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The Game Future NRL Stadiums part II

Messages
21,880

The issue he doesn’t address is the opportunity loss/cost, and also the loss of current events.

It’s almost certain that the NRL will open up the grand final to bidders. I’d also think is possible Sydney may lose it’s guaranteed once a year Bledisloe.

A genuine rectangular ground will help to attract major events like the RU World Cup and the women’s FIFA World Cup.

Plus the part regarding advice from the department only seems to address Moore park.
 
Messages
21,880
Never thought I’d hear Tony Abbott make sense.

To quote Toovey, there should be an investigation.

Here’s the truth.

The economic benefit is vastly overstated, it’s indisputable.

But it’s also wrong to completely rule out any economic benefit.

3 main reasons.

1. It assumes all current events will be retained with the current set up. You can’t make this assumption.

2. All cities that have made in significant uprades to stadiums have seen a minimum 15-20% increase in attendance.

3. Logic tells you that better stadiums will have a better chance to attract international events. RU World Cup, Women’s FIFA World Cup, more touring European football teams, more American college teams, possibly even something like preseason NFL.

Those high quality events demand high quality facilities.

The other factor to consider with the construction cost of ANZ is its a profitable stadium at the moment. Therefore that profit can at least go part way to offsetting the construction costs.
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
Not satisfied with outrageous stadiums largesse, now NSW Government wants to offer $40m to NRL clubs

Hold on to your hats, sports fans, this is getting more outrageous by the day. You will be aware, I know, that there is an issue at the moment over whether or not it is a good idea for the State Government to go through with its plans to knock over three relatively new Stadiums – at Parramatta, Homebush and Moore Park – and rebuild them at a cost of $2.5 billion.

The pro-bulldozer mob have on their side all of Alan Jones, the wider SCG Trust, Venues NSW, most of News Limited and most importantly the controlling half of the NSW Government. The other half think, to use the words of one: "It's the dumbest f--king idea I've ever heard. It screams largesse and the public won't buy it."

He got that right.

For while on the side of sanity, there is no such list of powerful names and institutions, there is one very powerful entity that is extremely engaged. And that is ... the people of NSW. No exaggeration, I have never seen anything remotely like it. The petition I started against it, now has just under 150K signatories. The petition started, in response, for the stadium upgrade – which has been widely publicised – has just over 150 signatures. Yes, that's right.

Those against it VS those for it, really is about a thousand to one!

And while I have respectfully asked Premier Gladys Berejiklian three times now, to justify her claim that the $2 billion outlay will be made back in two years, as yet there is only radio silence ... and the rather unpleasant guffawing of economists who point out that with that kind of a return, private equity would be rushing to finance it, and there would be no need to call on the public purse. And even the government's own figures do them down, as originally revealed by my colleague Jacob Saulwick, concerning the insanity of the SFS project alone, which noted the advice of Infrastructure NSW that there would be "no economic benefit to the state of NSW ..."

But still, we have not come to the most stunning development of the last two days. For in the middle of all this – which has included Sydney City Council, followed by Randwick and Waverly Council, passing strong motions against the stadium rebuild – we have it on the authority of Channel Nine's state political reporter, Chris O'Keefe, that the NSW Government is about to make another announcement concerning their sporting largesse, concerning an allocation of $40 million to sport.

Who to?

Well, specifically, that $40 million is going to NRL clubs, to refurbish their gyms, and expand their facilities!

O'Keefe reports that the $40 million is "expected to be handed over to six clubs ... to help clubs build 'Centres of Excellence' . . . It is expected South Sydney will be handed money to build at Heffron Park in Maroubra, Canterbury Bulldogs at Belmore, Sydney Roosters at Moore Park, Cronulla at Shark Park and Newcastle Knights at Hunter Stadium."

I have no clue why I appear to be close to a lone voice on this, but let me say it loud and proud, regardless.

Friends, this is a DISGRACE.

To make a statement of the bleeding bloody obvious, the NSW Government has no business handing out taxpayer funds to elite sporting BUSINESESS, that make their own money already – the NRL itself is a billion dollar business – at a time when community sport is crying out for resources!

And yes of course the government is dressing up their largesse with the plan that the new centres of excellence will also be open to local communities.

No, really! You'll wander along, and right next to you, as you do the leg press, Greg Inglis will be doing bench presses! In the manner of classic trickle-down economics – let us spend billions knocking down and rebuilding elite stadiums, and the wealth will trickle all the way down to struggle street – this has it, that by putting this money into NRL clubs, the poorer people will benefit, too.

Who is going to stop this madness?

Instead of yet more trickle-down nonsense, if this money is earmarked for sport, why not put it directly to where it is most needed? Instead of putting that money in the middle of money-making operations that are already well resourced, why not put it to one of the "674 priority community sport projects" recently identified by the NSW Office of Sport, which are CRYING OUT for funds?

Netball courts! Tennis courts! Basketball courts! Green fields! Velodromes! Skateboard rinks!

Just how obvious is it that if the NSW Government has a spare $40 million to give to sport, these are the kind of projects that need it, NOT elite sport? I have told the story before, of how at Northern Suburbs Basketball Association, a couple of decades ago, we were able to raise, with the help of North Sydney Council, and a little from the NSW Government, $3 million to build the Crows Nest Sports Centre with four basketball courts, that can also be used for netball and many other community activities – that go from 6 am to 10.45 pm. It is a fantastic resource, totally self-sustaining as it is now funded by our 5500 members, of all ages, from 5 years old to 85 years-old. As well resourced as it is, it now has a long waiting list.

Why can't that be the model for community sport across the state?

But $40 million of taxpayers' money so that rugby league clubs can upgrade to having "Centres of Excellence?" It is madness and electoral suicide – and more and more in the NSW Government know it. Let us see if sanity might prevail sometime between now and next Tuesday, when the Premier is set to announce the $40 million hand-out.

And let us see if she will still maintain the demonstrable nonsense of the $2 billion being paid back in two years.

Who stops this madness gets to be Premier – and if it is Ms Berejklian herself, all good!


http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...o-offer-40m-to-nrl-clubs-20171213-h046tb.html
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
Not satisfied with outrageous stadiums largesse, now NSW Government wants to offer $40m to NRL clubs

Hold on to your hats, sports fans, this is getting more outrageous by the day. You will be aware, I know, that there is an issue at the moment over whether or not it is a good idea for the State Government to go through with its plans to knock over three relatively new Stadiums – at Parramatta, Homebush and Moore Park – and rebuild them at a cost of $2.5 billion.

The pro-bulldozer mob have on their side all of Alan Jones, the wider SCG Trust, Venues NSW, most of News Limited and most importantly the controlling half of the NSW Government. The other half think, to use the words of one: "It's the dumbest f--king idea I've ever heard. It screams largesse and the public won't buy it."

He got that right.

For while on the side of sanity, there is no such list of powerful names and institutions, there is one very powerful entity that is extremely engaged. And that is ... the people of NSW. No exaggeration, I have never seen anything remotely like it. The petition I started against it, now has just under 150K signatories. The petition started, in response, for the stadium upgrade – which has been widely publicised – has just over 150 signatures. Yes, that's right.

Those against it VS those for it, really is about a thousand to one!

And while I have respectfully asked Premier Gladys Berejiklian three times now, to justify her claim that the $2 billion outlay will be made back in two years, as yet there is only radio silence ... and the rather unpleasant guffawing of economists who point out that with that kind of a return, private equity would be rushing to finance it, and there would be no need to call on the public purse. And even the government's own figures do them down, as originally revealed by my colleague Jacob Saulwick, concerning the insanity of the SFS project alone, which noted the advice of Infrastructure NSW that there would be "no economic benefit to the state of NSW ..."

But still, we have not come to the most stunning development of the last two days. For in the middle of all this – which has included Sydney City Council, followed by Randwick and Waverly Council, passing strong motions against the stadium rebuild – we have it on the authority of Channel Nine's state political reporter, Chris O'Keefe, that the NSW Government is about to make another announcement concerning their sporting largesse, concerning an allocation of $40 million to sport.

Who to?

Well, specifically, that $40 million is going to NRL clubs, to refurbish their gyms, and expand their facilities!

O'Keefe reports that the $40 million is "expected to be handed over to six clubs ... to help clubs build 'Centres of Excellence' . . . It is expected South Sydney will be handed money to build at Heffron Park in Maroubra, Canterbury Bulldogs at Belmore, Sydney Roosters at Moore Park, Cronulla at Shark Park and Newcastle Knights at Hunter Stadium."

I have no clue why I appear to be close to a lone voice on this, but let me say it loud and proud, regardless.

Friends, this is a DISGRACE.

To make a statement of the bleeding bloody obvious, the NSW Government has no business handing out taxpayer funds to elite sporting BUSINESESS, that make their own money already – the NRL itself is a billion dollar business – at a time when community sport is crying out for resources!

And yes of course the government is dressing up their largesse with the plan that the new centres of excellence will also be open to local communities.

No, really! You'll wander along, and right next to you, as you do the leg press, Greg Inglis will be doing bench presses! In the manner of classic trickle-down economics – let us spend billions knocking down and rebuilding elite stadiums, and the wealth will trickle all the way down to struggle street – this has it, that by putting this money into NRL clubs, the poorer people will benefit, too.

Who is going to stop this madness?

Instead of yet more trickle-down nonsense, if this money is earmarked for sport, why not put it directly to where it is most needed? Instead of putting that money in the middle of money-making operations that are already well resourced, why not put it to one of the "674 priority community sport projects" recently identified by the NSW Office of Sport, which are CRYING OUT for funds?

Netball courts! Tennis courts! Basketball courts! Green fields! Velodromes! Skateboard rinks!

Just how obvious is it that if the NSW Government has a spare $40 million to give to sport, these are the kind of projects that need it, NOT elite sport? I have told the story before, of how at Northern Suburbs Basketball Association, a couple of decades ago, we were able to raise, with the help of North Sydney Council, and a little from the NSW Government, $3 million to build the Crows Nest Sports Centre with four basketball courts, that can also be used for netball and many other community activities – that go from 6 am to 10.45 pm. It is a fantastic resource, totally self-sustaining as it is now funded by our 5500 members, of all ages, from 5 years old to 85 years-old. As well resourced as it is, it now has a long waiting list.

Why can't that be the model for community sport across the state?

But $40 million of taxpayers' money so that rugby league clubs can upgrade to having "Centres of Excellence?" It is madness and electoral suicide – and more and more in the NSW Government know it. Let us see if sanity might prevail sometime between now and next Tuesday, when the Premier is set to announce the $40 million hand-out.

And let us see if she will still maintain the demonstrable nonsense of the $2 billion being paid back in two years.

Who stops this madness gets to be Premier – and if it is Ms Berejklian herself, all good!


http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...o-offer-40m-to-nrl-clubs-20171213-h046tb.html

This is such rubbish, he's either ignorant or a being deliberately misleading to further his agenda. Baird announced this more than a year ago and it's on a dollar for dollar basis, with clubs only getting as much as they put in. They are also open to the public as community assets. The NSW government also announced months ago a $100m sporting facilities fund for exactly the sort of projects he is talking about.

It's pathetic that his entire source for this populist rant is a 60sec news report on ch9 that was equally ignorant. Honestly, if you are secure in your own argument you don't deliberately leave out details to flatter your agenda. Narsasist wanker.
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
69,869
Maybe someone needs to print a list of how much govt funding has gone to afl and other sports I sydney in last few years with a reminder that rugby league is the cities main game!
 

OldPanther

Coach
Messages
13,404
Not satisfied with outrageous stadiums largesse, now NSW Government wants to offer $40m to NRL clubs

Hold on to your hats, sports fans, this is getting more outrageous by the day. You will be aware, I know, that there is an issue at the moment over whether or not it is a good idea for the State Government to go through with its plans to knock over three relatively new Stadiums – at Parramatta, Homebush and Moore Park – and rebuild them at a cost of $2.5 billion.

The pro-bulldozer mob have on their side all of Alan Jones, the wider SCG Trust, Venues NSW, most of News Limited and most importantly the controlling half of the NSW Government. The other half think, to use the words of one: "It's the dumbest f--king idea I've ever heard. It screams largesse and the public won't buy it."

He got that right.

For while on the side of sanity, there is no such list of powerful names and institutions, there is one very powerful entity that is extremely engaged. And that is ... the people of NSW. No exaggeration, I have never seen anything remotely like it. The petition I started against it, now has just under 150K signatories. The petition started, in response, for the stadium upgrade – which has been widely publicised – has just over 150 signatures. Yes, that's right.

Those against it VS those for it, really is about a thousand to one!

And while I have respectfully asked Premier Gladys Berejiklian three times now, to justify her claim that the $2 billion outlay will be made back in two years, as yet there is only radio silence ... and the rather unpleasant guffawing of economists who point out that with that kind of a return, private equity would be rushing to finance it, and there would be no need to call on the public purse. And even the government's own figures do them down, as originally revealed by my colleague Jacob Saulwick, concerning the insanity of the SFS project alone, which noted the advice of Infrastructure NSW that there would be "no economic benefit to the state of NSW ..."

But still, we have not come to the most stunning development of the last two days. For in the middle of all this – which has included Sydney City Council, followed by Randwick and Waverly Council, passing strong motions against the stadium rebuild – we have it on the authority of Channel Nine's state political reporter, Chris O'Keefe, that the NSW Government is about to make another announcement concerning their sporting largesse, concerning an allocation of $40 million to sport.

Who to?

Well, specifically, that $40 million is going to NRL clubs, to refurbish their gyms, and expand their facilities!

O'Keefe reports that the $40 million is "expected to be handed over to six clubs ... to help clubs build 'Centres of Excellence' . . . It is expected South Sydney will be handed money to build at Heffron Park in Maroubra, Canterbury Bulldogs at Belmore, Sydney Roosters at Moore Park, Cronulla at Shark Park and Newcastle Knights at Hunter Stadium."

I have no clue why I appear to be close to a lone voice on this, but let me say it loud and proud, regardless.

Friends, this is a DISGRACE.

To make a statement of the bleeding bloody obvious, the NSW Government has no business handing out taxpayer funds to elite sporting BUSINESESS, that make their own money already – the NRL itself is a billion dollar business – at a time when community sport is crying out for resources!

And yes of course the government is dressing up their largesse with the plan that the new centres of excellence will also be open to local communities.

No, really! You'll wander along, and right next to you, as you do the leg press, Greg Inglis will be doing bench presses! In the manner of classic trickle-down economics – let us spend billions knocking down and rebuilding elite stadiums, and the wealth will trickle all the way down to struggle street – this has it, that by putting this money into NRL clubs, the poorer people will benefit, too.

Who is going to stop this madness?

Instead of yet more trickle-down nonsense, if this money is earmarked for sport, why not put it directly to where it is most needed? Instead of putting that money in the middle of money-making operations that are already well resourced, why not put it to one of the "674 priority community sport projects" recently identified by the NSW Office of Sport, which are CRYING OUT for funds?

Netball courts! Tennis courts! Basketball courts! Green fields! Velodromes! Skateboard rinks!

Just how obvious is it that if the NSW Government has a spare $40 million to give to sport, these are the kind of projects that need it, NOT elite sport? I have told the story before, of how at Northern Suburbs Basketball Association, a couple of decades ago, we were able to raise, with the help of North Sydney Council, and a little from the NSW Government, $3 million to build the Crows Nest Sports Centre with four basketball courts, that can also be used for netball and many other community activities – that go from 6 am to 10.45 pm. It is a fantastic resource, totally self-sustaining as it is now funded by our 5500 members, of all ages, from 5 years old to 85 years-old. As well resourced as it is, it now has a long waiting list.

Why can't that be the model for community sport across the state?

But $40 million of taxpayers' money so that rugby league clubs can upgrade to having "Centres of Excellence?" It is madness and electoral suicide – and more and more in the NSW Government know it. Let us see if sanity might prevail sometime between now and next Tuesday, when the Premier is set to announce the $40 million hand-out.

And let us see if she will still maintain the demonstrable nonsense of the $2 billion being paid back in two years.

Who stops this madness gets to be Premier – and if it is Ms Berejklian herself, all good!


http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...o-offer-40m-to-nrl-clubs-20171213-h046tb.html

"The petition started, in response, for the stadium upgrade – which has been widely publicised – has just over 150 signatures"

A petition that was published with the backing of the media Vs one that maybe 1 person with profile retweeted. Yeah it was definitely widely publicised fool.
 

OldPanther

Coach
Messages
13,404
My email to Fitz:

"
Hi hope your well. I'm the person who started the petition in favour of the Sydney stadium upgrades. Just a couple of quick points.

You said the petition was widely publicised which isn't true at all. I think I got 2 retweets in total. Secondly I'm some working class nobody and you're quite high profile writing columns in the paper every second day about your opinion on topics. It was never a contest.

Secondly the Allianz Stadium rebuild will happen regardless. You have to know at most you'll only be able to stop ANZ being rebuilt so the SCG trust will get all the benifit and the government(by extension people) owned stadium will be left as a substandard oval. If you remember ANZ was suppose to be made a rectangular stadium after the Olympics but AFL wanted a part of it so it was made an oval and AFL abandoned the ground after a few games.

We know for a fact the NRL Grand final eill be sold to QLD and Victoria so what else do we lose? State of origin? International Rugby Union? With a world class stadium at ANZ we should be getting the best of domeatic sport and making bids for soccer world cup if not mens the womens, rugby union world cups. Invite english soccer and American football over. I firmly believe us taxpayers shouldn't be the ones to miss out while the SCG trust get what they want as always.

All the best and glad we can respectfully disagree"
 

Raiderdave

First Grade
Messages
7,990
Yeah
Peter Fitzsimons hates Sydney

he has to
why else would he stand in the way of it becoming a sought after destination for world class sporting events that will go to every other capital city in Australia except Sydney if these venues aren't built.

billions of $$ lost by Sydney businesses over the next 20 years going to keep Victorians & Qlders in jobs

how can this clown not see this
 
Last edited:

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
My email to Fitz:

"
Hi hope your well. I'm the person who started the petition in favour of the Sydney stadium upgrades. Just a couple of quick points.

You said the petition was widely publicised which isn't true at all. I think I got 2 retweets in total. Secondly I'm some working class nobody and you're quite high profile writing columns in the paper every second day about your opinion on topics. It was never a contest.

Secondly the Allianz Stadium rebuild will happen regardless. You have to know at most you'll only be able to stop ANZ being rebuilt so the SCG trust will get all the benifit and the government(by extension people) owned stadium will be left as a substandard oval. If you remember ANZ was suppose to be made a rectangular stadium after the Olympics but AFL wanted a part of it so it was made an oval and AFL abandoned the ground after a few games.

We know for a fact the NRL Grand final eill be sold to QLD and Victoria so what else do we lose? State of origin? International Rugby Union? With a world class stadium at ANZ we should be getting the best of domeatic sport and making bids for soccer world cup if not mens the womens, rugby union world cups. Invite english soccer and American football over. I firmly believe us taxpayers shouldn't be the ones to miss out while the SCG trust get what they want as always.

All the best and glad we can respectfully disagree"
sue him and his hanky
 
Messages
545
Not satisfied with outrageous stadiums largesse, now NSW Government wants to offer $40m to NRL clubs

Hold on to your hats, sports fans, this is getting more outrageous by the day. You will be aware, I know, that there is an issue at the moment over whether or not it is a good idea for the State Government to go through with its plans to knock over three relatively new Stadiums – at Parramatta, Homebush and Moore Park – and rebuild them at a cost of $2.5 billion.

The pro-bulldozer mob have on their side all of Alan Jones, the wider SCG Trust, Venues NSW, most of News Limited and most importantly the controlling half of the NSW Government. The other half think, to use the words of one: "It's the dumbest f--king idea I've ever heard. It screams largesse and the public won't buy it."

He got that right.

For while on the side of sanity, there is no such list of powerful names and institutions, there is one very powerful entity that is extremely engaged. And that is ... the people of NSW. No exaggeration, I have never seen anything remotely like it. The petition I started against it, now has just under 150K signatories. The petition started, in response, for the stadium upgrade – which has been widely publicised – has just over 150 signatures. Yes, that's right.

Those against it VS those for it, really is about a thousand to one!

And while I have respectfully asked Premier Gladys Berejiklian three times now, to justify her claim that the $2 billion outlay will be made back in two years, as yet there is only radio silence ... and the rather unpleasant guffawing of economists who point out that with that kind of a return, private equity would be rushing to finance it, and there would be no need to call on the public purse. And even the government's own figures do them down, as originally revealed by my colleague Jacob Saulwick, concerning the insanity of the SFS project alone, which noted the advice of Infrastructure NSW that there would be "no economic benefit to the state of NSW ..."

But still, we have not come to the most stunning development of the last two days. For in the middle of all this – which has included Sydney City Council, followed by Randwick and Waverly Council, passing strong motions against the stadium rebuild – we have it on the authority of Channel Nine's state political reporter, Chris O'Keefe, that the NSW Government is about to make another announcement concerning their sporting largesse, concerning an allocation of $40 million to sport.

Who to?

Well, specifically, that $40 million is going to NRL clubs, to refurbish their gyms, and expand their facilities!

O'Keefe reports that the $40 million is "expected to be handed over to six clubs ... to help clubs build 'Centres of Excellence' . . . It is expected South Sydney will be handed money to build at Heffron Park in Maroubra, Canterbury Bulldogs at Belmore, Sydney Roosters at Moore Park, Cronulla at Shark Park and Newcastle Knights at Hunter Stadium."

I have no clue why I appear to be close to a lone voice on this, but let me say it loud and proud, regardless.

Friends, this is a DISGRACE.

To make a statement of the bleeding bloody obvious, the NSW Government has no business handing out taxpayer funds to elite sporting BUSINESESS, that make their own money already – the NRL itself is a billion dollar business – at a time when community sport is crying out for resources!

And yes of course the government is dressing up their largesse with the plan that the new centres of excellence will also be open to local communities.

No, really! You'll wander along, and right next to you, as you do the leg press, Greg Inglis will be doing bench presses! In the manner of classic trickle-down economics – let us spend billions knocking down and rebuilding elite stadiums, and the wealth will trickle all the way down to struggle street – this has it, that by putting this money into NRL clubs, the poorer people will benefit, too.

Who is going to stop this madness?

Instead of yet more trickle-down nonsense, if this money is earmarked for sport, why not put it directly to where it is most needed? Instead of putting that money in the middle of money-making operations that are already well resourced, why not put it to one of the "674 priority community sport projects" recently identified by the NSW Office of Sport, which are CRYING OUT for funds?

Netball courts! Tennis courts! Basketball courts! Green fields! Velodromes! Skateboard rinks!

Just how obvious is it that if the NSW Government has a spare $40 million to give to sport, these are the kind of projects that need it, NOT elite sport? I have told the story before, of how at Northern Suburbs Basketball Association, a couple of decades ago, we were able to raise, with the help of North Sydney Council, and a little from the NSW Government, $3 million to build the Crows Nest Sports Centre with four basketball courts, that can also be used for netball and many other community activities – that go from 6 am to 10.45 pm. It is a fantastic resource, totally self-sustaining as it is now funded by our 5500 members, of all ages, from 5 years old to 85 years-old. As well resourced as it is, it now has a long waiting list.

Why can't that be the model for community sport across the state?

But $40 million of taxpayers' money so that rugby league clubs can upgrade to having "Centres of Excellence?" It is madness and electoral suicide – and more and more in the NSW Government know it. Let us see if sanity might prevail sometime between now and next Tuesday, when the Premier is set to announce the $40 million hand-out.

And let us see if she will still maintain the demonstrable nonsense of the $2 billion being paid back in two years.

Who stops this madness gets to be Premier – and if it is Ms Berejklian herself, all good!


http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...o-offer-40m-to-nrl-clubs-20171213-h046tb.html

My worry about this funding for the Centre of Excellence is that the Wests Tigers seem to have missed out. I heard for ages the club had made a good submission for funding yet we are overlooked again.

What is going on, does the Wests Tigers board have no power politically to get the funding?
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
My worry about this funding for the Centre of Excellence is that the Wests Tigers seem to have missed out. I heard for ages the club had made a good submission for funding yet we are overlooked again.

What is going on, does the Wests Tigers board have no power politically to get the funding?
It is reliant on the club coming up with the money in the first place for the government to match. Since the government is limited to sharing $40m amongst 9 clubs, If they don't believe a club will have the funds to finish the project they will go with another submission.
 

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