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Four Corners: Hard Knocks

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/05/10/3499950.htm
Hard Knocks

By Quentin McDermott and Clay Hichens

Updated May 10, 2012 13:24:00

A confronting story that looks at the implications of cutting-edge research relating to the prevention and management of head injuries in football players.

They've been called modern day gladiators and each year football players get bigger, faster and they hit harder. Getting hurt may be part of the game, but reporter Quentin McDermott looks at the latest research on head and brain injury. He reveals there is growing evidence that footballers young and old could be suffering long term brain damage.

It's a story that has implications for anyone who pulls on a football boot, from pros to primary schoolers. A prominent neurosurgeon tells Four Corners he is so concerned about what he's seeing that when it comes to school children there's a clear rule:

"I personally would say three significant concussions, three strikes and you're out."

Right now in the United States, researchers are doing all they can to understand what happens inside the brain when players make physical contact.

Using new imaging technology it's possible to examine not just the structure of the brain but to see how its function is changing. Some researchers now believe that a player doesn't have to sustain repeated concussions to risk permanent brain damage, but that repeated sub-concussive impact affecting the brain can be enough. The research has major implications for young players:

"We found it in a 17 year old football player, an 18 year old, we found it pretty extensive in a 21 year old, so it's helped people realise that it's not just a pro-athlete problem, that you're more vulnerable when you're young anyway and so we're clearly giving this disease to children who don't understand what they're even getting into."

So are football administrators taking the issue seriously enough? All three body contact football codes - Rugby League, Rugby Union and Australian Rules Football - say they no longer allow concussed players to finish a game, and severely penalise any player who deliberately causes a head injury. But they are also sceptical about the relevance of the US research to football as it is played here.

"I think that we need to be pretty careful how we interpret the (US research) because their game is completely different, you know? The aim of their game is to actually crash into each other with their heads you know, so potentially players are playing concussed. We don't have any such thing in our game and we take any head contact very seriously." Rugby League doctor

Researchers in Australia are lining up to do work that mirrors the investigations being done in the United States, but final agreement with the different football codes and clubs seems some way off.

Until that research is carried out, we won't know whether the repeated head injuries suffered by some footballers are damaging their health permanently. That means another generation of footballers run the risk of serious injury.

"Hard Knocks", reported by Quentin McDermott and presented by Kerry O'Brien, goes to air on Monday 14th May at 8.30pm on ABC1. It is repeated on Tuesday 15th May at 11.35pm. It can also be seen on ABC News 24 each Saturday at 8.00pm, on ABC iview and at 4 Corners.
 

BDR

First Grade
Messages
7,526
You're kidding yourself if you don't think concussions are a problem in our game. You see lads getting knocked out weekly not only on the field on match day but also in training. It only takes a handful to cause brain trauma, in some people the symptoms don't manifest right away but can lead to depression or early-onset Alzheimers after retiring.

The NFL ignored this problem for years, and only now are they really doing anything serious about it. The NRL does what it can and the public cases of ex-league players suffering from concussion related trauma are thankfully pretty small. I'd still like to see some kind of strict concussion policy involving a neutral doctor, but I understand that the logistics are pretty difficult.

The junior levels are where it's really a problem. I remember being knocked completely unconscious when I was a kid and was put back onto the field towards the end of the game. That sort of thing is seriously dangerous.
 

in.tro

Juniors
Messages
28
acl injuries are also a problem. head knocks and concussions have occured for years.
we have to be careful how we go forward with this or we will end up wearing helmets like they do in the NFL
 

carlosthedwarf

First Grade
Messages
8,189
They are a problem, but the line of thinking is that helmets can lead to more concussions because guys think they're indestructible and you have a lot of contact leading with the head. Plus you have linemen hitting each other head on numerous times a game, which is where some of the concern from the repeated "sub-concussive impact" comes from.
 

PaddyBoy

Juniors
Messages
939
The helmets are part of the problem intro, the damage is caused by your brain bouncing around in your head, not the contact to your head.
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
we have to be careful how we go forward with this or we will end up wearing helmets like they do in the NFL

helmets are more than likely what's contributing to problems as it makes them feel safe to run in head first
 

BunniesMan

Immortal
Messages
33,700
Helmets don't help. The NFL uses helmets and it hasn't stopped it from being an issue.

We already have strict rules against head high contact. The swinging arm aimed at the head is all but extinct.

Where we are lacking is the diagnosis and treatment of concussions during games.

I'd like to see the NRL employ 8 independent doctors at every game who answer to the NRL and not to individual clubs. These doctors should be solely concerned with diagnosis and treatment of head injuries and they should have absolute power to not let a player back on.

It certainly can't be left to the players because a) they're not experts and b) their concern for their reputation will always make them run back on even if they feel something is wrong.

And it can't be left to people employed by the club because consciously or subconsciously there will always be situations where they take risks.

Get in independent doctors with absolute power to take a player from a game and sideline him until they are convinced he is ok.
 

Timbo

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
20,279
acl injuries are also a problem. head knocks and concussions have occured for years.
we have to be careful how we go forward with this or we will end up wearing helmets like they do in the NFL

How do you mean?

So if the finding is 'wear helmets or suffer seriously increased chance of brain damage' your response is.... Risk it?
 

in.tro

Juniors
Messages
28
How do you mean?

So if the finding is 'wear helmets or suffer seriously increased chance of brain damage' your response is.... Risk it?

yes
boxers do
surfers risk getting eaten by sharks
its part of the game
if you dont like shoulder chargers go watch/play/support union, oztag or touch footy
 

thorson1987

Coach
Messages
16,907
Helmets don't help. The NFL uses helmets and it hasn't stopped it from being an issue.

We already have strict rules against head high contact. The swinging arm aimed at the head is all but extinct.

Where we are lacking is the diagnosis and treatment of concussions during games.

I'd like to see the NRL employ 8 independent doctors at every game who answer to the NRL and not to individual clubs. These doctors should be solely concerned with diagnosis and treatment of head injuries and they should have absolute power to not let a player back on.

It certainly can't be left to the players because a) they're not experts and b) their concern for their reputation will always make them run back on even if they feel something is wrong.

And it can't be left to people employed by the club because consciously or subconsciously there will always be situations where they take risks.

Get in independent doctors with absolute power to take a player from a game and sideline him until they are convinced he is ok.

fmd.

bm actually posted something smart.

i agree with this 100%
 

docbrown

Coach
Messages
11,842
Anyone else see that article the other day about NFL player life expectancy? I can't remember the exact numbers but -

Since 1993 they've run a census to study NFL player premature death and found that although they expected about 600+ players to have died so far only 350 odd have.

NFL players are actually living longer than the general population.
 

BDR

First Grade
Messages
7,526
IMO the right way to approach it is through rules about concussions. If a player is found to be concussed he should be removed from the game. It's difficult because the player might feel physically able to play but inside his brain is swollen and damaged

I don't know where all the chicken littles have come from the article says nothing about helmets or banning rugby league.
 

Danish

Referee
Messages
31,984
All the NRL needs to do is bring in a neutral doctor to assess allegedly concussed players during games (any player that cannot get up necessitating time be stopped shall be considered allegedly concussed) and decide whether or not they can continue in the game.

If a player goes off with concussion, the NRL doctors have check up sessions on the monday, wednesday and friday in order to give the player clearance to train and play.

Done and dusted.

I don't see that the NRL needs to do anything like changing the rules to limit the likelihood of concussion. The amount of players concussed through illegal play such as shoulder charges and high tackles is fairly minor compared to the amount concussed from purely incidental collision (getting their head in the wrong place for a tackle, whacking their head on the ground etc).

Players need to assume a certain amount of responsibility for their own risk when choosing to take up the sport, just as any other worker deciding to take up a dangerous occupation does.
 

innerwestrabbit

Juniors
Messages
347
I agree you need NRL Doctors at all games making those decisions about concussions. I also believe any player that is knocked out, that team needs to be able to bring another player on as a replacement. I guess that could lead to rorting of the system like Bozo did with the blood bin rule back in the 80's. I,m sure they could overcome that though
 
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