Jason Ryles - Head coach of Parramatta from 2025

[Poupou Escobar]

I'm just making anecdotal observation. I'm not implying any sort of link between options and win rate or what ever.

Feel free to look at all the rosters in the nrl yourself https://signings-tracker.nrl.com/

I already have. I don’t see any correlation between player options and success, which is why you’re wasting your time complaining about them. They aren’t the reason we are underperforming.

 

[Pazza]

I already have. I don’t see any correlation between player options and success, which is why you’re wasting your time complaining about them. They aren’t the reason we are underperforming.

I never said it was the reason we were underperforming

 

[Kilkenny]

The Tigers have 1 PO 3 MO 1 CO

Panthers have zero options..... take from that what you will

I could be wrong but I don’t think our club has ever gone the path of player options or mutual options.

Stand to be corrected.

I tend to think you just sign a player to a deal whatever it may be and run with it.

If a player seeks a an early release for whatever reason consider it on its merit such as in our case around JFH.

He wants to go back to NZ and we released him on compassionate grounds.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Given the talent evaluation of comparing him to Dylan Brown. You give him a good deal. You give him the kinda deal that a 18 year old sg ball player and his family would be silly to refuse.

Like the one the Roosters gave Jackson Hastings? Paying overs for a kid who’s never played against grown men is a massive risk. There’s why no other club made this sort of offer either. Is it worse to lose a talented youngster or be stuck with a poor performer on big money for years? At least if he leaves you have his cap money to spend elsewhere.

Honestly have you ever seen a contract like that before?

The player wanted to test the market or he would’ve been locked up long ago. Players happy to sign early and not go to market were Arthur and Guymer. Greedy merkins are out of the club’s hands.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Melbourne don't have three highly paid players all coming off contract at the same time on POs they ain't that silly.

Here, you can read about the intentions of one of our stars who has a PO

Penisini to decide future after looming Eels changes

Parramatta centre Will Penisini will wait until after he sees the impact of new coach Jason Ryles at the NRL club before deciding if he will stay long term.

au.sports.yahoo.com

The intentions of players with POs is the same as for the ones without them. When their contract ends they will negotiate a new one. Just like RCG when he didn’t take up his 2022 option.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Huh? How do you draw that long bow from what was actually said?

Are player options a disaster or not? Or only when we use them?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Lol, f**king Penisini's on a PO as well . We couldn't make up a situation so ludicrous if we tried.

He can walk out elsewhere imo - but Penisini's decline in form means he won't be able to get any higher than our apparently "lowball" PO offer.

I’m certain he will get higher offers. His form reflects the opportunities provided by our team this year. Our club will be aware of it and so will rival clubs. He turns 22 this year and is already one of the more powerful centres in the NRL. His price will only rise.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

I could be wrong but I don’t think our club has ever gone the path of player options or mutual options.

Stand to be corrected.

I tend to think you just sign a player to a deal whatever it may be and run with it.

If a player seeks a an early release for whatever reason consider it on its merit such as in our case around JFH.

He wants to go back to NZ and we released him on compassionate grounds.

Who needs player options when you’ve got Keno TPAs to keep prices down

 

[the phantom menace]

Are player options a disaster or not? Or only when we use them?

Read my posts in the thread above.

Are you trying to claim it's somehow a success when a player activates their PO (because they can't get a pay rise through another offer), when the club has already budgeted for and was just waiting for that layer decision?

 

[Pazza]

The intentions of players with POs is the same as for the ones without them. When their contract ends they will negotiate a new one. Just like RCG when he didn’t take up his 2022 option.

I'm just not going to keep going around in circles.

For the last time, it's not about the option, it's about when the player can take up the option. Round 11 was the case for Blaize so I am running off that for all our players.

How can we make decisions on re signing guys like RCG, Joe O, Hopgood etc when we have no idea on the status of players like Matterson and Lane?? How do we go to market for an outside back with no clarity around Penisini and Sivo???

Pre season training started this year on Nov 6, that's a week into free agency. You already got Penisini saying he isn't in a rush to make a decision. I'm sure Dylan, lane, sivo, matto are all thinking the same way. How much cap does that represent?? 2.5 million?

How is this good management from the club???

 

[the phantom menace]

His price will only rise.

As will almost anyone aged under 30 under a player option, in a growth/expansion market.

Hence the point that POs are useless, in that they don't bring down the contract values in any way like you're unsuccessfully trying to assert or argue as a benefit.

 

[Pazza]

As will almost anyone aged under 30 under a player option, in a growth/expansion market.

Hence the point that POs are useless, in that they don't bring down the contract values in any way like you're unsuccessfully trying to assert or argue as a benefit.

Even if the PO brings down the value of the first contract [which i am not convinced in our case], it ensures maximum value for the player on the second contract.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Read my posts in the thread above.

Are you trying to claim it's somehow a success when a player activates their PO (because they can't get a pay rise through another offer), when the club has already budgeted for and was just waiting for that layer decision?

No, I’m saying a PO can only be detrimental when the player activates it, because he has presumably dropped in value and might now be on overs.

When a player declines to activate the PO it is no different than if there was no PO in the first place, except that the club got the benefit (when the contract was negotiated) of selling the PO to the player in lieu of money. It’s like the club has sold insurance to the player. If the player never collects (by activating the PO) then the club has benefited.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

I'm just not going to keep going around in circles.

For the last time, it's not about the option, it's about when the player can take up the option. Round 11 was the case for Blaize so I am running off that for all our players.

How can we make decisions on re signing guys like RCG, Joe O, Hopgood etc when we have no idea on the status of players like Matterson and Lane?? How do we go to market for an outside back with no clarity around Penisini and Sivo???

Pre season training started this year on Nov 6, that's a week into free agency. You already got Penisini saying he isn't in a rush to make a decision. I'm sure Dylan, lane, sivo, matto are all thinking the same way. How much cap does that represent?? 2.5 million?

How is this good management from the club???

The club agreed to whatever deadlines are in place. If you’ve thought of it, the club no doubt has. They are accountants after all.

As for waiting for players to make a decision, how is it any different to offering new contracts to your own players or trying to sign new ones? We didn’t even know Lomax was going to be in next year’s salary cap until round six. Penrith didn’t know Talagi was going to be in their salary cap until round 21. No club has their entire salary cap sorted ten months out from preseason. You’re having a sook about nothing, and rugby league journos are laughing at you.

 

[Pazza]

The club agreed to whatever deadlines are in place. If you’ve thought of it, the club no doubt has. They are accountants after all.

this is a club that cheated the cap to win a spoon...

 

[the phantom menace]

No, I’m saying a PO can only be detrimental when the player activates it, because he has presumably dropped in value and might now be on overs.

But what about the impact of waiting time (for whether the player takes it up or not) on forward planning and other alternatives we miss out on in the meantime. Look up opportunity cost - you're welcome.

When a player declines to activate the PO it is no different than if there was no PO in the first place, except that the club got the benefit (when the contract was negotiated) of selling the PO to the player in lieu of money. It’s like the club has sold insurance to the player. If the player never collects (by activating the PO) then the club has benefited.

I think you vastly overstate the supposed equivalence of a PO being in lieu of money. The club has to budget for it in case it needs to honour it, and so is hamstrung from flexibility they'd otherwise enjoy in the meantime.

Just offer and sign players for how long you want them for on that contract in the first place, keep it simple instead of the poor business of being bent over by player managers for options.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

As will almost anyone aged under 30 under a player option, in a growth/expansion market.

Hence the point that POs are useless, in that they don't bring down the contract values in any way like you're unsuccessfully trying to assert or argue as a benefit.

They bring down contract values in the non-PO years because the PO is sold by the club to the player. It is exchanged for something (compared to the same contract without a PO) and that something is cash. Just like how you buy insurance.

 

[the phantom menace]

If you’ve thought of it, the club no doubt has. They are accountants after all.

Really? You seriously believe that?

Your logic suggests that people in these/all jobs are somehow beyond criticism from anyone who is not in that job at that exact moment... what an amazing top-down respect-all-authority world, where no alternate ideas could possibly shine a light on potential improvements.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

this is a club that cheated the cap to win a spoon...

We were top four when we were caught cheating the cap.

 

[the phantom menace]

They bring down contract values in the non-PO years because the PO is sold by the club to the player.

Nonsense and piffle. Source?

It is exchanged for something (compared to the same contract without a PO) and that something is cash. Just like how you buy insurance.

Yeah... nah. No-one gets insurance because they think it's good value expenditure, we do it begrudgingly. It's more like how the government had to legislate compulsory employer superannuation contributions because merkins just wouldn't f**king save!

The player (and their manager) wouldn't sign for lower than they thought they were worth, just for the mystical benefits of the PO - which they know full well they can take or leave when it suits them, and if they don't take it up the club still panders to them to make a deal. It doesn't benefit the club, it traps the club.