HDDVD officially canned: Toshiba bails

[Simo]

Toshiba to exit HD DVD, end format war-NHK



TOKYO (Reuters) - Toshiba Corp is planning to stop production of equipment compatible with the HD DVD format for high-definition video, allowing the competing Blu-Ray camp a free run, public broadcaster NHK reported on Saturday.
Toshiba is expected to suffer losses amounting to tens of billions of yen (hundreds of millions of dollars) to scrap production of HD DVD players and recorders and other steps to exit the business, Japan's NHK said on its website.
No one at Toshiba could be reached for comment.
The format war between the Toshiba-backed HD DVD and Sony Corp's Blu-Ray, often compared to the Betamax-VHS battle in the 1980s, has slowed the development of what is expected to be a multibillion dollar high-definition DVD industry.
Toshiba was dealt a blow on Friday when Wal-Mart Stores Inc said it would abandon the HD DVD format, becoming the latest in a series of top retailers and movie studios to rally behind Blu-ray technology for high definition DVDs.
Toshiba plans to continue selling HD DVD equipment at stores for the time being but will not put resources into developing new devices, NHK said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/wtMostRead/idUSL1627196120080216

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The writing has been on the wall the last few months with blow after blow being handed to the format.

Whilst I think it were the better format I gotta say its a good thing for the industry as format wars are no good.

So it looks like Blu Ray takes the match, I just hope the DRM shortcomings of the format dont drive us all insane!

 

[Danish]

HD DVD could have been saved if they had only thought to partner up with Microsoft and build it into the 360.

But i own a PS3 and never shelled out for the stupid add on player for my 360 so I give no f**k :lol:

Sony execs must all be walking around pinching each other. When was the last time they won a war like this?

 

[SpaceMonkey]

HD DVD could have been saved if they had only thought to partner up with Microsoft and build it into the 360.

But i own a PS3 and never shelled out for the stupid add on player for my 360 so I give no f**k :lol:

Sony execs must all be walking around pinching each other. When was the last time they won a war like this?

MS Probably wanted to keep the price of the 360 down in order to sell more consoles and get the jump on the PS3 (a tactic which largely suceeded). I doubt MS really cared too much which HD format won really, so they were never going to let it eat into the profitability of their console sales. They'll probably just announce a Blu-Ray add on for the 360 now!

It's also going to be interesting to see if computer manufacturers start offering Blu-Ray drive options now, a lot of them appeared to be holding off and waiting for a winner to emerge.

 

[perverse]

it's a shame... hddvd was the more open and logical format. now we have to live with the DRM infested... region locked heap of sh*t that is bluray.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

it's a shame... hddvd was the more open and logical format. now we have to live with the DRM infested... region locked heap of sh*t that is bluray.

Marketing will usually win over good tech, unfortunately.

 

[Danish]

MS Probably wanted to keep the price of the 360 down in order to sell more consoles and get the jump on the PS3 (a tactic which largely suceeded). I doubt MS really cared too much which HD format won really, so they were never going to let it eat into the profitability of their console sales. They'll probably just announce a Blu-Ray add on for the 360 now!

It's also going to be interesting to see if computer manufacturers start offering Blu-Ray drive options now, a lot of them appeared to be holding off and waiting for a winner to emerge.

If Toshiba were clever they would have taken the loss on their own, so MS's profitability on the system (which did not exist anyway) would not be effected.

All those 360s out there working as HD DVD players for several months before the PS3 was even released could have almost assured victory for Toshiba, all for the short term cost of bundling a free HD DVD drive into the 360.

Very poor strategy by Toshiba.

 

[Danish]

it's a shame... hddvd was the more open and logical format. now we have to live with the DRM infested... region locked heap of sh*t that is bluray.

Film studios and retailers dont see DRM and region locking as a problem with Blu Ray. If anything its probably one of the reasons they backed it (more money for them that way)

 

[perverse]

Marketing will usually win over good tech, unfortunately.

yep... sad isn't it?

Film studios and retailers dont see DRM and region locking as a problem with Blu Ray. If anything its probably one of the reasons they backed it (more money for them that way)

indeed, but it's terrible for the consumer.

it's really a classic example of why/where capitalism is failing us.

 

[Danish]

indeed, but it's terrible for the consumer.

it's really a classic example of why/where capitalism is failing us.

Capitalism is failing us because I can't play DVDs bought in china in Australia?

 

[Simo]

Danish, I agree with you in that HD DVD built into the 360 would have given it a big leg up, however it was sonys buying of the vast majority of movie studios due to their DRM sh*t that was the other big factor.

Toshiba just had trouble getting studio support.

Even with the PS3 built in blu ray and not on the 360, I believe if all studios were dual format it would have won out.

But with the combination of both studio support and PS3 support blu ray it is.

Im glad the 360 didnt have HD DVD built in though as I think the price and delays of the PS3 for blu ray are not very good.

hi def will be primed for the next gen imo.

DRM can and will be broken, so we are to end up with restrictions and downscales for many innocent buyers of the format and those who the studios are trying to protect from will continue unaffected.

 

[perverse]

Capitalism is failing us because I can't play DVDs bought in china in Australia?

because the pursuit of money is rarely in the best interests of the general majority (or the human race as a whole) - including the suppression of good/better technology for no other reason than greed.

another example - do you really think it's technology holding back the electric car?

but don't get me started.. i'll start sounding like a tinfoil hat wearing nutjob in a minute.

 

[perverse]

DRM can and will be broken, so we are to end up with restrictions and downscales for many innocent buyers of the format and those who the studios are trying to protect from will continue unaffected.

indeed, the DRM already has been broken. it's a major pain in the rectal cavity though.

 

[Danish]

because the pursuit of money is rarely in the best interests of the general majority (or the human race as a whole) - including the suppression of good/better technology for no other reason than greed.

another example - do you really think it's technology holding back the electric car?

but don't get me started.. i'll start sounding like a tinfoil hat wearing nutjob in a minute.

The killing of the electric car (which, if you really want to get into it, is only a band aid solution anyway), is a far cry from not being allowed to play movies bought cheaply and legally in china in Australia.

A lack of DRM on HD DVD only makes it a superior technology for those looking to break the law. It has never been a hindrance to me, and I dont see any problems with a studio wanting to enforce the contract between them and their customers which are so often broken.

And besides all that, DRM is a snap to crack anyway. Just wait until Aldi releases a mega cheap Blu Ray player and voila!

 

[Simo]

The killing of the electric car (which, if you really want to get into it, is only a band aid solution anyway), is a far cry from not being allowed to play movies bought cheaply and legally in china in Australia.

A lack of DRM on HD DVD only makes it a superior technology for those looking to break the law. It has never been a hindrance to me, and I dont see any problems with a studio wanting to enforce the contract between them and their customers which are so often broken.

And besides all that, DRM is a snap to crack anyway. Just wait until Aldi releases a mega cheap Blu Ray player and voila!

What about the customers who bought a blu ray player and they have since upped the specs needed for copy protection on the newer players rendering features unuseable on earlier players and things like that?

Like if your expensive full hd TV bought in the last few years doesnt have the latest HDCP spec and the DRM will downscale your image! Fuggin stupid!!

IMO punishing legit customers to try and stop something you cant stop anyway is not good business.

DVD has been one of the most easily copyable formats ever and has still sold like hotcakes at retail stores.

 

[perverse]

A lack of DRM on HD DVD only makes it a superior technology for those looking to break the law. It has never been a hindrance to me, and I dont see any problems with a studio wanting to enforce the contract between them and their customers which are so often broken.

right...

it's also a pain in the arse for anyone who would like to create a backup of said media. i have many problems with the way copyright law is worded and enforced, particularly is regards to media formats.

it's also a pain in the arse for anyone who likes to import movies/tv series/whatever. this is something that i, and a lot of people i know would take great advantage of... but because we can't purchase it on our shores we can't view the material unless we turn to piracy.

just because it's never been a hindrance to you, doesn't mean it is not a hindrance to other law abiding people. frequently i have had no other choice but to break the law if i wanted to watch a certain movie, tv series, etc. it doesn't have to be this way.

you see, intellectual property laws are old and have struggled to adapt with the times. it is now possible to own the same movie on how many different formats? 5? 10? and each time they re-release the same sh*t, they charge you again and again and again for the same interllectual property. realistically once you have bought the rights to consume that IP.. you should be able to view it on any media, be it solid state, magnetic disk drive, optical disk, whatever. it's just double/triple/quadruple/quintuple/etc dipping the pot. the law already recognizes that when you buy a DVD, the plastic the movie is on is worthless.. you are buying the right to view it. the law needs to take the extra steps.

why shouldn't mrs. average joe be able to make a copy of the kids favourite movie so the original doesn't get scratched? why should i not be able to legally purchase a movie from overseas that cannot be bought in australia and watch it on my dvd/bluray/whatever player? why am i not allowed to store a movie that i have bought with my hard earned on my hard drive, so if i lose or destroy my original, i can make more?

the laws can be changed to accomodate all these things - and if they were.. i guarentee there would be a substantial decrease in piracy, but woe is me... the movie studios wont be able to make anymore money by re-releasing star wars again.

i implore you to do your own research regarding DRM and copyright laws in regards to digital media.

 

[perverse]

What about the customers who bought a blu ray player and they have since upped the specs needed for copy protection on the newer players rendering features unuseable on earlier players and things like that?

Like if your expensive full hd TV bought in the last few years doesnt have the latest HDCP spec and the DRM will downscale your image! Fuggin stupid!!

IMO punishing legit customers to try and stop something you cant stop anyway is not good business.

DVD has been one of the most easily copyable formats ever and has still sold like hotcakes at retail stores.

another very simple and true point.

i forgot to address this too:

The killing of the electric car (which, if you really want to get into it, is only a band aid solution anyway), is a far cry from not being allowed to play movies bought cheaply and legally in china in Australia.

it isn't any different at all when you are talking motives. $$$

another thing.. how is the electric car a bandaid solution? even if it is - a bandaid solution is a bit better than no solution at all.

 

[Caged Panther]

Personally I'm dissapointed in this as having both the 360 HD-DVD drive and the PS3 I feel HD-DVD is the better of the two formats as far as consumer experience goes. I'm still yet to see anything from any other studio on either blu-ray or HD-DVD that matches what Universal managed to do withtheir U-control and I believe they were able to do this because of the way various things were implemented in HD-DVD. I also loved the ability to import HD-DVD without having to worry about them being region locked.

Having said that I haven't developed a large (and therefore haven't invested a huge amount of money) HD-DVD collection so I'm not crying to much. Ultimately what I want is movies and I believe having one format will expediate the rate at which some of my movies get the hi-def treatment.

 

[Eelectrica]

Right with you Perverse on all points.
I Recently I purchased the LG Blu Ray/HD-DVD player. Had both bases covered. Just hope Slysoft can live up to there promise of cracking BD++ protection. They keep promising but are yet to deliver...

 

[Danish]

What about the customers who bought a blu ray player and they have since upped the specs needed for copy protection on the newer players rendering features unuseable on earlier players and things like that?

Like if your expensive full hd TV bought in the last few years doesnt have the latest HDCP spec and the DRM will downscale your image! Fuggin stupid!!

IMO punishing legit customers to try and stop something you cant stop anyway is not good business.

DVD has been one of the most easily copyable formats ever and has still sold like hotcakes at retail stores.

I imagine that firmware upgrades are readily available for earlier model Blu Ray players and would fix any such problems without a hitch.

If not, then the manufacturer of the player is at fault, not Sony.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Optical formats are on their way out anyway- you cn already compress a 720p movie into 5GB using H.264 compression, and with broaband speeds continually increasing and the price of flash memory dropping, flash or electronic delivery will be viable replacements very soon.