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Former Panthers in the NRL

Pomoz

Pomoz

Bench
Messages
2,989
Chins get the wins said:
More natural talent than anyone in our 3 premierships but it's wasn't meant to be. Mostly because of his attitude but another big part was Ivan's inability to see what he had. It took a million injuries for him to get a game, some of the bums he picked ahead of Moyza were deadset terrible footballers. 2014 was one of the most fun sides in our clubs history and the amount of games he won on his own was ridiculous.
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I have seen enough interviews with Ivan to know that he will never pick a player with a bad attitude. do you really think he couldn't see Moylan's talent? He could also see Moylan's terrible attitude.

In this podcast somebody kindly referenced in here,
,

he talked about what he found at the Panthers when he came back. He said the culture was dysfunctional and that he looked at the team through the lens of the book "Five Dysfunctions of a Team" by Patrick Lencioni. He said "that's us, we are dysfunctional". The book list the dysfunctions as:
  • #1: ABSENCE OF TRUST. The fear of being vulnerable prevents team members from building trust with each other.
  • #2: FEAR OF CONFLICT. They don't want to argue in case they upset each other. That means nobody says "Dallin, you suck at fullback". Luaii does not have this fear.
  • #3: LACK OF COMMITMENT. The lack of clarity and/or buy-in prevents team members from making decisions they stick to.
  • #4: AVOIDANCE OF ACCOUNTABILITY. If you want to play at fullback Moyza, you need to be fitter and stop bludging at training. Somebody needed to tell him that.
  • #5: INATTENTION TO RESULTS. The pursuit of individual goals and personal status erodes the team's focus on collective success. "I want to be a fullback/five eighth, I don't want to train too hard though". Nuff said.
Full marks to Ivan because he was prepared to embrace this and make tough decisions. He really believes in "attitude is everything", lazy, talented geniuses need not apply. He specifically mentioned that the team agreed that "Fitness" has to be a specific goal if you want to be the best you can be. You can see that level of clarity and commitment has produced the fittest team in the NRL

When you think about the last 15 minutes of the 2023 GF, it is a testament to teamwork. trust, commitment, focus, accountability. This shit works.
 
Chins get the wins

Chins get the wins

First Grade
Messages
8,276
Pomoz said:
I have seen enough interviews with Ivan to know that he will never pick a player with a bad attitude. do you really think he couldn't see Moylan's talent? He could also see Moylan's terrible attitude.

In this podcast somebody kindly referenced in here,
,

he talked about what he found at the Panthers when he came back. He said the culture was dysfunctional and that he looked at the team through the lens of the book "Five Dysfunctions of a Team" by Patrick Lencioni. He said "that's us, we are dysfunctional". The book list the dysfunctions as:
  • #1: ABSENCE OF TRUST. The fear of being vulnerable prevents team members from building trust with each other.
  • #2: FEAR OF CONFLICT. They don't want to argue in case they upset each other. That means nobody says "Dallin, you suck at fullback". Luaii does not have this fear.
  • #3: LACK OF COMMITMENT. The lack of clarity and/or buy-in prevents team members from making decisions they stick to.
  • #4: AVOIDANCE OF ACCOUNTABILITY. If you want to play at fullback Moyza, you need to be fitter and stop bludging at training. Somebody needed to tell him that.
  • #5: INATTENTION TO RESULTS. The pursuit of individual goals and personal status erodes the team's focus on collective success. "I want to be a fullback/five eighth, I don't want to train too hard though". Nuff said.
Full marks to Ivan because he was prepared to embrace this and make tough decisions. He really believes in "attitude is everything", lazy, talented geniuses need not apply. He specifically mentioned that the team agreed that "Fitness" has to be a specific goal if you want to be the best you can be. You can see that level of clarity and commitment has produced the fittest team in the NRL

When you think about the last 15 minutes of the 2023 GF, it is a testament to teamwork. trust, commitment, focus, accountability. This shit works.
Click to expand...
And yet Wayne Bennett can get almost any complete f**kwit to buy into what he's doing.
Ivan is good, Wayne is great
 
Chins get the wins

Chins get the wins

First Grade
Messages
8,276
Crashtest said:
Yes but left their roster and salary cap in a mess and bolted early from his contract. Looked at how long it took them to recover afterwards
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100% but I was only talking about Wayne's ability to coach and to work with different types of personalities. He's the best coach of all time
 
Aliceinwonderland

Aliceinwonderland

First Grade
Messages
7,868
Crashtest said:
Yes but left their roster and salary cap in a mess and bolted early from his contract. Looked at how long it took them to recover afterwards
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I live up here in the Hunter. Trust me Bennett is NOT well thought of. Ripped the guts out of a (well working) junior development pathways. Was not interested in enhancing partnerships with the local community, (something that Newy has always done real well)

Ripped the guts out of their salary cap, signing up aging players to top shelf deals. Took years to right the cap.

Ran out of his wife, the mother of two very disabled sons, with the office receptionist.....(in a working class community like Newy this is frowned upon). Basically running away from his fatherly responsibilities.

Then when the going got too tough, and the mess too great. Ran away. Back to Brisbane with their unlimited funds, and the cream of a state's juniors.

Ivan is streets ahead of Bennett.
 
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Chins get the wins

Chins get the wins

First Grade
Messages
8,276
Aliceinwonderland said:
I live up here in the Hunter. Trust me Bennett is NOT well thought of. Ripped the guts out of a (well working) junior development pathways. Was not interested in enhancing partnerships with the local community, (something that Newy has always done real well)

Ripped the guts out of their salary cap, signing up aging players to top shelf deals. Took years to right the cap.

Ran out of his wife, the mother of two very disabled sons, with the office receptionist.....(in a working class community like Newy this is frowned upon). Basically running away from his fatherly responsibilities.

Then when the going go too tough, and the mess too great. Ran away. Back to Brisbane with their unlimited funds, and the cream of a state's juniors.

Ivan is streets ahead of Bennett.
Click to expand...
No one has any idea what goes on in people's marriages. Not really fair to bring that up
 
Aliceinwonderland

Aliceinwonderland

First Grade
Messages
7,868
Chins get the wins said:
No one has any idea what goes on in people's marriages. Not really fair to bring that up
Click to expand...

I agree. What I am saying is this is the way the 'collective society' in Newy viewed it. They coupled it with Bennett running away back to Brisbane, as what he did with his marriage.

Not my thought, being someone who is divorced I'm the last person to throw stones.

In saying that this was how the rugby league wider community viewed it. (quite a Victorian moral outlook, I must say.)
 
Pomoz

Pomoz

Bench
Messages
2,989
Aliceinwonderland said:
I live up here in the Hunter. Trust me Bennett is NOT well thought of. Ripped the guts out of a (well working) junior development pathways. Was not interested in enhancing partnerships with the local community, (something that Newy has always done real well)

Ripped the guts out of their salary cap, signing up aging players to top shelf deals. Took years to right the cap.

Ran out of his wife, the mother of two very disabled sons, with the office receptionist.....(in a working class community like Newy this is frowned upon). Basically running away from his fatherly responsibilities.

Then when the going go too tough, and the mess too great. Ran away. Back to Brisbane with their unlimited funds, and the cream of a state's juniors.

Ivan is streets ahead of Bennett.
Click to expand...
We have had this argument before Alice. It seems strange that somebody is successful everywhere he goes, but not at Newcastle.

In spite of the club not even having enough funds to pay the players. All Bennet's fault. Imagine being at work and not knowing if you will get paid? All the young players on minimum wages would be distracted and frantic with worry.

It is this kind of thinking that has mired the Knights in mediocrity for so long. He told the board not to give the job to Stone because he wasn't good enough, they did and he was a disaster. They gave the CEO job to Gidley, a man with no experience who not 3 years earlier was still playing. All Bennets fault.

He destroyed the pathways. Yet the Broncos produced an endless supply of rep players when he was there. At Newcastle he suddenly forgot everything he knew and destroyed the pathways. Pathways that were so good the Knights produced 12 out of the 33 players that played for them in 2011, the year before Bennett got there.

Pathways that have produced 1 full Premiership and 1 half Premiership since their inception, 35 years ago.

There is a myth they had great juniors until Bennett got there. Yes, they have produced some great players and arguably the greatest ever in Joey, but they are really the same as Penrith before the current era, massive junior base, poor leadership and mediocre. They need a Don Feltis to say "enough, we need a reset".
 
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