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England to revive mid-season Test in 2020?

Burns

First Grade
Messages
5,528
https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/1032...merge-as-possible-2020-opponents-for-england/

New Zealand and Samoa seem to be the preferred opponents for England, but Cook Islands and Fiji are in the mix.
The real story here is Tonga v NZ being moved to potentially post season.

But then, who would Tonga play mid year? Would have to be Fiji? To get the Oceanic Cup games underway?

If they played against Samoa for instance, there could be no Pool A fixture, and they would need to play all games at end of season.
 

yakstorm

Bench
Messages
4,119
The real story here is Tonga v NZ being moved to potentially post season.

But then, who would Tonga play mid year? Would have to be Fiji? To get the Oceanic Cup games underway?

If they played against Samoa for instance, there could be no Pool A fixture, and they would need to play all games at end of season.

With each nation only needing to play 2x Tests to meet their commitments, it's not that big of ask putting it post season.

In some ways it may feel more like a tournament then.

For me, if England plays Samoa and SBW plays for Samoa, I'd love to know where they would host that game. It's the type of match that could draw a massive crowd on its own.
 

Burns

First Grade
Messages
5,528
With each nation only needing to play 2x Tests to meet their commitments, it's not that big of ask putting it post season.

In some ways it may feel more like a tournament then.

For me, if England plays Samoa and SBW plays for Samoa, I'd love to know where they would host that game. It's the type of match that could draw a massive crowd on its own.
I also look forward to the match being played at Campbelltown.
 

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,955
With each nation only needing to play 2x Tests to meet their commitments, it's not that big of ask putting it post season.

In some ways it may feel more like a tournament then.

For me, if England plays Samoa and SBW plays for Samoa, I'd love to know where they would host that game. It's the type of match that could draw a massive crowd on its own.

Mid-year events should be standalone tests, or if our mid-year international calendar expands to 3 eventually, standalone tournaments with a different vibe to the end-of-year cups.

Mid-year:
All as standalone tests with potential to expand to best of 3. Played annually, unlike Oceania Cup.
Rankings as of Jan 1 determine who is in Cup and Shield levels
It would actually make sense to play these as double headers, unlike the recent mess in Auckland.

(NZ)
Polynesia Cup: NZ v Tonga
Polynesia Shield: Samoa v Cook Islands

(PNG or Fiji)
Melanesia Cup: Fiji v PNG
Melanesia Shield: Vanuatu v Solomon Islands

Then post-season have the Oceania Cup and European Cup, or whatever happens in the off-year, start fresh.
 

Springs09

Juniors
Messages
1,903
so how many Australians went to that Wollongong game? Or was it packed with Samoans from Campbeltown?
I will guarantee nobody is going to think a euro cup is a meaningful competition. Let’s not kid ourselves about that. If kiwis aren’t going to get excited about playing GB I don’t know what hope there is for a euro cup.

You asked how many would attend Australia v Samoa. If we are going by the cynical 'Pacific Islands are filled with Aussies and Kiwis' attitude then they were all Australians. Can't have it both ways.

France has had good crowds in the Euro Cup without England before.
You can be cynical and negative all you want but I don't see how that will solve anything. What else should we do? Just let the tier 2 Euro nations wallow away playing pissant little tournaments in front of 200 people until the World Cup rolls around?

England has got crowds of 20k+ to attend games v Ireland and France where everyone knew England would win comfortably. People can get interested if it's treated as a Tier 1 tournament and has full-strength sides. It doesn't need to be World Cup sized crowds or venues either. Between 2009 and 2015 France were getting great crowds for any internationals but we've bollocksed that up by not giving them any games lately.

For example using my draw from another thread:
A - England, Wales, Ireland
B - France, Scotland, Italy

England v Wales - St Helens
Italy v France - Padua
Ireland v Scotland - Dublin

England v Italy - Warrington
Wales v Ireland - Wrexham
France v Scotland - Albi

Ireland v England - Dublin
France v Wales - Perpignan
Scotland v Italy - Edinburgh

Final - 1st A v 1st B - Headingley

It also leaves plenty of time for England to play a 3-test series v NZ or Australia afterwards.
Or we can just not bother to do anything and have England play NZ one year, Australia one year and have a pointless GB Tour the other year and tell the other Euro nations sorry but you're too shit to play in anything other than a World Cup and have all their players piss off like what's happened to France.
 

Springs09

Juniors
Messages
1,903
The real story here is Tonga v NZ being moved to potentially post season.

But then, who would Tonga play mid year? Would have to be Fiji? To get the Oceanic Cup games underway?

If they played against Samoa for instance, there could be no Pool A fixture, and they would need to play all games at end of season.

Better option anyway. Have all Oceania Cup games post-season so at least there looks to be some continuity. At the moment while there is only 1 mid-season rep weekend I'd stick with yearly Tonga v Samoa, Fiji v PNG tests.
 

Pommy

Coach
Messages
14,657
You asked how many would attend Australia v Samoa. If we are going by the cynical 'Pacific Islands are filled with Aussies and Kiwis' attitude then they were all Australians. Can't have it both ways.

France has had good crowds in the Euro Cup without England before.
You can be cynical and negative all you want but I don't see how that will solve anything. What else should we do? Just let the tier 2 Euro nations wallow away playing pissant little tournaments in front of 200 people until the World Cup rolls around?

England has got crowds of 20k+ to attend games v Ireland and France where everyone knew England would win comfortably. People can get interested if it's treated as a Tier 1 tournament and has full-strength sides. It doesn't need to be World Cup sized crowds or venues either. Between 2009 and 2015 France were getting great crowds for any internationals but we've bollocksed that up by not giving them any games lately.

For example using my draw from another thread:
A - England, Wales, Ireland
B - France, Scotland, Italy

England v Wales - St Helens
Italy v France - Padua
Ireland v Scotland - Dublin

England v Italy - Warrington
Wales v Ireland - Wrexham
France v Scotland - Albi

Ireland v England - Dublin
France v Wales - Perpignan
Scotland v Italy - Edinburgh

Final - 1st A v 1st B - Headingley

It also leaves plenty of time for England to play a 3-test series v NZ or Australia afterwards.
Or we can just not bother to do anything and have England play NZ one year, Australia one year and have a pointless GB Tour the other year and tell the other Euro nations sorry but you're too shit to play in anything other than a World Cup and have all their players piss off like what's happened to France.

that’s not what I asked at all
“If Australia were playing Samoa in Sydney tomorrow how many Australian fans would attend?”
Do you see the difference? I don’t dispute that a lot of the Samoan fans would actually be Australians at all.
I’m not being so much negative as realistic someone, maybe you claimed it would have an origin feel to it, that’s just not the case at all.
I’m not against a euro WIP I just think people should have realistic expectations of the situation.
 

paulmac

Juniors
Messages
775
You asked how many would attend Australia v Samoa. If we are going by the cynical 'Pacific Islands are filled with Aussies and Kiwis' attitude then they were all Australians. Can't have it both ways.

France has had good crowds in the Euro Cup without England before.
You can be cynical and negative all you want but I don't see how that will solve anything. What else should we do? Just let the tier 2 Euro nations wallow away playing pissant little tournaments in front of 200 people until the World Cup rolls around?

England has got crowds of 20k+ to attend games v Ireland and France where everyone knew England would win comfortably. People can get interested if it's treated as a Tier 1 tournament and has full-strength sides. It doesn't need to be World Cup sized crowds or venues either. Between 2009 and 2015 France were getting great crowds for any internationals but we've bollocksed that up by not giving them any games lately.

For example using my draw from another thread:
A - England, Wales, Ireland
B - France, Scotland, Italy

England v Wales - St Helens
Italy v France - Padua
Ireland v Scotland - Dublin

England v Italy - Warrington
Wales v Ireland - Wrexham
France v Scotland - Albi

Ireland v England - Dublin
France v Wales - Perpignan
Scotland v Italy - Edinburgh

Final - 1st A v 1st B - Headingley

It also leaves plenty of time for England to play a 3-test series v NZ or Australia afterwards.
Or we can just not bother to do anything and have England play NZ one year, Australia one year and have a pointless GB Tour the other year and tell the other Euro nations sorry but you're too shit to play in anything other than a World Cup and have all their players piss off like what's happened to France.
Some out of the box thinking, why not put England in the same group as Italy & the Azurri could ‘host’ England at Leichhardt Oval mid season. As the majority of players in this match are Australian based it would cut back on costs. Could also play Malta v Greece in the European Championship B as a curtain raiser.
 
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