Explain - No Manchester Super League ?

[Jankuloski]

Ok.. so I was chatting with a guy that's starting in our faculty club and we were watching a recording of a game in order for them to see what RL looks like. And the big screen comes on with an ad for GF at Old Trafford. So he asks which club plays in Manchester. I say none and he asks why not.

And this got me thinking - why doesn't Manchester have a SL franchise?

All I could reply is that people in cities tend to watch football (soccer) and generally rugby doesn't do good in england in towns. They have Man U which is arguably the greatest football club in the world. Also, Salford is quite near as are some RL clubs.

But then again - SL has a team in London that gets meager 3k ppl per game. Manchester could probably top that only on people who've moved and are too lazy to drive back to support their old team. And the potential for growth would be massive.

I'm not saying it can be done. I'm just saying that if it can't - I don't quite get why?

 

[TheAirlieBirds]

There is a Super League club based in Manchester. Salford. They have over 100 years worth of history, and one of the oldest Rugby League grounds (again, over 100 years, and this is their last season in it).


In Manchester, though, there is a lot of competition with other teams. Rugby Union is big in England, and Sale Sharks are based in Stockport, which is a different district of Greater Manchester.
You then have the dominance of football, with both Manchester United and Manchester City around (especially Manchester United, which is also based in Salford).

 

[Evil Homer]

Salford is part of Manchester to all intents and purposes, although it is technically a 'city' in its own right. They represent Manchester in Super League, people have even talked about changing Salford's name to 'Manchester RL' or something in the past but there doesn't seem to be much point.

There isn't too much of a market in Manchester itself for some reason, possibly due to the world's two biggest football clubs playing there, plus a host of other good level sporting clubs as Airlie says. There are a couple of Super League players from Manchester and plenty of RL in the vicinity so it's not really a seen as a priority expansion area, there have never been any attempts to get another team there because Salford aren't massively successful. Manchester is also a bit of a strange place though in that what's classed as the actual city isn't much bigger in population terms than the city of Salford. The largeness of the place is because there are several large towns/cities that are all next to each other and form Greater Manchester, Salford being one, and they are generally referred to as just 'Manchester' by outsiders. So moving into the acutal city of Manchester itself wouldn't have any real benefits.

 

[southwalesrabbitoh]

Which is why I have advocated on another forum the establishment of a Lancashire Lynx team, to play at the new stadium in Salford. And another Lancashire team in the West, to play at the new Saints stadium, with the less attractive matches at the Halliwell Jones. Quality matches not quantity.

Ideally I'd have 10 in SL, them being :-

Crusaders, Harlequins, C.Dragons, Wigan, Leeds, L.Lynx, Lancashire Pride, Yorkshire Ravens, Y.Kings, Toulouse Olympique

 

[Evil Homer]

blah blah blah some absolute rubbish

Go away.

 

[sean11evo11]

Which is why I have advocated on another forum the establishment of a Lancashire Lynx team, to play at the new stadium in Salford. And another Lancashire team in the West, to play at the new Saints stadium, with the less attractive matches at the Halliwell Jones. Quality matches not quantity.

Ideally I'd have 10 in SL, them being :-

Crusaders, Harlequins, C.Dragons, Wigan, Leeds, L.Lynx, Lancashire Pride, Yorkshire Ravens, Y.Kings, Toulouse Olympique

Thats the worst idea for Super League I have seen in a while. Why do Wigan (a tiny town) get there own team?

 

[Evil Homer]

Thats the worst idea for Super League I have seen in a while. Why do Wigan (a tiny town) get there own team?

If you are not familiar with southwalesrabbitoh, he is a troll who likes to post the most bizarre and stupid ideas he can think of (I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and assuming he's a troll, the guy has serious issues if not).

Although Wigan isn't a 'tiny town'. The population is over 300,000.

 

[Wellsy4HullFC]

There is a Super League club based in Manchester. Salford. They have over 100 years worth of history, and one of the oldest Rugby League grounds (again, over 100 years, and this is their last season in it).


In Manchester, though, there is a lot of competition with other teams. Rugby Union is big in England, and Sale Sharks are based in Stockport, which is a different district of Greater Manchester.
You then have the dominance of football, with both Manchester United and Manchester City around (especially Manchester United, which is also based in Salford).

Salford is not in Manchester. It is a city in the county of Greater Manchester, just like Manchester is also a city in the county of Greater Manchester. Greater Manchester and Manchester are not the same place.

Manchester United do not play in Salford either. They play in Trafford (a separate borough to both the City of Manchester and the City of Salford). I'm guessing the point being that they don't play in Manchester itself, which is fair (most of their fans don't come from Manchester either ). There was talk of renaming Salford City Reds to "Manchester Reds", but that was met with large resistance from Salford fans who want to keep their identity. I personally think in the grand scheme of things that "Salford" is a bit short sighted, but to be fair, the Salford City Council are building the new stadium, and it is due to be called the "City of Salford Stadium", so it would be a bit of a kick in the face to them should they change their name to Manchester! (Mind you, they could always play off the Manchester United method and call it "New Salford" and that keeping their roots in the stadium...)

Just for other little bits of information about Manchester/Greater Manchester:

Wigan (were Wigan Warriors and Leigh Centurions play) and Stockport (were Sale Sharks RU play) are also boroughs in Greater Manchester, as are Rochdale (Hornets) and Oldham (RLFC). Swinton are based in Salford and are actually playing in the same ground this season. So that's 6 clubs in the Greater Manchester area. However, none in the City of Manchester itself.

As for the size... City of Manchester is over twice the size of the City of Salford in population (460k vs 220k). Wigan is about 300k. There are about 2.6m living in Greater Manchester.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Manchester

Any other confusions will be explained better on there, especially the map of the 10 boroughs of Greater Manchester.

 

[RL1908]

Ironically, while Salford RL is placed into the shade by Man Utd all over the globe, Manchester United adopted the red shirt and the "red devils" tag from/after Salford.

The Salford rugby club (later RL) adopted red in 1883/84 - Man Utd changed to red when they adopted the Manchester Utd FC name (replacing Newton Heath FC name) in 1902.

Salford RL were given the "red devils" name by the French in 1934 http://reds.originalreddevils.com/history/les-diablo-rouges/ and apparently copied from Salford by Man Utd in the 1960s. http://www.soccerjerseyexpert.com/manchesterunitedjerseyhistory.html

 

[Goldfields_Titans]

Which is why I have advocated on another forum the establishment of a Lancashire Lynx team, to play at the new stadium in Salford. And another Lancashire team in the West, to play at the new Saints stadium, with the less attractive matches at the Halliwell Jones. Quality matches not quantity.

Ideally I'd have 10 in SL, them being :-

Crusaders, Harlequins, C.Dragons, Wigan, Leeds, L.Lynx, Lancashire Pride, Yorkshire Ravens, Y.Kings, Toulouse Olympique

Will never happen Nathan.

 

[Goldfields_Titans]

That's the Wigan metro area that includes several smaller towns and suburbs with 'greenery' in between lol

 

[Goldfields_Titans]

Salford is not in Manchester. It is a city in the county of Greater Manchester, just like Manchester is also a city in the county of Greater Manchester. Greater Manchester and Manchester are not the same place.

Manchester United do not play in Salford either. They play in Trafford (a separate borough to both the City of Manchester and the City of Salford). I'm guessing the point being that they don't play in Manchester itself, which is fair (most of their fans don't come from Manchester either ). There was talk of renaming Salford City Reds to "Manchester Reds", but that was met with large resistance from Salford fans who want to keep their identity. I personally think in the grand scheme of things that "Salford" is a bit short sighted, but to be fair, the Salford City Council are building the new stadium, and it is due to be called the "City of Salford Stadium", so it would be a bit of a kick in the face to them should they change their name to Manchester! (Mind you, they could always play off the Manchester United method and call it "New Salford" and that keeping their roots in the stadium...)

Just for other little bits of information about Manchester/Greater Manchester:

Wigan (were Wigan Warriors and Leigh Centurions play) and Stockport (were Sale Sharks RU play) are also boroughs in Greater Manchester, as are Rochdale (Hornets) and Oldham (RLFC). Swinton are based in Salford and are actually playing in the same ground this season. So that's 6 clubs in the Greater Manchester area. However, none in the City of Manchester itself.

As for the size... City of Manchester is over twice the size of the City of Salford in population (460k vs 220k). Wigan is about 300k. There are about 2.6m living in Greater Manchester.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Manchester

Any other confusions will be explained better on there, especially the map of the 10 boroughs of Greater Manchester.

I was brought up in Salford and were always referred to Manchester centre as "town" so in essence Manchester/Salford are inseparable twins and on a map are joined well and truly along the entire hip.

Salford is historically the area along Chapel St to the river. TGhe rest were independent suburbs which had their own power and town halls etc..

Also to add, Manchester's CBD is so big that it dwarfs all the town centres of Bolton, Stockport, Rochdale etc. We always see the city as being the centre to all 10 boroughs.

 

[Mike_Jets]

While the troll in this thread was fairly useless it did get me thinking a little...
If money were no option what would you want the ESL to look like?
For me a 22 team league - play everyone once and then 6 (yes 6!) weekend events - Cardiff, Edinburgh, Paris, Yorkshire, Lancashire and London.
10 make the play-offs, but very much build in favour of top 4.
All 14 current clubs plus, Widnes, Leigh, Barrow, Halifax, Toulouse, Paris, Edinburgh, South Wales.

 

[Evil Homer]

While the troll in this thread was fairly useless it did get me thinking a little...
If money were no option what would you want the ESL to look like?
For me a 22 team league - play everyone once and then 6 (yes 6!) weekend events - Cardiff, Edinburgh, Paris, Yorkshire, Lancashire and London.
10 make the play-offs, but very much build in favour of top 4.
All 14 current clubs plus, Widnes, Leigh, Barrow, Halifax, Toulouse, Paris, Edinburgh, South Wales.

Super League would be like it is now. You can't just make up teams or promote ones that aren't good enough.

 

[ParraEelsNRL]

Wow, you learn something new everyday, I thought Wigan had about 90k

 

[biggestbroncosfan]

this is the teams i'd like to see in super league hopefully one day (2050?)...
Glasgow
Edinburgh
Newcastle/Gateshead
Leeds
Wigan
Hull
Manchester
Liverpool
Dublin
St Helens
Limerick
Nottingham
Bristol
Birmingham
Leicester
London
Bath
South Wales (Scorpions)
North Wales (Crusaders)
Norwich

France will have their own competition by then which is why i haven't added teams such as Toulouse, Catalans or Paris

 

[Wilson1]

this is the teams i'd like to see in super league hopefully one day (2050?)...
Glasgow
Edinburgh
Newcastle/Gateshead
Leeds
Wigan
Hull
Manchester
Liverpool
Dublin
St Helens
Limerick
Nottingham
Bristol
Birmingham
Leicester
London
Bath
South Wales (Scorpions)
North Wales (Crusaders)
Norwich

France will have their own competition by then which is why i haven't added teams such as Toulouse, Catalans or Paris

I would hate a league like that. Too many teams overall and far too few teams that actually have a tradition of league.

 

[bowes]

In the early days of the Northern Union there were lots of little Manchester clubs in the Lancashire 2nd competition (and for a year in the Lancashire 3rd competition before that folded). However, the big Manchester club stayed RU and bit by bit the small clubs folded (most of the clubs in the 2nd comp were from Manchester or Barrow so lots of travelling) til there were none less.

However, in those days there was a big club called Broughton Rangers who were technically in what's now Salford but are a mile from Manchester city centre so to all intents and purposes they were the Manchester club. In the 40s they moved actually to Manchester to become Belle Vue Rangers but folded in the 50s.

Nowadays there's just one open age Manchester club called Mancunians and they only started in 2009 and are amateur

 

[Goldfields_Titans]

In the early days of the Northern Union there were lots of little Manchester clubs in the Lancashire 2nd competition (and for a year in the Lancashire 3rd competition before that folded). However, the big Manchester club stayed RU and bit by bit the small clubs folded (most of the clubs in the 2nd comp were from Manchester or Barrow so lots of travelling) til there were none less.

However, in those days there was a big club called Broughton Rangers who were technically in what's now Salford but are a mile from Manchester city centre so to all intents and purposes they were the Manchester club. In the 40s they moved actually to Manchester to become Belle Vue Rangers but folded in the 50s.

Nowadays there's just one open age Manchester club called Mancunians and they only started in 2009 and are amateur

I wish they'd have never folded. There is a club called New Broughton Rangers isn't there who play in Lower Broughton vicinity?

 

[Goldfields_Titans]

I would hate a league like that. Too many teams overall and far too few teams that actually have a tradition of league.

I think that's the ideal of how Rupert Murdoch would like to see the SL so he can sell more dishes.