Favourite Centres for the Warriors

[sup42]

I think center has become like the other positions NZ has historically struggled to develop depth.

In the past , especially the five meter rule era, NZ had a production line of world class centers.

The key changes for me have been the speeding up of games , the emphasis on structure , especially the technical understanding needed for centers these days.

In the past those prerequisites were the domain of Halves. The technical part of the game was stacked on the halves.

Australia has been ahead of the rest because their kids grow up in school boy systems which keep pace with professional development.

At the equivalent level in NZ , youth players don't have access to those systems to the same degree.

Center is a specialist technical position now. The historic gap between Aus + NZ in the halves.....mirrors the challenges for a locally reared center in the present.

Hooker is the other position that has evolved and we struggle to keep pace there, people Like Steve Walters started changing the way that position is played forever.

Ivan Cleary tried a patch up solution. Second rowers / naturalised lateral defenders to compensate for the lack of ' read skills ' in our centers. A couple of those forwards were ex centers.

It's a problem that is taking years to correct , while I get where Cleary was coming from , the lack of Structure in this Clubs U20 - Senior grade prior to Elliot is astounding when you look at it now.

Years of time wasted.

 

[The Pa Kid]

I liked Manoa too. Hayne would have ended up a second rower under Ivan.

" The Hayne Rower-boat "

True. Would have had to put on 30kgs and start calling himself Feleti

 

[reykaine]

Well, toting up all the votes, Toopi and Tate are far and away the most popular centres.

 

[Izz]

Personally, never thought Tate was everything others cracked him up to be. To me, just an average player with high drive and aggression.

Some of his attempts at high-fiving while celebrating were/are hilarious.

 

[captainwarrior]

Toopi - Head and shoulders above the rest. Champion bloke too.
Hurrell - Brilliant to watch.
Carlaw - Solid as a rock. Loved our Toopi/Carlaw centre combo of 2002/03.

Sione Faumuina is my favourite Warrior of all time, however I preferred him as a backrower or five-eighth (on the odd occasion he played there). Tate, Bell, Mannering, Koopu and V.Anderson were all solid too.

 

[MKEB...]

I still remember Tate in a test running down the blindside from dummy half 20 metres off his own line and scoring without passing, just straight out pace...Toopi running back in the defensive line facing the wrong way and Tate making him his bitch.

 

[JJ]

Hurrell built his name in a team that was worse ( records ).

Yeah, and I am a fan - but in a sense, his attitude, defensive lapses, and low workrate made him one of the poster boys for that team - having some moments of brilliance on attack, doesn't make up for the other BS that went on...

Tate was (is) a fine centre, his passing is certainly a weakness - Toopi had weaknesses too, but he did a great job for a while.

Hurrell still behind a few imo (Tea, Cleary, Carlaw for a start) - should pass them all, and perhaps Toopi too, but things to work on

 

[sup42]

Yeah, and I am a fan - but in a sense, his attitude, defensive lapses, and low workrate made him one of the poster boys for that team - having some moments of brilliance on attack, doesn't make up for the other BS that went on...

Tate was (is) a fine centre, his passing is certainly a weakness - Toopi had weaknesses too, but he did a great job for a while.

Hurrell still behind a few imo (Tea, Cleary, Carlaw for a start) - should pass them all, and perhaps Toopi too, but things to work on

Fans from Manly or the Storm wouldn't indulge Hurell for his gifts if he carried on like that in their set ups.

I get a bit OTT when people make excuses for the Likes of Hurrell , sure he is an amazing talent....which in my mind makes it a crime to stuff around with those gifts.

Hurrell on a brighter note can pass the ball , and he at least has the raw ingredients to get somewhere, possibly be the best ever.

Same things were assumed of Dave Taylor , he should have been the greatest forward of his era. That guy upsets a lot of fans despite his talent for the same reasons.

There's nothing wrong with being optimistic about Hurrells future , but based on repeated patterns of behavior I wouldn't put my faith in someone like that until they prove capable of changing their mental outlook.

The Off season will decide if Hurrells got what it takes to be a grown up. I'm not going to lose any sleep if he decides ( it is always about Hurrell not our hopes ) to take the proverbial.

 

[vvvrulz]

Fans from Manly or the Storm wouldn't indulge Hurell for his gifts if he carried on like that in their set ups.

And this is where the coaching really comes into it.
Cleary kept a few loose cannons in check and McFadden will have to do the same thing.

 

[sup42]

And this is where the coaching really comes into it.
Cleary kept a few loose cannons in check and McFadden will have to do the same thing.

Pretty much why I saw hope when he dropped Konrad for a game as soon as he took charge, even though Konrad played well.

It's all about what happens on and off the field. We only see 80 minutes of what is really going on.

 

[JJ]

Same things were assumed of Dave Taylor , he should have been the greatest forward of his era. That guy upsets a lot of fans despite his talent for the same reasons.

.

Yep, history is littered with huge talents that amounted to f**k all... Hurrell could be anything, including f**k all, and that's on him... similar with Johnson, they could become Warriors greats, but I get frustrated when people talk them up now... be fine junior players means nothing, halfbacks and centres putting on a show against depleted opposition means nothing... it's why I like Friend, you make the top 4 by playing your best every week... and across nearly 20 years, the Warriors as a collective have seldom showed an ability to do that

 

[vvvrulz]

. it's why I like Friend, you make the top 4 by playing your best every week... and across nearly 20 years, the Warriors as a collective have seldom showed an ability to do that

This.

It has to be said though that since his dropping Hurrell has smarted up his defensive effort leaps and bounds. Whatever McFadden has done he's changed things, despite the results not showing up in our ladder placing.

Which is why its so important we start putting teams away, starting from tomorrow.

 

[beefstew]

Yep, history is littered with huge talents that amounted to f**k all... Hurrell could be anything, including f**k all, and that's on him... similar with Johnson, they could become Warriors greats, but I get frustrated when people talk them up now... be fine junior players means nothing, halfbacks and centres putting on a show against depleted opposition means nothing... it's why I like Friend, you make the top 4 by playing your best every week... and across nearly 20 years, the Warriors as a collective have seldom showed an ability to do that

Theres a pretty big difference between the talent level of Johnson and Hurrell compared to the long line of average players the Warriors have produced in the halves and center positions, so you could probably understand the excitement when we finally produce some world beating talent like those two.

The past being littered with huge talent is a massive overstatement.

 

[Skinner]

Theres a pretty big difference between the talent level of Johnson and Hurrell compared to the long line of average players the Warriors have produced in the halves and center positions, so you could probably understand the excitement when we finally produce some world beating talent like those two.

The past being littered with huge talent is a massive overstatement.

I think you are right mate, if it was littered with huge talent, it would be at least spattered with premierships.

 

[JJ]

That is right, but talent at that level is relatively rare, but still needs effort and attitude with it - signs are good at the moment, but time will tell...

But in a relatively short history, the Warriors have produced some big talent, in those positions obviously Jones and Toopi were the pick within the club. But we shouldn't forget some that got away, Wiki and Vagana perhaps the two biggest, there are others.

Cronulla has had their share of prodigious talent, and no oremiership yet - it takes many things, talent alone isn't enough

 

[vvvrulz]

The past being littered with huge talent is a massive overstatement.

In those positions... yes other than Jones and Toopi.
But we've had a bucketload of raw spectacular talent just about everywhere else.