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Fans want expansîon to perth and brisbane

taipan

Referee
Messages
22,413
Their business plan is not financially sound long term.

All their development has done is give them time, with the rising costs of running an NRL team they'll quickly run out of money again unless they can find a way to increase their property portfolio or significantly increase their income in some other way, which I might add they seem to be attempting at the moment.

But even if they do mange to figure out a way to be financially stable long term whilst still being competitive, does that really mean that we shouldn't look at rationalizing them if they are a inconvenience to the competition as a whole or irreverent in the future of the competition!? (BTW that goes for any clubs not just Cronulla or the other Sydney clubs)

I think not.

You really don't have a clue.
$35-$50m profit conservative estimates.This may increase if approval given for additional 200 units.
$1m pa rental income on retail development.
Extra custom via a refurbished League's club.With a couple of thousand residents a stones throw on other other side of the ground.
No rental on ground,owned by club.
Football club would have broken even this year (despite coming last) and ,despite not having a major sponsor,but ASADA legal costs cut that out.And liitle reliance on poker machine revenue.
More members than Canberra ,West Tigers,Titans.4,000 registered junior players.

Your really need to check before making rash statements.
 

Snappy

Coach
Messages
11,844
I havent read this thread, but come on do fans really want expansion ? I dont.

We dont have enough first grade quality players for more teams. Look at the tripe games we see in the NRL between two bottom placed teams.
 

The Great Dane

First Grade
Messages
7,855
If you think that giant development only buys them time then good luck to you. They get a couple of real fat cheques, ongoing retail rental income from the shopping centre and all the associated benefits to trade in the leagues club of it essentially being relocated to a modern shopping centre with 2 thousand people living next door. While it alone won't make them the richest club getting around, because their sponsorship revenue will always be disadvantaged, they are at a huge advantage over every other club in that they have decent sized income coming from a source no other club has. If management of the sharks can't make them strong with those advantages they deserve to be turfed.

You really don't have a clue.
$35-$50m profit conservative estimates.This may increase if approval given for additional 200 units.
$1m pa rental income on retail development.
Extra custom via a refurbished League's club.With a couple of thousand residents a stones throw on other other side of the ground.
No rental on ground,owned by club.
Football club would have broken even this year (despite coming last) and ,despite not having a major sponsor,but ASADA legal costs cut that out.And liitle reliance on poker machine revenue.
More members than Canberra ,West Tigers,Titans.4,000 registered junior players.

Your really need to check before making rash statements.

I can't be bothered breaking down the numbers for you right now (as it'd probably take an hour or so to do), but basically with the current growth rates of the NRL and the amount it costs to run a team growing significantly they'll be struggling to break even again in roughly a decade if they don't increase their income streams.

In saying that there's nothing stopping them from growing on their current position and becoming financially stable long term, In fact I'm sure that's what they're trying to do (the aforementioned proposed additional 200 units is a good start) and I've no reason to believe that they can't succeed in that endeavor.
I just don't like how everybody is treating this development as the Sharks saving grace just because Buzz (the most agenda driven 'journalist' I've ever encountered) said it was, as it's not the case, they still have lots of work to do to get to that point.

And anyway my main point was that even if they do become financially sustainable does that really mean that they should be exempt from rationalization talks? I don't think so!

BTW Frank Discussion they're not the only club to use real estate to supplement their income and/or support their football operations, the Raiders survive on their real estate portfolio and have done so for a decade or so now, and I'd be very surprised if other clubs weren't going down the same route.
 

carcharias

Immortal
Messages
43,120
Do tell, what is this portfolio of the raiders you speak
of?

How does it stack up against the development with its city views and proximity to the beach , city and infrastructure ?
 

carcharias

Immortal
Messages
43,120
Good on the raiders always liked them.
Shows we'll absolutely kill it .
If the 100 million dollars worth sold on the first day the units went on sale is any indication.
Over looking the greatest city on the planet won't hurt either.
 

taipan

Referee
Messages
22,413
Bruno Cullen former Bronc's CEO in his few months overseeing the Sharks during the ASADA debacle noted.The Sharks based on his research into their finances current and future ,will make them one of the top 4 or 5 financially strong clubs in the code.

So anyone who disagrees pick a bone with him.

Perth Red FYI deposits for the many units have been put down,so money for the club's debts wont be forthcoming til residents settle.2016 I predict.


In fact the latest(3rd) residential stage in the development is Pier,a waterfront block of 55 apartments,as of 14th December where story was made in the Sydney herald (Domain section) 40 of the 55 already sold.They are due for completion mid 2016.
 
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Messages
1,850

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
66,282
Wow, that will be great investment for sharks, I hope they use it wisely to sort the ground out and engage with the locals to get greater support. A winning team never hurts but salary cap will limit the impact somewhat on that as the Broncos show.

Back to expansîon shall we?

I wonder when the NRL will make an announcement on the review and what the review entails and who is doing it?
 

pHyR3

Juniors
Messages
955
Wow, that will be great investment for sharks, I hope they use it wisely to sort the ground out and engage with the locals to get greater support. A winning team never hurts but salary cap will limit the impact somewhat on that as the Broncos show.

Back to expansîon shall we?

I wonder when the NRL will make an announcement on the review and what the review entails and who is doing it?

obviously in the new year.

they often make announcements in around febuary. people are getting antsy for the new season so its a nice talking point.

also gives them more time
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
66,282
A somewhat conflict of interest! I don't see the Broncos giving much support to a new Brisbane team either lol.

Having said that the more I see how limp wristed this admin is the more likely I feel we will not see any expansion for at least 8-10 years. The other codes will be very pleased.
 
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BuffaloRules

Coach
Messages
14,274
A somewhat conflict of interest! I don't see the Broncos giving much support to a new Brisbane team either lol.

Having said that the more I see how limp wristed this admin is the more likely I feel we will not see any expansion for at least 8-10 years. The other codes will be very pleased.

The AFL must be doing cart wheels about how well GWS are going,and Yawnion with the Rebels...

There are no guarantees with any expansion team, and in fact the only success in any code with expansion in the 2000's is WSW.. ( and we will see how well they are going in a few months if they keep sucking...)
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
66,282
They said the same thing about the Brisbane bears and Swans, AFL are not dumb they are in it for the long haul. They have a 50 year plan, we dont even have a 5 year plan!
Union has doubled the jnr numbers playing RU in WA since the Force came in, I suspect similiar may have happened in Victoria.
Soccer is already planning for phase two expansion.
We are more concerned with keeping afloat clubs in over saturated markets than we are in growing the game.

there are no guarantees in any worthwhile investment, you play the odds, roll the dice, invest the money, dont flich when times get tough and hopefully reap the harvest down the track.
 

BuffaloRules

Coach
Messages
14,274
They said the same thing about the Brisbane bears and Swans, AFL are not dumb they are in it for the long haul. They have a 50 year plan, we dont even have a 5 year plan!
Union has doubled the jnr numbers playing RU in WA since the Force came in, I suspect similiar may have happened in Victoria.
Soccer is already planning for phase two expansion.
We are more concerned with keeping afloat clubs in over saturated markets than we are in growing the game.

there are no guarantees in any worthwhile investment, you play the odds, roll the dice, invest the money, dont flich when times get tough and hopefully reap the harvest down the track.

Brisbane Lions are a basket case now.AFL must be pumping in many millions a year to keep them afloat. Swans get GF numbers in Sydney about a third what they got 10 years ago...I really believe the game is going backwards in NSW and QLD even thoiugh they are putting in more teams...

I would love to see those Union numbers - have they gone from 500 to a 1000? Their crowds and ratings are nothing to brag about anywhere, let alone WA and Melbourne. Given the state of ARU finances, I wouldn't be surprised if they pull the pin on one of these teams this decade.

Gallop's idea of expansion in the A- Lrague is putting more teams into Sydney... Their previous expansion into N Qld and Gold Coast was a failure and lasted 5 minutes.

I point all this out to illustrate the lessons of expansion the last 15 years... Need to be considered carefully... I haven't even specifically mentioned the Titans...

You can't blame the NRL for showing some caution given the history if rxpansion of the Australian sporting codes in the last 15 years.
 

Diesel

Referee
Messages
20,562
Reading the above article, Doyle would have inside knowledge and it appears they're pointing towards expansion by relocation, so with Perth and Brisbane being the most likely place for expansion, what underperforming teams best fit those locations?
 

BuffaloRules

Coach
Messages
14,274
I think Raiders should be considered given their poor crowds...

Titans?

Don't think QLD Govt would be happy though given the new stadium they forked out for...
 

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