Hull sides to "merge" academy sides

[CC_Roosters]

Yet more laughable cost cutting by super league sides. First they canned reserves for dual reg. and now they are starting down the path of joint academies.

http://www.loverugbyleague.com/news_18919-hull-clubs-launch-joint-super-academy.html

The biggest clanger in the press release has to be

Hull FC owner Adam Pearson admitted that action needed to be taken to boost the size of the talent pool available to each club.

"We are extremely proud of our Academy set-up, its current RFL status of 'Outstanding' and the legacy it has created down the years, but we have to recognise when the time is right for development and growth," he said.

Just imagine that combining academy sides is going to somehow boost the size of the talent pool:roll:. Surely reducing it to side means less spots in the pathway available to local junors and therefore less players exposed to elite coaching! And yes nigel, clearly proud enough to put it out of existence.

Also never mind the problems around player selection which they are apparently will do with some sort of draft system, that is until an out and out superstar appears and the cat fight begins.

So who will be next in the brave new world of super academies, will we perhaps see wigan and st helens field one "super" academy or maybe even Leeds and london will overcome geography to field a merged side for the greater good.

Am i the only one who sees this ending in tears? Frankly i hope one of them gets relegated, lets see how long the partnership lasts
then.

 

[langpark]

This is very alarming. If two of the biggest clubs in the country are having to do this, it's not a good sign of things to come. The fact that they are bitter rivals too, means they would only ever do something like this as a last resort, so things must really be bad!

 

[Evil Homer]

This is f**king stupid. Hull FC are a joke, they are one of the biggest clubs in the league but their owner looks to cut costs at every turn, he opposed the marquee player rule, has appointed the cheapest possible coach and sticks with him despite clearly not fulfilling potential and now this. The RFL should step in to ban this immediately TBH.

 

[deluded pom?]

Just imagine that combining academy sides is going to somehow , that is until an out and out superstar appears and the cat fight begins.

The big problem there is the city of Hull rarely, if ever, produces out and out superstars. Good players occasionally and average players often but superstars?

 

[CC_Roosters]

The big problem there is the city of Hull rarely, if ever, produces out and out superstars. Good players occasionally and average players often but superstars?

Thatd not too say one wont appear at any time. The whole tbing is riddled with problems and the reasons given in the press statements contradict reality. Both have reasonably performing u19 sides and hull have the outstanding academy status, yet we aee going to see the pool of potential pro players halved in the city. These two sides boted to scrap the u21/reaerve comp so its just another obvious cost cut- short term gain for long term pain

 

[RedVee]

Shouldn't having an Academy set up be a prerequisite for SL status? ie shut your academy move down a League.

 

[CC_Roosters]

Shouldn't having an Academy set up be a prerequisite for SL status? ie shut your academy move down a League.

We could only dream of any sort of prerequisites and even if there was the rfl would hardly enforce them for fear of losing several current SL teams. Bottom line is many of the clubs have effectively voted to hinder their own growth and prospects for on field success. Surely idiots running fc and kr see that the current most consistent performing clubs are those wgo have invested most in the academy and structures. Ffs fc have a "outstanding" mark from the rfl and are going to piss it away and give another club access to its potential players becuase becuase the owners are penny pinchers. And i want to know how deep this goes is it only at u19 level or right down the age groups. If its right down the only future i can see is a merger imposed by idiot owners which would no doubt destroy both clubs fan bases. Reading around other forums and social media both sets of fans are seething so their next home games will be interesting

 

[langpark]

What's even more baffling, their academy sides both seem to be doing pretty well! In 3rd and 5th place right now...

 

[bowes]

This is actually a move that should be encouraged for other clubs. The youth game at amateur level is falling apart fast because of pro clubs signing up players they don't want (just to make up the numbers in their academy) and then spitting them out and seeing them leave the game. The amateur game at open age level has shrunk rapidly the last few years because of this

 

[nadera78]

This is actually a move that should be encouraged for other clubs. The youth game at amateur level is falling apart fast because of pro clubs signing up players they don't want (just to make up the numbers in their academy) and then spitting them out and seeing them leave the game. The amateur game at open age level has shrunk rapidly the last few years because of this

Yep, there is a scandalous waste of young players going on. The pool is too small, with every club fighting over the meagre resources. You'll produce just as many SL players via one joint academy as via two, probably more in fact because the playing/training/coaching levels will be higher and the players' development will effectively be hot-housed.

That said, this is clearly finance driven which goes back to points made umpteen times in the past that the game is simply too small and clubs are fighting over players, fans, investors, sponsors, administrators - essentially all the resources needed to sustain a pro competition. We've really only got enough to sustain a dozen clubs, and that includes 2 French.

 

[bowes]

We had the entire midlands junior league of nine clubs collapse after we set up one midlands academy side (though arguably one and a half including Sheffield who recruit heavily from the midlands)

 

[deluded pom?]

Hardly any players from either academy will go on to be regular first team player. Too many of the academy play are cannon fodder used to make sure Hull and Rovers meet their current commitments. The problem for me is the quality of coaching at junior level in Hull area. One amateur club in Wigan manages to produce more players for the professional game than the whole of Hull combined hence the lack of any "superstars" over the past years.

 

[CC_Roosters]

Yep, there is a scandalous waste of young players going on. The pool is too small, with every club fighting over the meagre resources. You'll produce just as many SL players via one joint academy as via two, probably more in fact because the playing/training/coaching levels will be higher and the players' development will effectively be hot-housed.

That said, this is clearly finance driven which goes back to points made umpteen times in the past that the game is simply too small and clubs are fighting over players, fans, investors, sponsors, administrators - essentially all the resources needed to sustain a pro competition. We've really only got enough to sustain a dozen clubs, and that includes 2 French.

I dint understand how the pathways work in england perhaps.someone could explain what happens typically. In australia the u16 and u18 district rep sides play a 7 game season plus finals which finish early in the nrl season. Some players are in the u18 age group are also in u20 squads but when the u16 finish many disperse back to play for local sides.

Why doesnt england implement a system where the academy players are still registered to amateur clubs? Would mean the amateur leagues get the players back when academies finish, would obviously need to start and finish any academy season earlier than present

Csn you see u21/reserves coming back to replace the dual reg farce?

 

[bowes]

I dint understand how the pathways work in england perhaps.someone could explain what happens typically. In australia the u16 and u18 district rep sides play a 7 game season plus finals which finish early in the nrl season. Some players are in the u18 age group are also in u20 squads but when the u16 finish many disperse back to play for local sides.

Why doesnt england implement a system where the academy players are still registered to amateur clubs? Would mean the amateur leagues get the players back when academies finish, would obviously need to start and finish any academy season earlier than present

Csn you see u21/reserves coming back to replace the dual reg farce?

They do that at Under 16s and it doesn't work. Basically means games get called off the weeks the academy plays as the clubs don't have enough players. (It's an 8 game season)

They've brought reserves back at Championship level but only 6 sides entered. Southern clubs can field reserve/feeder teams in the Conference League South. They're trying to introduce dual registration between northern semi pro sides and the National Conference League but it's to my knowledge not allowed yet

 

[Evil Homer]

This is actually a move that should be encouraged for other clubs. The youth game at amateur level is falling apart fast because of pro clubs signing up players they don't want (just to make up the numbers in their academy) and then spitting them out and seeing them leave the game. The amateur game at open age level has shrunk rapidly the last few years because of this

Is there any evidence to suggest that these players would be any more likely to stay in the game if they were never signed to pro clubs? Clubs previously had to sign enough players to fill an U15s, U16s, U18s and U20s/reserve team and it wasn't a problem then.

 

[deluded pom?]

What's even more baffling, their academy sides both seem to be doing pretty well! In 3rd and 5th place right now...

Don't confuse a healthy league position with a productive junior set up. Both Hull teams have performed well at this level before from a playing perspective but still haven't produced enough SL quality players to keep the first team squads topped up. This has been going on for decades, it's not a recent phenomenon. All they are doing is merging two poor systems. The result will be one poor but cheaper system. It's a financial decision pure and simple.