Moving the Western Sydney Panthers to Blacktown

[Lambretta]

Moving the club isn't going to fix the marketing, membership attraction, membership retention etc problems that we have. I think the biggest part of this is going to be on field success and consistency. This is how the club will attract fans and players (and money).

Exactly - Penrith has quite a large geographical area, but many of the people that move to the West, from Blacktown to Penrith and beyond usually have a traditional family team that they follow. Lots of supporters from Souths and Easts traditional heartland live in Sydney's West as they've been priced out of the beachside and inner city suburbs.

You can't change things overnight. Many people in their 40's from Blacktown would support Parramatta or the Bulldogs because they were successful for prolonged periods in the 80s.

If Penrith enjoy a sustained period of success (admittedly harder in the modern comp with the current salary cap format) then many young kids in the Penrith and Blacktown area would naturally want to follow their local team.

But very few are going to get on board and go against their parents preferences if the local team isn't successful.

A case of field it and they will come.

 

[1 Eyed TEZZA]

Exactly - Penrith has quite a large geographical area, but many of the people that move to the West, from Blacktown to Penrith and beyond usually have a traditional family team that they follow. Lots of supporters from Souths and Easts traditional heartland live in Sydney's West as they've been priced out of the beachside and inner city suburbs.

You can't change things overnight. Many people in their 40's from Blacktown would support Parramatta or the Bulldogs because they were successful for prolonged periods in the 80s.

If Penrith enjoy a sustained period of success (admittedly harder in the modern comp with the current salary cap format) then many young kids in the Penrith and Blacktown area would naturally want to follow their local team.

But very few are going to get on board and go against their parents preferences if the local team isn't successful.

A case of field it and they will come.

Agree. I grew up in the area for 20 years and more people follow other teams then the Panthers. Parra and the Bulldogs easily have the most support.

It's improving. There is support for Penrith. Just getting them to the games seems to be near impossible.

 

[umina panther]

Wasn't impossible during 2003-2004. The right moves are being made now after the club being run by incompetent fools in the past

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Exactly - Penrith has quite a large geographical area, but many of the people that move to the West, from Blacktown to Penrith and beyond usually have a traditional family team that they follow. Lots of supporters from Souths and Easts traditional heartland live in Sydney's West as they've been priced out of the beachside and inner city suburbs.

You can't change things overnight. Many people in their 40's from Blacktown would support Parramatta or the Bulldogs because they were successful for prolonged periods in the 80s.

If Penrith enjoy a sustained period of success (admittedly harder in the modern comp with the current salary cap format) then many young kids in the Penrith and Blacktown area would naturally want to follow their local team.

But very few are going to get on board and go against their parents preferences if the local team isn't successful.

A case of field it and they will come.

I think you're missing my point. When I say "move the panthers to blacktown" I'm not saying give up on their current area and find new fans, I'm saying a stadium in blacktown is probably more likely to draw attendance than a stadium in Penrith.

The Panthers probably have the same 8,000 diehards that every team has. The difference is that other teams are better located to make people think "hey, the footy's on. May as well go". But Penrith doesn't get this; their crowds probably consist of a greater percentage of locals than any other team. Penrith just doesn't seem to draw their opponents fan base.

Blacktown, on the other hand, gets trains from Penrith, parra and Liverpool.

Penrith could stay the "Penrith Panthers", train out of Penrith and build that academy, but then play out of Blacktown. And Parra could really do the same.

 

[betcats]

f**k that.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

f**k that.

Why?

 

[docbrown]

A Stadium in Liverpool to be used by Canterbury & Wests in the south-west and a stadium in Blacktown representing the north-west would be ideal for stadium rationalisation.

Yes the Oasis development at Liverpool could have been a major boom to both the Bulldogs & Tigers.

Doc that population growth though is likely to come from people in other areas of nsw and qland moving into the region, not birth increases.

Yes I've always said the biggest problem the Panthers face is converting new locals with existing rugby league loyalties to become Panthers fans. Success helps (you could only do so much in the salary cap age though) but so does local relevance. These people because of their new distance to their existing clubs (meaning they attend less and less likely to be members) would be worth more to the game if they re-affiliated and become stronger fans of nearby clubs like Eels & Panthers. It's not an impossible task - what I'm talking about is a 20-30 years process. They'll never convert everyone but they don't have.

A good example is the Newcastle Knights when they were introduced. Every league fan had an existing club loyalty, Knights came in, converted a decent enough % and that number still grows with time. There's still a large percentage of Hunter rugby league fans that don't follow the Knights and never will but the club has managed to become one of the strongest in the league. The Panthers can do likewise, even more so as they have access to a much larger population in Penrith-Blue Mountains-Hawkesbury-Blacktown-Hills.

The red area is Parra's. Black is Penrith's. The location now is exactly in the middle

I'd argue that anything within 10km either side of that border is up for grabs to whichever club wants it more.

This is kind of what i was trying to say, but its not specifically about the geographic centre. Blacktown currently the largest population of any western sydney city and its predicted to increase its "lead".

Its still easily accesable from Penrith, but its much easier to get to from the east (parramatta, ect.).

Penrith could stay the "Penrith Panthers", train out of Penrith and build that academy, but then play out of Blacktown. And Parra could really do the same.

It's definitely food for thought.

 

[POPEYE]

All it needs is for Parramatta and Penrith to become a consistent force in Rugby League, all this knee jerking about an AFL invasion is farcical. If Manly lived at Parramatta Stadium and Melbourne lived at Centrebet this conversation would be null and void.

Neither piss their pants over population statistics

 

[Lambretta]

The Panthers probably have the same 8,000 diehards that every team has. The difference is that other teams are better located to make people think "hey, the footy's on. May as well go". But Penrith doesn't get this; their crowds probably consist of a greater percentage of locals than any other team. Penrith just doesn't seem to draw their opponents fan base.

Blacktown, on the other hand, gets trains from Penrith, parra and Liverpool.

I suppose it depends on who they are playing - if they're playing Parramatta or Canterbury, Penrith do get quite a few away fans because many live in the area

But yes, I agree - if the team was based in Blacktown they would get larger crowds. I agree that's logical.

I just don't see it as logical moving there now because so many reasons prohibit it. If they were to be based in Blacktown they should have been based there from the start.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Penrith aren't a Sydney team though they are regional. It's would be like moving Newcastle to Gosford as there's more people there. That would make it harder for them to service to Cessnock etc. We are the same. The Mountains & Hawkesbury as well.

new housing estates of Caddens, Thornton, Jordan Springs are all within 10 mins from Centrebet. So it is definately growing. 2nd Airport coming if they use Richmond it's Penrith's catchment or Badgery's creek 20 mins the other side of the M4. So plenty happening around the region. So remaining Central is ideal

Its not quite the same. If, for example, Gosford suddenly had a population the size of Brisbane and there was no prospect of a new team being placed there, i would argue that it would be logical for the team to consider moving to the location that has the larger population centre while still being accessable to their original fans (direct public transport, ect.). Being slightly less accessable to the small population centres on the peripheries is a necessary evil in this case.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Also a state of the art venue and close to bars and clubs. Not to mention that the Broncos played there for the first 6 years of there existence.

QE2 was crap viewing experience, shit transport links and not centrally located (in public transport terms)

In relation to Penrith's region, this sounds incredibly like the current situation.

Shitty stadium, all major train likes coming from the east and not even close to being centrally located.

 

[forward pass]

Blacktown have poured millions of dollars of ratepayers money (usually directed towards community facilities and maintenance) into GWS - in the form of a ground and facilities which GWS later decided was not for them. Ha. They got sucked in hook line and sinker by Demetriou and the AFL gauntlet. Why would they now pour money into accommodating a Penrith based NRL team? The poor ratepayers will burn down the council - which they should have done anyway.

And also - I am sure Parra would be wrapped and fully support a relocation into the fringes of their local area! Next.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Itll be the State Government paying.

And for these teams, its really a decision between their current shitty and slowly deteriorating stadiums in their own little suburb or state of the art stadiums in large regional centres.

 

[franklin2323]

Its not quite the same. If, for example, Gosford suddenly had a population the size of Brisbane and there was no prospect of a new team being placed there, i would argue that it would be logical for the team to consider moving to the location that has the larger population centre while still being accessable to their original fans (direct public transport, ect.). Being slightly less accessable to the small population centres on the peripheries is a necessary evil in this case.

Yes but Blacktown is on the same train line as Penrith (Centrebet is a 10 min walk). Has no where near the parking as Penrith has. Bost importantly Centrebet is rented for $0 we cover the maintenance etc. The reason is businesses get the added business from that. Also does no guarantee the crowd will increase depends on which part of Blacktown because parts like Lalor Park, Seven Hills, Kellyville are Parramatta catchment