What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Mundine v Waters

El Duque

Bench
Messages
3,845
I think that Mundine is finished.

There are serious doubts to whether his Title shot will go ahead.

He's not welcome in the USA and I doubt any US fighters will fly out here to fight him.

Will any Australian pay to see him fight in person or on PPV?I doubt it.

No Rugby League club will go near him.

He has opened his trap one too many times and I'd bet London to a brick that he is finished.


 
V

Vertigo

Guest
Another thing, why would you continue to advertise this wanker on a St George site, when the guy practically bent you guys over by saying that if he returned to Rugby League it would be with Souths - <u>NOT</u> St Goerge. That's how much he thinks of his former club (your club). Snap out of it Willow. He's playing you (Dragon supporters) guys for a FOOL!

That's one thing that's always baffled me about Dragons fans and their continuing admiration for Mundine. Many Dragons supporters still think the sun shines out of this mans back side ..... for reasons that escape me.
As for his comments, I take very little notice of individuals who speak before they put their brain in operative mode. In Mundines case, I take no notice.

Good post Warlock. Could have toned it down a few decibles though.


Vertigo.
 
Messages
341
Considering he has walked out on them twice (first to make a laughing stock out of himself at the star-studded Broncos - and it was a walkout IMO -, and second mid-way through a regularseason), it beats be too why Saints fans still stick up for this guy.

To be quite honest, it doesn't, and didn't, surprise me the least bit when he made those comments on Sydney breakfast show. When it comes to being able to speak in a sensible manner and present himself in a prefessional way in the publics eye, the guy has no idea. Says a lot about 'Team Mundine' huh? Not one person in his camp with half a brain to show him how to act and what to say when confronted by the media.

He'll go a real long way. NOT.


Well done Anthony. Thanks for making yourself (and possibly Aussies) look like heartless pricks to the rest of the world.


 
Messages
4,446
He is gone...when this story explodes in America, this guy will get blackballed totally. I was surprised that Hoppas antics got reported in America earlier this year, just wait and see until this get media coverage...
Willow...I can understand your balanced view about Mundine, but in reality, he made a huge goose of himself and i think that some people are thinking that you are sticking up for him by not coming out directly and condemning these comments. Im not saying you are defending him, its just that some people may be interepreting it that way.....
MFC.
 

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
109,860
Warlock: Stick it up your arse. You sound like some hysterical old geezer.

It's my friggin choice if I want to have a few pics players (past and present) on my website ... not yours and not the 50 or 60 Nazis who have been sending me mindless emails all day.
If you read the content of some of this crap you wouldn't so quick to make a complete arse of yourself.... you sure you weren't one of them?
I've just taken the unprecedented step of removing my email link from the site. This is despite the fact that I also get friendly emails as well.
As far I'm concerned, theunreasonable nature of these emails has taken away my choice and that makes me pretty f*@kin angry... so just piss off with your half cocked analysis of the situation.
The only reason I mentioned it all was because I was pissed off and thought this was a good place to air my thoughts.

As for the your claim that you want to PUKE on me... let me just say that is totally uncalled for and rates as a personal insult in this forum. Take the advicegiven by another forummer and tone it down.

 

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
109,860
MFC: the story has already hit the news in the USA. A number of the emails are from Americans and they are saying things that would make your hair stand on end.
As far as I'm concerned the whole thing is out of control and people are are acting like lunatics.

As for the balanced view thing; at no time have I said that I agree with whatMundine has said but for some reason, the interpretation that I'm getting back is that I'm sticking up for him. This is because I choose not to be swept up in the hysteria of Mundine hating. 'If you're not with us... then you must be against us' type of mentality.
If people are so upset about it... send Mundine an email... or ignore it.

 
P

pepe

Guest
willow

you are the scapegoat once again,fairdinkum,last week it was kimmorley and this week it's mundine.

willow you seem to have away of attracting controversy,last night you deservedly got blasted for not honouring your duty,but i'll go into bat for you over the noddy and mundine saga,give the poor bastard a break for christ sakes!!!!!!

cheers pepe
 
A

AuckMel

Guest
The day when someone in this country can't express their views, thenthat dayis a sad day in Australian history.

Right or wrong, whatever YOU believe, anyone should be able to air their opinion.

The indidiviual then has to live with what he/she then said.

I don't agree with what Mundine said, but not for a minute would I deny him the right to his views.

It's pretty sad to seeWillow attacked personally for simply have a section on his website about Anthony Mundine.

Isn't this the sort of thing thatpeople currently fighting terrorism all around the world are trying to stamp out, gutless attacks on innocent people. ?


 

imported_T.B

Juniors
Messages
25
I’ve already posted this on the ‘competition boards’ under similar topics but thought it was relevant here too: I’m curious about this. All those that are so anti-Mundine over this whole issue – WHY? 1) Is it his choice of religion? 2) Is it the fact that it is perceived he is speaking for the entire muslim and aboriginal communities? 3) Is it his opinion on the American responsibility angle (and yes – government and policy, not the individuals who died)? If the answer is 1 then you should seriously look at your own motives. If it is merely because you don’t think he is a ‘true muslim’ or some-such thing, then I really don’t think anyone outside of Mundine and Allah can really know the truth, nor is it their business. If 2, then it is understandable, but it seems that only a small amount of the anger is directed at this point. Shouldn’t the misinformation he has been given, or those who painted him as a role model and put him on the spot also shoulder the blame. Seems strange that he is attacked for talking politics when he didn’t bring the topic up, shouldn’t the interviewer be to blame for talking politics with a boxer? If 3 then it is fair enough to disagree with him. But the anger expressed is astounding. And, in all the name calling and vitriol published here, I have not seen one valid argument showing why his opinion is wrong. If you truly believe that American foreign policy over the last, say, 50 years has been faultless and no cause for retaliation – please give your argument. There is no way that terrorism is justified but I’m sure it wasn’t planned on a whim. Isn’t the right to an opinion and free speech the very thing the ‘Western World’ is trying to uphold in the "war against terrorism"? Perhaps, according to the knockers on this forum, those rights should only be given to those who toe the line, all else should remain silent or lie when asked a direct question? If Mundine had said that he supported the Americans in the war on terrorism would the knockers have written a post congratulating him? TB
 

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
109,860
Warlock:
You started by launching an attack at me. Admittedly, you caught me on the tail end of a torrent of abusive emails but I make no apology for giving you a bit back.
Take this anyway you like but IMO, you lack the ability to debate things in a sensitive and rational manner. This is best illustrated by the fact that you can'tsee your 'figure of speech' about chundering on someone as being potentially offensive.
I say your comments were half-cocked, because they were. Perhaps I should have said 'mentally ill-equipped' but that's not the sort of thing I would say because it might have been seen as going a bit too far. If anything, half-cocked was an understandment. You have no idea of the contents of these emails but seem to think it's OK defend these maniacs. I've already mentioned the death threats... are you supporting this view? No need to answer that because I'm sure you don't. At best, I'd say that you didn't think thingsthrough too well.
If you want to gracefully back peddle out of the argument while still trying to save face, then that's fine by me.
That is, you're more than welcomed to continue this but as far I'm concerned, the matter is over.
IMO, it's time to re-wax the duck's back and get with more important things.

 
Messages
22
T.B
I totally Agree with you mate. You articulated your point very well.
I grieve for those who died, but as a nation...as the saying goes" as you sow, so shall you reap.
As an american (which I am) I would be asking "what did we do to make somebody hate us this much"? Rather than "lets kill the bastards"!
Having taught Sanskrit in Cambodia at a University in Phom Penh I experienced first hand the dislike of America by a forgien culture. Their dislike for America stems from the fact that more bombs were dropped on cambodia than during the whole Second World War, and America was not even at war with them!
I do not agree with inncoent people dying in the attack on the Twin Towers, but I can totally understand why people would hate America.
Cambodia is just an example from my own experience but I can imagine that in alot of countries this is the case.
 
Messages
377
T.B, I haven't commented on what Mundine had to say, but I find it amazing that anyone would wander why so many people are anti-Mundine. The reason for the massive reaction to Mundine's comments is because of the way that he has conducted himself over a long periord of time. In the past week alone, he has been quoted as referring to white people as "crackers", as saying "It wouldn't matter if he was Jesus Christ, I will still whip him", and now, his comments about what happened in America. While I doubt that the reaction would have been as large for someone without Mundine's track record, it should be noted that he has been rebuked by Muslim leaders andprominent Aboriginal figures, in addition to foreigners (who know very little about him), which suggests that the reaction is not purely based on the fact that it was Mundine who said it.
As for your comments about free speech - I find them baffling. Mundine has every right to his opinion. So do the members of this forum. They are allowed disagree with him, just as he is allowed to publicly disrespect "the immortals" of rugby league, and make offensive remarks about religious figures.

With regards to the interviewer being at fault for asking Mundine the question - I find that laughable. Mundine lives off the media. He uses it to promote himself and put his views across. He has, on numerous occasions, mentioned the fact that he is a Muslim. He chose to promote his religous beliefs and make them public knowledge. The interviewer was quite within his rights to ask the question. On the other hand, Mundine did not have to answer the way he did. He did not have to answer at all. You can make all the excuses in the world for him, but it doesn't change the fact that he said what he did (whether or not you agree or disagree with what he said), and he, therefore, should take full responsibility for what he said.

Finally, you make reference to him being painted as a role model. You are right. He has been painted as a role model - by himself, on many occasions.

 

imported_T.B

Juniors
Messages
25
Mystery Man, going to rehash a few other replies here so if you read the other forums you might have seen some of this before (also some of the points were in direct response to other forums) T.B, I haven't commented on what Mundine had to say, but I find it amazing that anyone would wander why so many people are anti-Mundine. The reason for the massive reaction to Mundine's comments is because of the way that he has conducted himself over a long periord of time. In the past week alone, he has been quoted as referring to white people as "crackers", as saying "It wouldn't matter if he was Jesus Christ, I will still whip him", and now, his comments about what happened in America. While I doubt that the reaction would have been as large for someone without Mundine's track record, it should be noted that he has been rebuked by Muslim leaders and prominent Aboriginal figures, in addition to foreigners (who know very little about him), which suggests that the reaction is not purely based on the fact that it was Mundine who said it. I understand why people don’t like Mundine but this issue seems to have been blown out of all proportion (and often biasing their analysis based on personal opinion of the man, not the argument). There would have been <u>no</u> reaction if it was anyone with a lower profile. The perception by the public that Mundine is a spokesperson for Muslims and Aborigines resulted in their rebuke. If the resentment for Mundine had already not been pushed by the media, would the story have left our shores? If Mundine truly thinks he is a spokesperson for Muslims then it’s probably a flaw. If someone perceives him to be the spokesperson for Muslims then it is their flaw. Does anyone actually believe that all Muslims and Aborigines feel the same way as Mundine? If not, there is no problem As for your comments about free speech - I find them baffling. Mundine has every right to his opinion. So do the members of this forum. They are allowed disagree with him, just as he is allowed to publicly disrespect "the immortals" of rugby league, and make offensive remarks about religious figures. I agree and don’t remember saying otherwise, but many feel that personal attacks on Mundine are warranted when disagreement would do. Mundine has given reasons for his view why Australia should not get involved but those who disagree seem to rely on the general perception that he is wrong, and are using bias (from his other actions) to judge his statement. The reason people are outraged must stem from the fact that they don’t like what he said – I’m still waiting to hear why they think his opinion is wrong, ie the 1,2,3. With regards to the interviewer being at fault for asking Mundine the question - I find that laughable. Mundine lives off the media. He uses it to promote himself and put his views across. He has, on numerous occasions, mentioned the fact that he is a Muslim. He chose to promote his religous beliefs and make them public knowledge. The interviewer was quite within his rights to ask the question. My point was based on the argument that he should stay away from politics, he did not bring the topic up thus it can’t be said that he instigated the issue. This was probably based on something said on another forum. On the other hand, Mundine did not have to answer the way he did. He did not have to answer at all. You can make all the excuses in the world for him, but it doesn't change the fact that he said what he did (whether or not you agree or disagree with what he said), and he, therefore, should take full responsibility for what he said. That is what I don’t get. People would have others silenced rather than have them speak a contrary opinion (even you said he has the right to his opinion). Why does it bother you so much that he said what he said? Would the world have been a better pace and the ‘war’ over if he had remained quiet? Would he be a better person if he believed (what he said) but in actual fact did not say it? Why should he face punishment (ie "should take full responsibility) for expressing such an opinion? The only person <u>really</u> affected by this is Mundine himself, through the potential boxing bans (you have the freedom of speech but if you use it you WILL be punished). Wasn’t it Les Darcy who faced similar opposition during one of the wars (not for what he said though) – with hindsight, was it justified? Anyone else affected either supports his views but feels that he has hurt that argument with his manner of speaking, OR opposes the view but has such a low self belief that any counter argument throws them way off balance. Finally, you make reference to him being painted as a role model. You are right. He has been painted as a role model - by himself, on many occasions. See my first response paragraph, and IMHO he still is - a self-confident, athletic, non drinking, non smoking, religious young man who believes in telling the truth, and being himself,regardless of what the public and media pressure want. TB
 
Messages
377
I understand why people don’t like Mundine but this issue seems to have been blown out of all proportion (and often biasing their analysis based on personal opinion of the man, not the argument). There would have been <u>no</u> reaction if it was anyone with a lower profile. - I agree, but, as Mundine is a public figure, of course his comments will have a media reaction. The perception by the public that Mundine is a spokesperson for Muslims and Aborigines resulted in their rebuke. - I don't agree with that. I believe it is because people don't like Mundine, period. I don't believe that his race or religion is the reason. If the resentment for Mundine had already not been pushed by the media, would the story have left our shores? - I believe that the only reason that the story left our shores is because Mundine is fighting for a world title. If he was still a league player, its international coverage would have been much smaller. If Mundine truly thinks he is a spokesperson for Muslims then it’s probably a flaw. If someone perceives him to be the spokesperson for Muslims then it is their flaw. Does anyone actually believe that all Muslims and Aborigines feel the same way as Mundine? If not, there is no problem. - I only perceive Mundine to be a spokesman for himself. I don't know what other people think. I agree and don’t remember saying otherwise, but many feel that personal attacks on Mundine are warranted when disagreement would do. - I was referring to your comment suggesting that people believed that everybody "should toe the line". People can respond any way that they like. I'm not saying that I agree or disagree with what people have said, just that they, like Mundine, have the choice to say what they want. Mundine has given reasons for his view why Australia should not get involved but those who disagree seem to rely on the general perception that he is wrong, and are using bias (from his other actions) to judge his statement. The reason people are outraged must stem from the fact that they don’t like what he said – I’m still waiting to hear why they think his opinion is wrong, ie the 1,2,3. - Fair enough. I'm not involved in this part of the debate. My point was based on the argument that he should stay away from politics, he did not bring the topic up thus it can’t be said that he instigated the issue. This was probably based on something said on another forum. - Fair enough, but I stand by my comments that he must take responsibility for what he said, and not blame the interviewer for asking the question. That is what I don’t get. People would have others silenced rather than have them speak a contrary opinion (even you said he has the right to his opinion). Why does it bother you so much that he said what he said? Would the world have been a better pace and the ‘war’ over if he had remained quiet? Would he be a better person if he believed (what he said) but in actual fact did not say it? Why should he face punishment (ie "should take full responsibility) for expressing such an opinion? - I never said anything about what Mundine said. What I was saying was that Mundine is responsible for his comments- not the interviewer. It was his choice to say what he did. The interviewer was not at fault for asking the question. The only person <u>really</u> affected by this is Mundine himself, through the potential boxing bans (you have the freedom of speech but if you use it you WILL be punished). Wasn’t it Les Darcy who faced similar opposition during one of the wars (not for what he said though) – with hindsight, was it justified? - I don't know anything about Les Darcy. Anyone else affected either supports his views but feels that he has hurt that argument with his manner of speaking, OR opposes the view but has such a low self belief that any counter argument throws them way off balance. - Hey, that's your opinion. I haven't been arguing about what Mundine actually said. Rather, I've been commenting on why people reacted in the way that they did. I agree that Mundine's past comments, on unrelated issues, have led people to react in a stronger fashion than if somebody else had said what he did. My point is that it is hardly surprising, and Mundine has built this reputation for himself. See my first response paragraph, and IMHO he still is - a self-confident, athletic, non drinking, non smoking, religious young man who believes in telling the truth, and being himself,regardless of what the public and media pressure want. - To be honest, while I agree that Mundine usually speaks his mind, I find it very hard to believe that Mundine believes that he is telling the truth when he says that he proved himself to be the world's best rugby league player. I, personally, find that very hard to comprehend. I have never spoken to one person who agrees that he even came close. I also can't agree on him being a good role model. I don't care if he talks himself up - I usually just laugh. What I don't like is when he disrespects other people, other religions, and uses racially derogatory terms, in the process. I don't find it very impressive, at all.
 
Messages
4,446
I think that we are missing the essence of the argument here...
Mundine said "The americans had this coming" (or words to that effect) Either way, lets look at it. He made a highly controversial statement that people could have interpreted as him somehow 'justifying' the terror attacks. There is no room for interpretation there from where im sitting. He made that comment, he always goes off and blames the media for twisting the story, but make no mistake, he said those words! He should be blaming his tounge. He is a public figure, and statements that public figures make are always going to hold more weight then an everyday joe. He made a big mistake, and no, i dont think it was blown out of all proportion at the time...
But on the other hand, if he said things in a different way then perhaps i would have agreed. America and its people MUST realise WHY alot of people hate them. It irks me beyond believe to turn on american cable channels and have commentators in the US asking....why do they hate us?? It absolutely irks me...They have interferred in world politics for so long, of course they should expect to create a multitude of enemies. They don't learn from their mistakes...
Im in no way condoning the attacks. But as Tanae said, i can also understand why America is hated. Perhaps if they looked at that a bit more instead of asking dumb questions then they might get somewhere...
And yes, i also agree with Mundine that war should never be an option....The pen (and the mouth) will always be more effective then a sword (and a gun)...
MFC.
 

imported_T.B

Juniors
Messages
25
Mystery Man, I think I am misunderstanding your points a bit. I'm saying that the response he is getting is undeserved over this incident whetherpeople like him or not, but I'll try and respond

Out of proportion - other analysts have said similar things about the American angle but did not recieve the same level of hatred - bias from preconcieved ideas??

Rebuke - I meant he was rebuked by Aboriginal and Muslim groups as he is seen as a spokespeerson - not as the reason for the public rebuke.

I wasn't sayingeveryone should 'toe the line', but many were saying that Mundine should have kept quiet - a don't rock the boat attitude

Continuing on this topic,yes I believe he should take responsibility for what he said but he should not have to take the unjustified reaction for what he said.Would the world have been any different if he had kept his mouth shut? If not, is the amount of fuss really warranted?

I think the rest is mererly our differing opinions

MFC - Is the case you propose and what Mundine said, in essence,really thatdifferent? As much as his statement was a 'justification' so was your argument. Although you seem to have been blessed with the gift of expression and the time to write a reply. Sure he really didn't express himself well, but surely everone should at least have a grasp of what he was implying (if not, then the publics knowledge of the history of theincident is really sad and more of a case for media concern). - And is anyone deserving the level of scorn he has faced for the crime of poor expression.

I don't know if anyone here still reads the 'other boards' but most of my arguemnts are there in the Boxing and Dragons section. I'll try and continue the arguments here and there but won't have as much time as today (sick day).

TB
Excuse the spelling (no spellcheck)
 

Latest posts

Top