General Discussion Thread

[herbert henry1908]

What about St George? He left their pathways a complete mess.
A lot of Canterbury's current issues are directly attributable to Hasler and his player policy. He doesn't believe that you can have junior development, only buy whoever he wants with no eye to the future.

How did he leave them a mess? is there evidence that it was his doing?

 

[Fangs]

The key criticism is that he doesn't build teams, which is kind of true.

But does he destroy clubs? No.

Newcastle were 1 game from a grand final. The next year Alex McKinnon breaks his back and Nathan Tinkler realises he can't fulfil his promises.

The Dragons were great under him, before and after they were a soft club who couldn't take the next step. Kinda like ours.

He is just a coach who gets more out of his players than most coaches can. With our lineup I'm certain he'd have us in the top 4...wonder why we didn't chase him in the first place?

-_-

 

[TL51]

But he could have done much better with the roster question. How about words to the effect of "we (the committee) felt that the moves we made this year were appropriate given ongoing cap considerations and the needs of the squad." He could even point out that the squad just came off a 7 game win streak. But "not my squad" and "hey there are other people making decisions too" felt very evasive and (as mentioned by others) likely to provoke a negative reaction in at least some of the guys who have to put on the jersey in a few days time.

Other than that I thought he generally went ok. He looked nervous though. I think his confidence has been severely rocked this year. I know it's popular to rag on him, but I don't think he's as bad a coach as he's shown in this second stint. I'd never thought about it this way, but watching him go through that it struck me that coaches almost certainly go through form slumps in the same way players do and he was likely going through one here. Hopefully things settle down for him next year.

I trust him over Raymond on what happened in the tunnel too. Cleary played Kent outright calling him a liar with a ton of class, pointing out that he wasnt the one accusing anyone of anything.

What pieces of slime those two are.

I prefer your response to the roster question than Ivan’s, but I would hope his players are more in tune with him than to respond negatively on game day to what was said in the interview.

Ivan’s been a successful coach. He wouldn’t have been employed in so many head coach roles if he wasn’t. Whilst I’m not writing off our chances this year, the loss last week hurt. It highlighted that priority number one for next year is an attacking coach. Melbourne and Roosters have good defensive head coaches in Bellamy and Robinson, and Cooper Cronk comparing the two outlined how both stuck with defence as their focus. Regarding Bellamy, he said something like “doesn’t leave his lane” or sticks with what he knows and leaves attack to those who enjoy and are better coaching attack. Ivan does coach defence well. He needs a better attacking assistant (sorry Wal). As voiced by someone earlier, if Luai is going to be our Thurston, Nathan could be our Cronk (or Smith)

Also, 100% trust Ivan over Raymond regarding the tunnel incident. His response to that question was very classy.

 

[herbert henry1908]

I prefer your response to the roster question than Ivan’s, but I would hope his players are more in tune with him than to respond negatively on game day to what was said in the interview.

Ivan’s been a successful coach. He wouldn’t have been employed in so many head coach roles if he wasn’t. Whilst I’m not writing off our chances this year, the loss last week hurt. It highlighted that priority number one for next year is an attacking coach. Melbourne and Roosters have good defensive head coaches in Bellamy and Robinson, and Cooper Cronk comparing the two outlined how both stuck with defence as their focus. Regarding Bellamy, he said something like “doesn’t leave his lane” or sticks with what he knows and leaves attack to those who enjoy and are better coaching attack. Ivan does coach defence well. He needs a better attacking assistant (sorry Wal). As voiced by someone earlier, if Luai is going to be our Thurston, Nathan could be our Cronk (or Smith)

Also, 100% trust Ivan over Raymond regarding the tunnel incident. His response to that question was very classy.

I don't understand this idea that he wouldn't have been given so many gigs if he wasn't a good coach.

This is rugby league we're talking about, it's one hell of a mates club, has been forever. Ivan himself admitted that it was his friendship with Gus that brought him to the panthers, it was his friendship with Pascoe that took him to the Tigers, and finally it was his friendship with Dave O'Neill that brought him back here.

The record shows he's not a successful coach. Sure, you can argue there's some mitigating circumstances for that. but the record itself is plain to see. He's had very limited success.

He's never won a Grand Final.

He's never finished higher than 4th spot on the ladder.

He's only twice been to the preliminary finals in his 12 seasons as a coach

He's been to the finals 5 times out of 12 seasons

His win record is 45%


I don't look at that and see success, I see very average results.

 

[TL51]

I don't understand this idea that he wouldn't have been given so many gigs if he wasn't a good coach.

Ivan’s a proven rebuilder of clubs. This is a new challenge for him. If he can experience GF success with us, it won’t matter what his overall winning percentage is. We’ll all just be happy to experience premiership success again.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Ivan’s a proven rebuilder of clubs. This is a new challenge for him. If he can experience GF success with us, it won’t matter what his overall winning percentage is. We’ll all just be happy to experience premiership success again.

That’s a mighty big IF

No coach has ever won their first premiership after the 300 game mark. Someone else mentioned he’s very much in the Brian Smith mould, just doesn’t have what it takes to go that final step.

The fact he’s a rebuilder makes it even more crazy we gave him the job, we didn’t need rebuilding. We needed a coach that could come in from day one and get success. He’s failed.

 

[Panther FIRE]

A question for those who have inside knowledge of the Panthers footy department, how much of an influence has Ben Harden had on the group that debuted this year? Is he a significant reason why these guys are able to debut so early and, seemly, handle the pressure of NRL? Also, is he a future NRL coach?

 

[soc123_au]

A question for those who have inside knowledge of the Panthers footy department, how much of an influence has Ben Harden had on the group that debuted this year? Is he a significant reason why these guys are able to debut so early and, seemly, handle the pressure of NRL? Also, is he a future NRL coach?

Not sure Ben. Just be patient and do the best job you can. You will find out when they review at the end of the year.

 

[franklin2323]

Not sure Ben. Just be patient and do the best job you can. You will find out when they review at the end of the year.

 

[franklin2323]

Naden might be a hog but he hasn't blown 2 certain tries like Elliott has

 

[OldPanther]

Naden might be a hog but he hasn't blown 2 certain tries like Elliott has

He's bombed a few.

 

[Fangs]

Roosters pulling a Sharks. Finding a reason to get insulted because of the attention on Tedesco's contract.

Seibold's comments weren't inflammatory at all.

 

[OldPanther]

Roosters pulling a Sharks. Finding a reason to get insulted because of the attention on Tedesco's contract.

Seibold's comments weren't inflammatory at all.

His comments were dumb as.

 

[franklin2323]

Roosters pulling a Sharks. Finding a reason to get insulted because of the attention on Tedesco's contract.

Seibold's comments weren't inflammatory at all.

Nope not at all. Sticking up for a club captain is a good sign for a club

 

[Fangs]

His comments were dumb as.

In what way?

It was a comparison, not a slight. Boyd sucks but his coach is just trying to stand up for him.

 

[OldPanther]

In what way?

It was a comparison, not a slight. Boyd sucks but his coach is just trying to stand up for him.

He dragged another player into an argument because his player is under performing and he wanted to deflect. A player who just won a premiership with his halves partner having a broken shoulder, beat a top 4 team the week before and came off a really bad concussion recently.

It was a ridiculous comparison to make from not being accurate to Keary not deserving to be shit on for another players failings.

 

[ACTPanthers]

I agree with @OldPanther on this one - Seibold was right in sticking up for his player (even if the criticism was deserved), but to throw another player, from another team, into the firing line was the absolute wrong way to go about it.

 

[franklin2323]

He dragged another player into an argument because his player is under performing and he wanted to deflect. A player who just won a premiership with his halves partner having a broken shoulder, beat a top 4 team the week before and came off a really bad concussion recently.

It was a ridiculous comparison to make from not being accurate to Keary not deserving to be shit on for another players failings.

Were the stats wrong he quoted though?

 

[Fangs]

He dragged another player into an argument because his player is under performing and he wanted to deflect. A player who just won a premiership with his halves partner having a broken shoulder, beat a top 4 team the week before and came off a really bad concussion recently.

It was a ridiculous comparison to make from not being accurate to Keary not deserving to be shit on for another players failings.

The comparison was on runs/metres gained last weekend in relation to press coverage.

If Seibold was asked a follow up question: 'Do you believe Darius is as good as Luke Keary?'...then this wouldn't even be a story. Seibold would freely admit who is better and the Roosters wouldn't have an opportunity to have a cry.

And I'd bet Keary isn't actually upset. It's just a smokescreen for Tedesco. And a bit of muscle flexing because the Broncos are shit and they don't want to antagonize the Storm too much right now.

 

[Fangs]

I hope Seibold compares Darius to Nathan Cleary after tonight's match. Then we will also get a chance to be upset.