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f*ck off phil gould

Messages
12,174
NRL bosses should have known

PHIL GOULD

April 25, 2010


Why didn't the NRL see this earlier? When did David Gallop first know that Melbourne Storm were over the salary cap?
If it's true he didn't discover there was a problem until only recently, why didn't he suspect a problem much sooner than this? Blind Freddy could see the Storm's playing roster was looking very different to many other NRL teams.
With all those representative players on their books (as it turns out the plural form of this word was right on the money - nice one, Gus!), the Melbourne club was still able to find a home for quality players such as Clint Newton, Brett Finch, Luke MacDougall and Todd Lowrie when they became available. If these signings didn't raise the red flag then what about their interest in Willie Mason during last off-season? Surely someone was asking the Storm the big question.
My God - if the Cronulla Sharks, New Zealand Warriors and Canberra Raiders were at the limits of their salary caps, how come the Storm's cap was so flexible?
Someone needed to tap them on the shoulder and tell them it was all becoming a bit too obvious. But no, we let it continue until fixing the rorts now becomes a calamity of nuclear proportions.
Mind you, the precedents had been set. Go back through some of the champion teams since the introduction of salary cap laws and see if you can fit their player lists under the salary cap limits of the day. The public aren't idiots. We know the rules.
That's what is so stupid about all this. Ask the fans if they think all other NRL teams are under the salary cap or if they think others are fudging, even to a small extent. It's like cheating on your tax returns.
But again it raises the question: what good are salary cap laws that cannot detect five years of cheating until an unwitting staff member hands you a second set of books, or a disgruntled ex-employee blows the whistle on the evil deeds of past years?
Remember, for the past five seasons, the NRL's salary cap audit process had given the Melbourne club the big tick to say all spending was within acceptable limits.
This is the very same auditing process that failed to uncover the massive Canterbury Bulldog rorts years earlier.
Our system at the moment virtually forces clubs to cheat if they want to remain competitive, yet cannot detect major cheating until it is too late.
Not for one moment am I questioning the integrity of the auditors. However, in all businesses around the world, the process is only as good as the information given to the auditor.
I'm just saying that for our game, we can't afford a system that produces such tumultuous repercussions and penalties when the truth finally comes to the surface.
The stripping of premierships, $1.6 million fines, loss of major sponsors and disillusionment of fans, the irreparable damage to the reputations and brands of the Melbourne Storm - all could've been prevented had this matter been nipped in the bud years ago and had our salary cap laws been more responsive to the needs of the modern era.
What did we expect them to do?
Years ago the NRL decided to put a team in Melbourne. Their charter was to sell the game of rugby league to a city steeped in the traditions of VFL and now AFL football.
They existed, survived in a city that didn't want them, playing out of a stadium that was from a forgotten era, witnessed by media that would put their results on the same page as junior AFL.
If we delivered this city an average team, with average coaches, achieving average results, the rugby league mission down south wouldn't have reached first base. No Storm player should be minutely tainted in this latest tragedy. They played the game like no other team ever.
They joined the Storm adventure as youngsters, hopefuls, misfits, could-be, would-be, has-been players; but they became a team that you had to beat because they would never give up.
They became champions; not once, not twice, but thrice. They became world club champions on two occasions, if you please, effectively promoting the Melbourne Storm brand to all corners of the sporting globe.
Their record over the past 12 years is better than any other club or franchise in the NRL during that time.
In more recent years, the Melbourne Storm fans fell in love with their latest crop of stars such as Billy Slater, Cameron Smith, Cooper Cronk, Greg Inglis, Israel Folau, Ryan Hoffman, Dallas Johnson, Adam Blair, Jeremy Smith, Brett White, Steve Turner, Anthony Quinn, Jeff Lima; all of whom came to the Storm as virtual nobodies and graduated to the status of premiership winners and representative-class footballers.
As the list of team and personal achievements grew, so too did the value of all these players.
What did we expect the club to do? Let it all go?
Did we expect them to let these ridiculous salary cap laws gradually pull the team apart so they could be held back with the average teams in the league?
The Melbourne franchise was pushing for a new stadium. They were really starting to make some inroads in the marketplace. They had to keep them together. The temptation to cheat was more than too great; it was virtually imperative.
In my opinion, the Storm developed these players - they should be entitled to keep them. They just should've been prevented from signing players from other clubs until their wage bill came down or their position on the premiership table warranted bolstering of the ranks.
Let's be honest here. If the Melbourne Storm didn't cheat the salary cap, Greg Inglis would've been lost to rugby or the English Super League. Brett Finch would definitely be in England, and probably with several others as well.
You see, the current salary cap laws frown upon teams as good as the Melbourne Storm. Where our game's leaders should be striving for systems that replicate the strength of the Storm in all rugby league clubs, the salary cap system suggests all teams should look more like the Cronulla Sharks.
Well, I doubt the Cronulla Sharks would ever sell rugby league to the Melbourne public.
We have to let them compete.
David Gallop's insistence that the Melbourne Storm has to play the remainder of this season without the possibility of accruing premiership points shows how little he and his advisers understand the physical and emotional demands of professional football.
It is naivety in the extreme. In fact, I bet none of the people who contributed to this ridiculous decision have ever strapped a boot on in their lives.
To expect these players to commit themselves to the physical stress of the NRL competition with no incentive of advancement is like asking someone to keep banging their head against a brick wall until the pain goes away.
Such a ruling also creates enormous problems.
We now know this Melbourne Storm has been illegally assembled.
The four teams beaten by the Storm so far this season have cause for protest that they were cheated of valuable competition points that could mean the difference between a minor premiership or a finish in the top four or top eight.
If the NRL allows the Storm to keep playing each week with this illegal roster, then any team beaten by the Storm between now and September is entitled to protest they were cheated out of valuable competition points that could make the difference to their season.
We can't say the playing field is level; because under the NRL draw some teams have to play the Storm twice in the premiership rounds and others only once.
So there are only two possible solutions here.
The NRL either sacks the Storm for season 2010 and we declare their matches as a forfeit or a bye. If we do this we may as well fold the Storm immediately and send them packing to Brisbane, because the Storm would be as dead as disco.
Otherwise, we take immediate measures to get the Storm under the salary cap and start them back in the competition on zero premiership points and see how good they are.
If the NRL and News Ltd are serious about having a team in Melbourne for the future then this is the only sensible option.
Take the current Storm roster and the player values the Storm are paying, and tell them to select $4.1 million worth of bodies. That now becomes their player list for the rest of the season and if they get injuries then they'll just have to call on Toyota Cup rookies like all the other teams in the NRL.
The players who miss out should be fully paid immediately and told they can head back to second-tier competitions or find themselves a start with other NRL clubs (if they can fit them in the salary cap, naturally).
The Players' Association would have to support such a move but provided the players in question received their full monetary entitlements, in the best interests of the game, I can't see where they would have a problem.
Gallop keeps telling us what can't be done. At the moment our game is urgent need of some can-do management.
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/nrl-bosses-should-have-known-20100424-tkef.html

I am getting a bit sick and tired of you endlessly bending over backwards to find a solution for melbourne's problems phil how about we worry about the other 15 teams who didn't cheat first and melbourne can go to bloody hell as far as im concerned they made their bed let them lie in it
 

Swiftstylez

Bench
Messages
2,858
Whilst I often wonder how he is still employed, given that all he does is attack the game in the media and whilst commentating, he does kind of have a point. If anyone can get away with cheating and the only way to find out is a whistle-blower, then it makes you wonder if anyone else is cheating.

After calming down, I think that if the players honestly didn't know about the extent of the cheating (which I think they did, as anyone and their dog could see they have too many good players), then it is unfair on the fans that the Storm should not accrue any points for the rest of the season. They should have been given the option to get immediately under the cap, and I think that having the option of withdrawing from the competition for this year would not have necessarily been a bad thing. There is nothing to play for this year, so they could have had the year off and the suspense for next year would see the team survive.

Every time the Storm play a game, win or lose, they will be the laughing stock of opposition fans. This has the potential to get ugly.

If the players HONESTLY didn't know, they didn't make their bed and lie in it. If it was the Eels, and our management was found out to be corrupt, would you be pointing the finger at Hindmarsh, Cayless and Burt? I think not.
 

Parra

Referee
Messages
24,900
The NRL found out via a whistle-blower.

The public found out via a betting sting.

The NRL were forced to react (over-react?) swiftly.

The whole thing is a balls-up
 
Messages
285
Jesus, Gould talks feces. I don't remember him ever raising an issue over Melbourne's salary cap. He was constantly praising their administration. However, now that these revelations have come to light, Gould claims that everyone knew except David Gallop. Phil Gould is a muppet with an agenda against the NRL.
 

Swiftstylez

Bench
Messages
2,858
Jesus, Gould talks feces. I don't remember him ever raising an issue over Melbourne's salary cap. He was constantly praising their administration. However, now that these revelations have come to light, Gould claims that everyone knew except David Gallop. Phil Gould is a muppet with an agenda against the NRL.

I agree with all of this too.

METSM For Life.
 

IFR33K

Coach
Messages
17,043
Let's be honest here. If the Melbourne Storm didn't cheat the salary cap, Greg Inglis would've been lost to rugby or the English Super League. Brett Finch would definitely be in England, and probably with several others as well.
You see, the current salary cap laws frown upon teams as good as the Melbourne Storm. Where our game's leaders should be striving for systems that replicate the strength of the Storm in all rugby league clubs, the salary cap system suggests all teams should look more like the Cronulla Sharks.



Take your hand off it GUS, and STFU. Do you not realize that not all clubs are owned and backed by News Limited. A salary cap is there for a reason, and every other club in the NRL can be dirty on losing players to the salary cap.
 
Messages
13,876
If we had a bunch of ex-players players running our game could you imagine the state it would be in.
Like it or not Gus Rugby League is a business and business' need to run by business people not ex-footballers who know plenty about the game and nothing about budgets, income, exspences, write offs, profit and loss etc.
Gus still lives in the 70's, wake up you stupid merkin!
Gus is making League look like a bunch of dickheads when infact the only dickhead in the league is him.
 

Ausguy

Coach
Messages
14,887
wish he'd stop using cronulla as his punching bag. You have no issue with Ricky Stuart Phil? bullsh*t you dont.

"I am not an animallllllllllllll" shut up you over opinionated low life.
 
Messages
13,876
The main thing that pisses me off about it taking 5 years to catch them is that in the 5 years we could have played in another GF and maybe even won one which would have added to our income greatly.
 

hineyrulz

Post Whore
Messages
153,310
Gould is kidding himself, if it wasn't for News the Storm would have folded years ago. They are the team of ther decade yet without the 6 million a year from News they would be no more. The cap is there Melbourne rorted and they paid the price. Teams like Newy and the Sharks can't even to afford to spend the full cap. If we abolished the cap it would be like the EPL.
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
77,288
This campaign to rid the NRL of the salary cap is getting tiresome Phil. Yes we know that the Rorters would then be forever competitive and that's really all that matters isn't it ?

Politis, News Ltd, Singo and Rusty could then battle out the premiership whilst the rest of us play NSW Cup.
 

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
Gould's agenda coming through loud and clear in this one.

The more Gould desperately pushes to abolish the salary cap, the more I think keeping it must be a good idea.
 

mickdo

Coach
Messages
17,355
Gould is a total f**kstick. He'll look for any excuse to try and make the Storm look innocent in this. By the end of the year he'll be saying that the Storm deserved to have won the bloody premiership.
 

Spot On

Coach
Messages
13,902
Gould is kidding himself, if it wasn't for News the Storm would have folded years ago. They are the team of ther decade yet without the 6 million a year from News they would be no more. The cap is there Melbourne rorted and they paid the price. Teams like Newy and the Sharks can't even to afford to spend the full cap. If we abolished the cap it would be like the EPL.


The Storm fiasco is exactly why the NRL must have a salary cap in some form. If you don't, the club with the most $$$$$ wins nearly every year. The club with the greatest appeal to corporations attracts the most and best sponsors willing to throw the most cash at players in third party deals. The clubs in the better socio-economic areas are more likely to attract more $$$$ and so on. Granted the current cap restricts player earnings, ie they should be able to earn more than they currently do, I'm not a believer that these blokes are not well paid. They have chosen to play a sport that does not exist in most countries in the world, a sport that does not have more than a couple of leagues set up world wide and a sport that needs to admit that its niche market is made up of supporters that watch the game on TV from two states in Australia and New Zealand. News flash - there are not many people in Australia so the revenue base will never support a massive jump in the cap or in player earnings. Clubs must play by the rules, the game as a whole - fans, players, clubs, administrators and so on - must realise that even if the next TV deal is worth $1 billion, that doesn't automitically mean everyone's wages suddenly double. We need a cap, a better one that currently exists, and we need players who are realsitic in terms of their $$$$ value. For mine, player agents are a massive part of the problem and should be pissed off immediately. I don't know exactly the % these fools get out of a player's earnings but if it is say 5%, then collectively player managers take about $210,000 of each clubs salary cap. Multiply that by 16 clubs and you get nearly $3.5 million. Surely that can't be right. Can someone in the know clarify how this works?
 
Last edited:
Messages
12,174
Whilst I often wonder how he is still employed, given that all he does is attack the game in the media and whilst commentating, he does kind of have a point. If anyone can get away with cheating and the only way to find out is a whistle-blower, then it makes you wonder if anyone else is cheating.

After calming down, I think that if the players honestly didn't know about the extent of the cheating (which I think they did, as anyone and their dog could see they have too many good players), then it is unfair on the fans that the Storm should not accrue any points for the rest of the season. They should have been given the option to get immediately under the cap, and I think that having the option of withdrawing from the competition for this year would not have necessarily been a bad thing. There is nothing to play for this year, so they could have had the year off and the suspense for next year would see the team survive.

Every time the Storm play a game, win or lose, they will be the laughing stock of opposition fans. This has the potential to get ugly.

If the players HONESTLY didn't know, they didn't make their bed and lie in it. If it was the Eels, and our management was found out to be corrupt, would you be pointing the finger at Hindmarsh, Cayless and Burt? I think not.
how fair is it for their players to be sacked in the middle of the season when everyone else has already spent their cap for the year? they would be forced to play in england or union i agree its unfair on the fans but to be honest i really dont give a flying f*ck what happens to the storm or their players this year the worse it gets for them the less likely it is that other clubs will cheat the cap

p.s. when i said they made their bed i was talking about the club i know if the players and coach are innocent its very hard on them but lets look at the flipside they won the premiership twice by cheating in my mind no punishment is too harsh for that
 
Last edited:

fanool

Juniors
Messages
493
There is no right or wrong here. And Gould should acknowledge that is is a difficult situation for the NRL.

Yes the NRL is being naive but what other options do they have? Gould is being naive also.

So let us pretend I am Tood. According to Gould I get paid out and get told to go and play in QLD cup or slot in with the Raiders or the Sharks.

This does not help me secure another contract for next year? I don't think so.

What does help Tood secure another contract is playing in the Storm's top 17 for the rest of the season. This gives Tood the exposure he needs to get another job.

What about Tood's family. Just pull up stumps and move somewhere for 4 months before having to do it again for the 3rd time in 9 months?

I got retrenched 2 months ago 1 week before my 2nd child was born. I learnt about losing your job in a split second when people are dependent on you. What is paramount is finding a stable and secure envronment both financially and geographically.

In my book the NRL has done the best thing for Tood. Gould may have strapped on a boot or two, But his article demonstrates that he has not been left jobless in the wink of an eye.
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
77,288
Thnx for your perspective Fanool. I hope that things have improved for you.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,968
oh man phil irks me alot of the time .... he is the smuggest king of hindsight going around :roll:
 

Gordy

Juniors
Messages
943
The Storm fiasco is exactly why the NRL must have a salary cap in some form. If you don't, the club with the most $$$$$ wins nearly every year. The club with the greatest appeal to corporations attracts the most and best sponsors willing to throw the most cash at players in third party deals. The clubs in the better socio-economic areas are more likely to attract more $$$$ and so on. Granted the current cap restricts player earnings, ie they should be able to earn more than they currently do, I'm not a believer that these blokes are not well paid. They have chosen to play a sport that does not exist in most countries in the world, a sport that does not have more than a couple of leagues set up world wide and a sport that needs to admit that its niche market is made up of supporters that watch the game on TV from two states in Australia and New Zealand. News flash - there are not many people in Australia so the revenue base will never support a massive jump in the cap or in player earnings. Clubs must play by the rules, the game as a whole - fans, players, clubs, administrators and so on - must realise that even if the next TV deal is worth $1 billion, that doesn't automitically mean everyone's wages suddenly double. We need a cap, a better one that currently exists, and we need players who are realsitic in terms of their $$$$ value. For mine, player agents are a massive part of the problem and should be pissed off immediately. I don't know exactly the % these fools get out of a player's earnings but if it is say 5%, then collectively player managers take about $210,000 of each clubs salary cap. Multiply that by 16 clubs and you get nearly $3.5 million. Surely that can't be right. Can someone in the know clarify how this works?

You are spot on Spot On... Couldn't agree more.
 

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