsmuhl - 56
Leota - 0

Really interesting. As i mentioned above I totally agree our starting pack can play most of the game at a really high level. To that end we need to look at our bench as complimentary. Our starting side is our default and a damn strong one. They should have us in a strong position before anyone starts getting tired. Rugby League is a crazy game though and there are 15 sides with different skill sets and dynamics.

How Griffin manages our bench will define our season because the starting pack is basically a no brainer. What skills do we need to have available to move games in our direction at those crucial interchange a phases between minutes 25-30 and 50-70.

We need guys that can come on and maintain momentum when we are on top. RCG, JFH are 100% those guys with Browne and Mckendry lesser but solid options. Leota and Clarke the smokeys. We need guys that can make a difference when we are on our heels. Again JFH could play this role as well, Aku, J Cartwright and Kikau could all play this role. We need guys that can just win a game when it's on the line. Peachey, Luke, Katoa and May are all guys I think could do that in different ways. We need insurance against injury which again is Peachey and May. Lastly we need guys that can change the tempo and structure of the team when things just aren't clicking or humming. Rein is an option to this end, as I hope Katoa, Luke and May could be.

Hook showed he is no scrub tactically last year. How well he reads the game and manages the skills we have on the park throughout the 80 mins will be fascinating because he has every card you'd want in your hand.

My bench of Peachey isn't in the centres.
14. JFH 15. RCG 16. Peachey 17. Aku until Kikau or Cartwright forces himself in. Rein to take 17 regularly until either Katoa/Luke can force themselves into that role. May definitely takes a spot on the bench if Peachey is in the centers for mine.

I don't see Mckendry, Browne, Leota or Clarke cracking onto the bench unless we have injuries or anyone in that core 8-15 is playing below expectation. Solid or very promising but I think too similar and not at the same level as our core pack right now.

Two random thoughts.

I didn't mention CHN anywhere as I'm not sure where he fits but I really like the look of him and I'm looking forward to seeing him come along.

I wonder if Hook would consider starting Cartwright in the halves with TMM on the bench as that 17 in some games. Carty would play as an extra forward with a bit of a license for a wide foray if he sees something which would be his second row role anyway. Even the best sides are going to struggle to get on top in the first 20 against a pack with Cartwright, Tamou, Latu, Merrin, JFH and Yeo coming at them. Martin can then come on at 25 mins for the rest of the game and add some real zip and skill. He's going to be the cream on top of our attacking structure as it is so I don't think it would be too disruptive to our structure if we used this strategy sometimes.

Edit: Other thing I thought of. We need guys that can come on and out the sword through sides when we are on top. Too often we switch off when we are well in control. Peachey, Kikau are my favourites here.

 

[martielang]

Probably easy to say now given he was picked in the 9's team of the year, but Leota looked supremely fit on the weekend. Seems to put on some serious muscle and definitely improved his agility and footwork. I think he's got a really good chance of getting himself a bench spot.

 

[Kilkenny]

In 2003 we had Girdler, Gower and Campbell as our playmakers. But we also had players who could use the ball when required, Priddis and Sattler spring to mind. The 2003 forward pack was brutal too with Clinton, Lang and Ross just driving forward all game long. Our current team hasn't shown the forward grunt of 2003 yet, but has more skill across the park.

We also lack a genuine speedster like Wesser. Pace is our one area of genuine weakness with both our wingers strong, but slow (for wingers anyway). I still can't make my mind up if Blake is fast yet. He scores by busting tackles and the defence is usually turning around to chase him. I haven't seem him in the the clear in a foot race. Like most big guys he also needs a few metres to wind up and doesn't have the blistering acceleration of a Wesser.

Can Tamou spur our props to a new level and give us proper grunt?
Can TMM be a genuine first class 5/8th?

As for Mansour making tough metres every game, maybe we just have to get the forwards to do more and change our tactics. I can't see who else in our backs is going to give us anything like the go forward that Mansour did. Hiku, maybe? He is big enough, but does he have the engine and toughness? MWZ looks chunky and robust but is unproven. Edwards is built like a tax accountant and will get smashed doing a Mansour type role.

Who would be a coach eh?

Waqa Blake is the fastest player in the club. Straight from our el supremo Phil Gould as I asked him on his twitter feed a couple of weeks back. I assume over the length of the field 100 metre distance.

 

[betcats]

Blake is very fast, he isn't up there with the Roberts and Addo Carrs but he would be in the next tier for sure. His size means it takes a few more steps to get going than most but when he gets going he is very fast. Watch the tigers game highlights last year, He got the ball from Dallin with a metre on JAC(both already running at full pace) and JAC didn't even bother chasing(gave up a bit early imo but anyway) this was from about 40 out. JAC is very likely the fastest or second fastest guy in the league and certainly faster than Waqa.

 

[franklin2323]

How many minutes does everyone see our starting pack playing?

Tamou - 50 minutes
Latu - 40 minutes
Yeo - 80 minutes
Cartwright - 80 minutes
Merrin - 70 minutes

That is my guess at least for the colder part of the season. March may be a different story.

Wallace will play 80 minutes if Rein isn't on the bench.

RCG to rotate with Latu and play the other 40 minutes approximately (give or take a few minutes)

That leaves 40 minutes between 3 other bench forwards.

spot on JFH should get most of that 40 mins. This is why I think Peachey has to start at centre

 

[Kilkenny]

Now I am not blaming JFH for our loss to the Raiders in our semi final last season but we were at the game and he was clearly fatigued. He gave away two penalties for supposed high shots the latter part of the game just after we had got ourselves back into the contest and within a converted try of taking the lead. At the critical stage of the game we were clearly on top and a chance of pulling off the win.

We were down in this game 18-0 but clawed our way back into the contest. At the end of the day the use of our bench by our coach was appalling particularly given JFH was out on his feet. Akauola, Latimore and Grevsmuhl all got very limited game time and Moses Loeta got NO game time at all. I feel sure he would like his time again in respect of managing his resources in this game.

A clearly fatigued player gives away two high shot penalties, Raiders subsequently dominated possession in the last ten minutes and well they sealed the deal. We had no ball in that crucial last 10 minutes.

The point I am trying to make, is not dwell on what could have been last season, rather we must have faith in all four players we select off the bench. A fully fit raring to go person of the bench is surely going to offer more, or at least something, as opposed to a player who has already played his heart out for 60-70 minutes.

For mine I believe we are best served by selecting four big boppers of the bench as opposed to the utility, alternative hooker or someone who can play in the outside backs.

For this to work however the coach needs to show faith in those players he has selected in the numbers 14-17.

 

[umina panther]

In my opinion a utility is pretty useless unless they are a NRL quality second rower, especially in a side with Moylan, Carty, Peach and Yeo

 

[Copperhead]

Unless Whare & Hiku display really strong form in the trials I can't see a spot for either in the top 17 for round 1. They need to earn their spots on form.

Sounds like they understand that too.
http://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl...k=f472b4889ba5e31f9b44fe99c4ca46a1-1486537155

 

[Kilkenny]

I am not an NRL coach that goes without saying but I simply don't see why we have to play our first choice back rowers for the full 80 minutes if you have quality alternatives on the bench. Akauola, Leota, and a host of others are more than capable of adding value to our on field exploits for at least 30 minutes.

We have so much depth and talent it is criminal in my opinion to play a game of NRL footy and at the end of 80 minutes you have someone on the bench who did not make it onto the field. You cannot tell me and fit and raring to go Moses Leota (as an example) would not add more value on the field at the 50-60 minute mark of a game than a fatigued Isaah Yeo, JFH or whoever. I simply don't get the misuse of the interchange bench.

I don't care what anyone say's it our misuse of our interchange against the Raiders last season cost us a chance of progressing further and it was reflective of the whole season albeit we had the Englishman on our interchange bench for the back half of the season.

I don't see why any of our forwards, including Trent Merrin, Byrce Cartwright or whoever have to play the full 80 minutes given we have so much quality and depth of the bench.

 

[betcats]

No one has too play 80. I think Yeo will be the only who does that consistently in our pack.

 

[Kilkenny]

No one has too play 80. I think Yeo will be the only who does that consistently in our pack.

At the same time why does or should he have too? Our bench will be stacked with quality, particularly at the start of the season, before any potential injuries kick in, so yes he can play 80 minutes but why does he have too. I don't get it, I simply don't get it.

 

[betcats]

At the same time why does or should he have too? Our bench will be stacked with quality, particularly at the start of the season, before any potential injuries kick in, so yes he can play 80 minutes but why does he have too. I don't get it, I simply don't get it.

He doesn't have too but having a forward or two play 80 increases the flexibility we have with the bench.

 

[Kilkenny]

He doesn't have too but having a forward or two play 80 increases the flexibility we have with the bench.

I do understand where your coming from, but for mine I look at it in the alternative.

I think the on field performance is enhanced not by certain players playing the full 80 minutes but rather utilising your bench capabilities to the fullest to get the maximum results on over the course of the full 80 minutes.

If you have a bench rotation with fringe players, not quite NRL quality I could fully except Yeo, Cartwright, JFH, etc playing the full 80 minutes.

We are in such a fortunate position where we potentially have half a dozen or more players who can fill the 14-17 positions and do a great job.

All I am saying is have faith, select them and use them. We will benefit overall in my opinion.